Any success stories and ideas for secondary infertility?

[Annabellaboo]

Hello ladies.
I am hoping to get some ideas and support on here.
I am 35 years old, very healthy with a 3 year DS. We have been trying to conceive our second child for 2 years now. I became pregnant very easily with my first and had an easy pregnancy.
This time nothing.
I have had all the tests the nhs provides. Progesterone normal, I ovulate, DH sperm count is normal, no blockages etc etc. I have tried charting, ov sticks, changed my already pretty healthy diet (cut out refined sugars and have lots more greens etc, and alkalised my body). I take advised supplements and have even tried acupuncture.
I do however have short cycles, sometimes as short as 21 days but averaging 24. This is a little shorter than I had before my DS.
We cannot afford IVF and I am not sure I can face that anyway.
My consultant last month has prescribed me a half dose (25mg) of clomid, which a scan showed on the first round it definitely boosted things even more with a good few mature follicles. I already ovulate but she thought as my cycles are quite short and a little irregular it may give me a boost.
I have been convinced several times I was pregnant (oh how cruel our bodies and brains can be!) but AF always turns up.
I guess what I am asking is does anyone have any other suggestions of things I could try or why I can't conceive time. I am open to theories and alternative methods.
Any experience in this subject and success stories please share.
I try not to stress about it all, but some months it just really gets you down as there is no real 'reason'. The hard thing is watching other mums around get pregnant multiple times so easily.
Thank you for listening!
Anna

[Imnotacelebgetmeouttahere]

Hi, just a quick post then I'll catch up on thread but title asked for success stories of secondary infertility ... We tried 7yrars after dc1 - first 3 were filled with miscarriages sadly ", next 4 years - just nothing all my tests came back fine, dh all fine - eventually they gave me a laparoscopy to check for any damage - all clear. I fell pregnant the following week! Fertility doc suggested " the pipes just needed a clear out " - probably lod of tosh but we went on to have a further 3 in quick succession. Fingers crossed!

[Annabellaboo]

Rose, you literally had me laughing out loud about your google searches! Sounds exactly like me! I swear if someone read my google searches they would think I was a crazy person! 😖
Your poor husband with the flu thorough your fertile widow, that must have been real fun! My DH sometimes looks at me with dread toward the end of my fertile week as he works a lot so is very tired! It's a lot of pressure for them and not always as fun as they would have thought.
Yes I am in the uk and all my tests have been with the NHS.

[closephine85]

Rose - I probably confused you. I have been taking progesterone which delays AF - so I tested on day 14 of the 2ww and it was negative but didn't get AF for another couple of days. I'm in the uk but not on the mainland so we aren't nhs where I live. It means there is no Ivf funding where I am even for those with primary infertility and it also means we will have to travel to the uk, most likely London if/when we have Ivf. We do however seem to be allowed any test we ask for (I've had AMH and FSH done) and also 6 rounds of IUI but unfortunately with my DHs low count, IUI is not of much help to us.

Iamnotaceleb - thanks for sharing. Glad to hear you had success in the end. I have a laparoscopy in a couple of weeks - hoping for a miracle now after reading your story!

Anna - don't worry, my google search history would also have me carted off to the looney bin! "My big toe feels numb, could I pregnant/is this a sign of infertility?" (Ok slight exaggeration but not far off!)

[Rose8282]

So so good to hear I'm not alone with the crazy googling. I think my DH worries about me when he opens the laptop and sees what I've been reading sometimes!

That makes sense, now, about the progesterone, Closephine, I did try and read through all the chat history but obviously missed a fair bit.That's amazing you get offered 6 rounds of IUI on the NHS where you are, I don't think we get any here (for secondary infertility that is) here in London, though I haven't seen a specialist yet so may be wrong.

I went out for dinner with a few mum friends last night, there was a lot of chat about their 2nd babies and one of them is pregnant. Funny, when I'm in the 2ww I feel a lot more able to deal with it than when I'm in the first 2 weeks of my cycle, is that the same for you? I'm not sure if it's because you have a teeny bit of hope.

Starting to get a bit anxious now expected AF day is approaching though, eurgh.

[Raeside]

Hi there - may I join?

We have a nearly 3yr old DS conceived 9 months after I stopped taking the pill, and really without properly trying. We are now 2yrs down the road of trying for #2 and I'm getting a bit anxious as I'm 42 come July and don't really feel I should push it after that birthday comes around.

I've had the day 21 progesterone test - normal - and the general hormone tests which show everything is normal, I'm not pre-menopausal thank goodness!

I had an ERPC at 11 weeks last August and since then my cycles have varied between 26-32 days (was previously very dull at 28 days every month) and OV sticks are never very definitely positive.

I've lost 7kg to get to a healthier weight after putting that much on in only 5 months post-ERPC. Lord it was scary fast! Anyway since the ERPC I've just been sure things aren't right, confirmed by a chemical preg/v early MC in November.

So I have a 2nd appt with GP next week and was wondering whether to ask for Clomid? Or whether to just go private and try IUI?

What do you think?

It's been so helpful to read your experiences via this thread - thank you!

[Icklemariposa01]

Hey all,
Raeside. Our stories are fairly similar! Except that we have been trying for a year. I will be 42 in March and my child will be three next month.

I haven't gone down the blood test, tubes test etc route yet. DH I have had a scan and everything okay there. Ovulating okay.

I am just about to start The Week but things are just sending me in to a tailspin now. Everyone is getting pregnant. Even next door are. Their DD is same age as mine and they are having twins! I have been close to tears lately anyway but I suppose this news was the tipping point where I did to DH that maybe it's now time to accept that this is it. And he said that I mustn't lose hope, not give up, to believe. But I said "that's the thing baby, I am beginning to believe it's not going to happen"

I hate the position that we are all in. That other people say that we have no right to complain because at least we have one. Which of course is true but it does not make at all any easier.

All I feel is heartbreak now. I feel like I have let down my DD for being an only child. I blame myself for not trying earlier. What was I thinking at my age to wait, get to be myself again and then try. What a gamble.

This girl at work who has had her 2nd, about a year ago said relax, don't think about it. Fk off, you are not even 35 yet! If I relax and forget about it I simply won't have sex, it ain't happening! I can't relax at my age. This is it! My last chance salon and it's actually quite devastating!

Sometime I feel empty, disconnected. Both in my mind and physically because when The Witch comes (love that!!) I literally am EMPTY.

So in tears I am talking to my hubby and then we realise that DD has got out of her bed and in to ours so now I have changed into my pjs and have her I bed next to me writing away.

I just feel so numb, is that very drama queen of me......

[Annabellaboo]

Hi ladies. Nice to see lots joining in for support. Raeside- it might be worth at least asking about clomid if you think your ovulation could be weak or not perhaps every month. Have you only ever used the sticks for testing ovulation? Might be worth investing in the clearblue one with the smiley face. It's a bit expensive but will last at least a couple months if you know roughly your ovulation window. It gives you a very clear answer about when and if you ovulate.
Rose- that's interesting that you find the first 2 weeks easier to deal with than the 2ww. I am the total opposite! The anticipation of the last 2 weeks and the hormones flying around drives me insane, where as at the beginning of my cycle I feel in control and like I don't have to think about the result for a while and just keep hopeful and trying.
Ickle- sorry you are feeling so low and empty as you put it. I have definitely had plenty of those moments, they come and go but it's horrid when you feel that way. I am 35 so technically it should be easier, but it's been 2 years and nothing with no explanation why. I am at times starting to loose hope even though I technically have time. I believe I have tried everything and nothing has worked so I am convinced it can't happen naturally for me. Is IVF and option for you? Also, have you tried any other alternative treatments such as accupuncture? I hear it can be successful for many women. I didn't get pregnant with my treatment, but it did help me relax and it did help my cycles get a bit more on track. I would have continued but it was getting v expensive so I decided to stop after 3 months.
I am currently on day 22 of my cycle, period due probably in about 5-6 days if it is the same as last month on clomid. I am resisting testing. I don't have many possible symptons and I don't trust them anyway even if I do as I have been down that road many a time and always a BPN.

[Rose8282]

Bummer, AF came today. And after all our efforts whilst DH was ill with the flu- so much for that! Getting a little bit disconcerted that cycle was only 26 days this month (and 25 days 2 months ago) and hoping this doesn't mean anything.

Nice to hear from you both, Raeside and Icklemariposa, and sorry to hear of your troubles too. Raeside- I guess it's encouraging that you managed to get pregnant last November, albeit that must have been awful, but nevertheless hopefully a good sign. I would definitely ask the GP to refer you to a specialist, (or go private if you prefer) as this usually takes a few months, and then if no luck by then, they can consider your options.

Icklemariposa, I feel like this has brought out the 'drama queen' in me I never thought I had! It's so hard going through the ups and downs of hope and despair month after month- I don't think anyone who hasn't been through it can quite understand- I certainly didn't understand before and feel quite bad about some things I said when I was pregnant with my first that may have sounded quite insensitive to someone TTC (eg. it happened on the very first try!) Eurgh.

I've realised over the past couple of months that it could be quite easy to get a little depressed (for me certainly) about all this, and am trying hard to fight the sadness. Seeing a hypnotherapist next week which I'm hoping will help that, I certainly don't think she will get me pregnant through hypnotherapy alone, but at least feeling a bit more relaxed/happy should help surely!

Good vibes to you all
(PS. HATE it when people tell me I just need to relax!)

[Annabellaboo]

Hi everyone. I just wanted to check in and mention my latest quest! I have decided to give up gluten. I have read several articles that shows research into gluten sensitivity and unexplained infertility. I have had a couple signs in the last couple years that perhaps gluten isn't my best friend so want to cut it out anyway. Just wanted to share a potential thing to try if anyone wants to. I figure anything is worth a try when you are in our situation. Give it a google if you are curious and read about the evidence. It's interesting and as I have literally tried everything and my fertility is totally unexplained I think it's worth exploring for me. Any thoughts let me know!
I am due on my period any day. Pretty sure I'm not pregnant but of course it' that's time when there is always that little bit of hope. Praying for a little miracle.
Closephine have you had your laparoscopy yet?

[closephine85]

Hi everyone

Welcome to the new ladies. Sorry you find yourselves here too :( babies and pregnancies everywhere for me too at the moment. I don't know if I just notice them more or if there genuinely is a baby boom I'm not a part of!?

Anna - thanks for asking after me - laparoscopy is on Tuesday as long as there are no emergencies in which case I would have to be cancelled. I'm hoping for a miracle - a piece of tissue in the spot where implantation occurs that they can clear or something like that! I suppose the best case scenario is they find nothing though and we can accept then that we have male factor infertility.

I eat mainly gluten free and have done for about a year and a half now. It wasn't for fertility reasons - I used to get very bloated and would get shooting pains across my middle. These symptoms have stopped since going gf although I do fall off the wagon fairly regularly when a piece of cake is too tempting but I largely stick to it, particularly when It comes to pasta and bread. If you want any tips, always toast the bread, warm up rolls etc as they are not nice straight from the packet. The best make for gf food I have found to be the genius brand - they do bread, pain chocolat, their crumpets are yum and pita breads! Pasta wise, I go for the brown rice pasta rather than gluten free - much nicer! You can buy it in waitrose, not too sure where else.

[Annabellaboo]

Hi closephine. Thanks for the gluten free product tips, especially the brown rice pasta that sounds great I will check it out. Really hope you get some answers on Tuesday- good luck!
I am on day 28 of my 2nd round of clomid. I couldn't resist testing today as AF started on day 28 last cycle. It was negative which I did expect but I am still gutted 😐 I haven't really had many symptons apart from being super tired and having headaches, but I believe that's side effects I'm having from the clomid. I was still hoping to be surprised and just maybe the clomid did the trick. Feeling blue but will look to the next cycle and try to remain positive. Just want AF to start now so I can move on.
Let me know how you get on Tuesday, will be thinking of you.

[Rose8282]

Oh sorry to hear that, Annabella. It's nigh impossible not to get hopes up, regardless, so it's always a bummer when AF does come. I hope you're feeling a bit better and more hopeful now. I have spent the weekend with friends and their new babies, intense! DH and I have planned a weekend away together this weekend (DD with my parents), I kind of timed it around when I thought I'd be fertile, but I think it's a bit mistimed now my AF came earlier than expected this cycle! Anyway, it'll be lovely to relax nevertheless without a two year old waking us at 6am!
I also have my first hypnotherapy session this evening. Bit nervous- she asked me to fill in a questionnaire about myself and it was literally like writing a biography of my life, no stone left unturned. Not quite sure why she needed to know quite so much, but we shall see.

Closephine- jusy realised your laparoscopy must be today, hope it all goes well, thinking of you too.

[closephine85]

Hiya ladies

Anna, so sorry to hear you've had a negative :( has AF arrived yet or is it being delayed again? It's so cruel that these drugs delay AF, it's like another added headf&&)k pardon my language!

Rose - how does hypnotherapy work? Do you actually end up semi concious like you see on tv? I could do with some to curb my anxiety but I'm just not sure!

Thanks for your well wishes - my op was yesterday and everything looks fine. I was a bit freaked for about 3 hours between op and seeing the doc as I'd heard them say in recovery that I'd had an endometrial biopsy. The word biopsy drove my anxious brain crazy but apparently it's just done as standard whilst there in there and they didn't see anything suspicious.

We are now as a crossroads - before my op the consultant was quite upbeat and said 'you're only young, we want to avoid Ivf if possible' however when I queried it based on DHs poor results, he had a look at them and seemed pretty concerned that they have been dropping each time. He then started saying to plug on with Ivf as soon as possible and that if they've gone down again when he's tested again next week we may even want to freeze some :( :(

So.... Our plan is now just one more IUI next month as its too soon to start the ball rolling on Ivf now and then to pluck up the courage to go for Ivf in April. Not sure if I've mentioned before but I like the ethos of create fertility in London so need to get on with the research, phone calls etc.

[closephine85]

Oh, I've also been trying to treat this month as a kind of 'control' cycle as I know I'm definitely not pregnant. So waiting to see which symptoms I get in the run up to AF to see which ones are genuine AF symptoms. It's been so long that I haven't been looking for pregnancy symptoms that I have forgotten. I ovulated last Friday and so far nothing.

[Annabellaboo]

Hi closephine, thanks for letting us know how you got on. Glad you are back home safe and sound. You must be relieved it's over and now you can move onto the next stage for you. At least that wait is over!
My period started the day after I tested of course! It wad a 29 days cycle so it seems the clomid had lengthened my cycle. I will have to wait and see what happens with it this month now I am stopping talking it.
Yes you mentioned the Create IVF clinic, I had a little look and agree it does sound like a good approach.
I can't remember if you said your husband has taken various male fertility boosting vitamins? I am sure you have been through it all! I am currently trying to prompt my husband to take some supplements. All seems to be fine on his part but I figure any extra boost can't hurt!

[ClaraBorne]

This advice might be too simplistic but I had problems conceiving my 2nd child. I did some research and there were lots of recommendations for a book called 'Taking Charge of your fertility by Toni Weschler but I bought the wrong one, instead I bought 'Take charge of your fertility' by Heather Welford. * It doesn't get as good reviews to be honest.

Anyway, there was a bit in it called the recipe for making a baby and it was all to do with having sex a certain number of days (5 I think) before you ovulated as the older the sperm the better (there was a bit more to I than that but that was the gist of it)

We followed it and it worked for us (well, I say that, who knows?), I was 43 at the time.

[closephine85]

Anna - yes DH takes all the vitamins under the sun and has been doing for about 6 months. He has his next analysis on Tuesday, would love to find out they've worked and boosted his count but not got a whole lot of hope unfortunately. Do you take any vitamins? I've tried various ones over the last 2 years but have currently stopped everything... Might start up the b vitamins and coenzyme q10 again though for our last month of IUI.

I'm having a wobble about Ivf. It's so much money and I just wonder if we should be happy with our lot?! Save our money for ds' future and also spend some of it vaccinating him against meningitis B rather than portentously waste it chasing a dream... HELP

[closephine85]

Portentously?! What does that even mean! Supposed to say potentially :)

[Annabellaboo]

Haha I was wondering what portentously meant too!
That is v frustrating about DH sperm count especially when he is doing all he can, it must be hard on him too I imagine. Hopefully there will be some improvement.
Yes I take all sorts of supplements I could open a health food shop judging by my cupboards!
Currently taking pregnancy support vitamins (with lots of folic acid), vitamin B complex, vit C, B12, probiotic & zinc as well a morning power one greens. My husband sometimes looks at me like I have lost the plot! It is also really expensive as I have been pretty much consistent with most of these for the last year. I do believe they helped promote a healthier me this year so I keep going in the comfort that I at least feel I am doing my bit to take control of my health and fertility. The reiki has been really interesting I have to say. It's amazing the things it brings up and you can't help but realise just how much is going on in different parts of our bodies and minds. The woman I see is wonderful and I am feeling lots happier and more positive since starting the treatment. Just about life if general not just fertility related.
I can understand your hesitation with going down the IVF route. I feel exactly the same. I always said (before having difficulties) that I wouldn't go down that route if we couldn't have a baby as if it's not meant to be blah blah... But when you are faced with a different reality that you expected that question changes. I still don't want to do it for many reasons, but when I think of my DS not having a sibling and that hole I feel will be in our lives without that 2nd child, I can't help but consider IVF. I am not at that point yet and I hope I don't have to come to it, but it's in the back of my mind of course.
I am going to a birthday party today of a boy who's mum has 3 under 5 year olds and another on the way! lots of other mum friends with there babies etc will be there too, but I am feeling better about things so think it won't bother me so much today (I hope!) The thing that has started to bother me though is some other mum friends reactions to me now. I am an open person and most of the people I spend time with know of our difficultly conceiving this time. Recently I have noticed no one asks me about it. I have stopped talking about it and no one askes how I am getting on etc. I get it, they probably feel bad as they sit there with there newest addition or their bump and don't want to remind me of what I don't have. (As if I could forget!!) I just feel is they were good friends they would ask how I am doing etc but in a very reserved British fashion they seem to do the opposite. I think I find this hard as a woman who needs support from the people around me and it makes me sad that our our society can be so afraid to have to deal with some real emotions from someone. I am by no means someone who feels sorry for myself of goes on about things so I find it disappointing that I now feel alone around my mum friends as they clearly don't know what to say.
I think that's one of the reasons I reached out on here. I do luckily have other amazing non mum friends who are there for me so I am lucky.
Sorry that was a long waffle!
Have a lovely weekend xx

[Katymac32]

Thanks closephine85 for recommending this thread- I posted this in the wrong thread oops!

I'm a little late to the conversation but it's nice (for want of a better word!) to see I'm not alone in this. I have a 2.5 year old and have been trying for 18 months.

My first born was conceived quickly after 3 months but we have since discovered my husbands sperm has dropped hugely in 3 years- 70 million to 9 million. I guess at least we have a reason but it's quite gobsmacking as we are far more healthier than we were three years ago. I have had the bloods and ultrasound and so far so normal. We have been referred to a fertility clinic where I guess I'll get the next round of investigations. I had quite a traumatic birth with an emergency c section so maybe something there.

We are going to try ivf once we have been through the fertility appointments but at an absolute push we can only afford one round.

I really hope we all get there in the end X

[closephine85]

Hi ladies

Anna - how did the party go? I totally get your apprehension but hope it was ok. I find only having one child makes me feel oddly inferior. Do you get this? I honestly think it is in my own head and that my friends are not secretly judging me but I still find it hard. I have a meal coming up with all the other mums at my sons nursery - they all either have more than one child or are pregnant with their second. I'm also younger than most of them (30) and it makes me feel like a double failure that my relatively young body is failing me! Oh, how is the GF diet going too? I fell off the wagon on Saturday and had a huge slice of pizza :(

Katy - glad you've found us! Sorry you had to go round the houses a bit to get here :) we are in a similar boat with the semen analyses... DHs seems to be rapidly decreasing. He has another tomorrow and we will be nervously awaiting the results over the next couple of weeks. Has your DH been referred to a urologist at all? I wonder if rather than jumping to Ivf we should try and have DHs issue investigated first. The trouble is, Ivf technically bypasses the issue and there's nothing to say after spending the money on investigations it wouldn't be fixable anyway!?

Does anyone know if there are screening tests you can have to check the actual quality of your eggs? I've had my AMH and FSH levels checked and they were ok (AMH at the low end of normal for my age) but nothing to actually say whether my eggs are actually ok. Just another thing I'm wondering about pre Ivf... Even if it's pricey it might be worth knowing I'm not wasting our time with Ivf.

As you can probably tell from this post, my head is still all over the place right now.

[Chattycat78]

Hi guys- just following the thread and discovered that the one useful thing i can do is answer the above question. There is NO test for egg quality. It is assumed that if you have less eggs (determined by amh/fhs) then you have worse quality ones. However this is not necessarily the case. The best egg quality test is age but this doesn't guarantee anything. There are things you can do to improve your egg quality though- eg supplements/diet. Hope this helps!

[closephine85]

Hi ChattyCat, thanks for letting me know - that's a shame! :( I have been reading wonderful things about coenzyme q10 for egg quality and have been taking that. I'd also read eating a lot of eggs (ironic!) can help.

[Chattycat78]

Yeah co enzyme is the big one. Especially if you take it as ubiquinol- It's more concentrated. I bought some from Amazon. The book "it starts with the egg" is worth a look if you haven't already.

[Rose8282]

Hi girls,

It's interesting hearing you guys talk about how it feels being the only one with one child, I totally feel the same way. Up until recently it felt like all my friends only had the one, and suddenly EVERYONE has either just given birth or is pregnant with their second. Gets to the point where I kind of dread making contact with some of my friends as I'm just waiting to get the next pregnancy announcement. Three of my closest friends have just had their seconds.

On a positive note, I'm trying to be optimistic this month- it's our last month trying before we see the specialist. DH and I went away for the weekend leaving my little girl with the grandparents, and feel like we gave it our damdest! God how I would love to go back to life where you get to have sex when you want it only!!

I also have my second appointment with the hypnotherapist on Wednesday. It was quite weird, I have to say, but saying that, very relaxing and makes me feel like I'm actually doing something productive. It was kind of like an incredibly deep meditation, parts of it were quite freakily euphoric, and other parts I was getting a little bored. I don't know, it's quite expensive, and I think I'll only have one or two more sessions, but will let you know how wednesday goes.

Closephine- I'm glad the laporoscopy went smoothly, did they put you to sleep for it? I'm guessing that was done on the NHS right? Sorry to hear about your DH's sperm count, I really hope the next one is better, keeping my fingers crossed for you.

Katy, nice to have another addition to the group, and sorry you have also had to go through all this. Isn't it crazy how sperm count can drop so quickly, it makes you think that maybe it could equally go up that quickly again?!
Let us know how you get on with the rest of your investigations.