Venables - one of the James Bulger killers - back in jail

[LadyBlaBlah]

here

Not a good advertisement for the rehabilitation programme they went on. I did hear that it was in Ireland and he tried to strangle a girlfriend..........but obviously that is not based on any factual evidence, just internet gossip.

Anyhow, difficult difficult difficult

How can they be rehabilitated after such a crime?

How the Hell did the press get to know about this, poor bloke.

here's hoping that it's something very minor and he is back out to carry on with his life soon.

I doubt Jamies mother has been able to carry on with her life knowing this lad poured paint in her baby's eyes and pushed batteries into his anus.
It wouldn't be something minor, people released on tag/license and bail disappear for months on end before anyone catches up with them and put them back in prison, so whilst we don't know what it is he's done I very much doubt it's not signing in at the right time.

Because they were 10 yo children with extremely difficult backgrounds when they committed the crime.
One would hope that years and years of intense rehabilitation could, hopefully, have some effect.

Big wig on the radio this morning said that it is unlikely it is something and nothing as it has resulted in the case and Venables himself being thrown back into the limelight, which is something they obviously would want to avoid and would have been able to avoid for something petty. He also said that the secrecy would be so as not to influence any court proceedings.

And Lou raises a very good point, why the hell should their partners be kept in the dark?

One might hope that years of rehabilitation and therapy would help but I fear the damage was already done.

They were lacking love and care in their early years. No amount of therapy can give them their childhood back.

I have heard rumour too that Thompsons rehabilitation had been more successful despite him being reputedly being the more "evil" one when the crime was committed.

Breach of licence conditions could be a whole host of things, he may have gone somewhere he shouldn't, or been involved in petty crime, have smoked some weed, a range of stuff.

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand I'm inclined to agree with wannabe, they were ten, they were the result of emotionally (poss physically) abusive up bringing and deserve a chance at rehabilitation.

However, I've worked with some children who've done pretty horrific things, and some of them I woudl be frightened to hear of they were ever free again. it's unlikely as the majority of them are in special hospitals not prison and are unlikely to get off their sections, ever, but there's one in particular who would go on to commit further crimes of a similar nature. He's beyond rehabilitation imo.

I also have worked with some of the professionals who assessed them and came into contact with them and their opinion is divided too.

That was to Elsewhere btw

Milly, these are not teenage joyriders with tags, they committed one of the most infamous crimes of our time. I would imagine the terms of their licence were complex and strictly enforced.

of course they can be rehabilitated. But - YAWNarama - obviously this gives all the people with the 'stone them' mentality an opportunity to post bile and mawkish stuff.

sigh.

There's no point arguing with people who just think they should have been locked up for ever.

MCTH I remember the case pretty well we lived not far from them and were around the same age, which is why I think it's pretty poor form that they were released at all.
But anyway, the resources aren't always available and the systems fail, you'd be naive in thinking their aren't convicted murders and rapists breeching their bail/license conditions daily and equally some teenage joyriders play the system like a fiddle but that's a whole new thread.

Milly I also think it's really unhelpful to post the hideous details of the murder.
What are you trying to achieve with that?
We all know how horrific the situation was without the need to re read the ghoulish details.

Trying to understand this issue that's all.

My gut reaction is that shouldn't be allowed out & I don't see what's wrong with asking questions.

I'll look up the Indept article.

"I doubt Jamies mother has been able to carry on with her life knowing this lad poured paint in her baby's eyes and pushed batteries into his anus." But it is not down to the victim to hand out the justice in this country. We have judges and juries for that, and whether people agree with it or not, these boys were sent to an institution where it was hoped they could be rehabilitated in order that they be able to one day lead some kind of normal life in society.

At the end of the day, they were children when they committed this crime. In most countries they would not even have been at the age of responsibility. Yet as ten year old children they were tried as adults, in an adult court, there were even reports of how they couldn't see over the dock, and every day they were driven to/from court covered while the mob screamed and shouted and hammered on the van trying to get to them and threatening to kill them.

Ten year old children.

They committed an adult crime, but they were children.

Thanks stewie

I remember the Independent article, it is fantastic writing imo and gives a great insight into the rehabilitation process.

As for Venables, I agree with DuelingFanjo, and will withold judgement until we find out what the breach was, if we do.

Milly, I have reported your post becuase I thought the details you posted were unnecessary and excessive.

Well said wannaBe.

Really ? I don't think it hurts to remember what those animals did to that 3 year old baby.
All the bleeding hearts will try to justify their actions, they were only ten, abused whatever, plenty of children have a worse upbringing than those pair and do not carry out crimes of that scale.
There was nothing random about the attack they went to the shopping centre to find a child to murder that day having practiced on pets first.

Another point being that friends of ours were looking to adopt a child, happy to consider an older child, basically social services told them that by the age of 3 the damage was done and any hope of a normal family life as a child or adult was relatively small. Even without all other factors, the murder, the chances of Venables ever being anything but a career criminal were slim IMO.

I think the key is that only one seems back in- from what I know a 50% rehab rate for kids with their background isn;t that far off average anyway. It doesn't prove (as I am sure there will people saying over the next few days) that they were evil: at worst it proves one wasn't able to be rehabiolitated, dependent on what caused it.

And of course they have human rights: they were 10, same as my eldest. Having HR doesn't mean you shouldn't be punished, but it does mean that your age at the time of the crime should be taken into account, and a ten year old from a disastrous family background is IMO incrediblky different from a 33 year old with no mitigating circs, yet they were tried as adults. Denying them the chance to try agin would be inhumane and what is the point of that? Yes they did very wrong but thyey were also victims- punsih and attempt to rehab yes, demonise and trteat as sunhuman never.

Whatever he did I hope he receives appropriate justicve, and I hope that the other young man farres better. And that justice is served appropriately without a media circus.

Wannabe I was struck by the photos if the boys on the news, standing in front of a height chart. It brings home the reality of just how young they were.

4 foot 6, the same size as my daughter, a little girl who still plays with toys and sucks her thumb.

Will you listen to yourselves, who has a three year old, how tall is that child, who was thrown on rail tracks like a piece of rubbish.
Jamie didn't suck his thumb or cry for his mum or being terrified in his final hours I suppose unlike the two criminals ?
Am hiding this now I cannot believe the reactions.

interesting that:

you have to be sixteen to get married.
eighteen to drink.
seventeen to drive.
sixteen to vote.

Yet at ten you can be tried for a crime and there is an expectation that you never be allowed to be rehabilitated and released.

If these boys were unsuccessfully rehabilitated then one would imagine they would have committed a similar crime by now (they've been out for nine years, nearly as many years as they were old when they went in).

But if they have successfully been rehabilitated then they will not be living a free life. Because they will be living with what they have done. They will be living with new identities which surely must include made-up childhoods in order that they not be discovered, and the need to lie to every single person they ever form a relationship with, be that friend/partner/their own children one day.

If they are remorseful for what they have done then it will be a conflict between living an honest life, and having to deceive everyone around them for fear of their own safety.

I have tried so hard to feel compassion for these 2, as I tried to feel compassion for Tracey Connolley (sp?) but I just can't do it. I just can't.

And that makes me feel bad about myself on top of feeling bad about the fact that sometimes horrific things happen.

Milly, feeling sad for Thompson and Venables doesn't mean I don't feel agony for James. I have a 2 and a half year old little boy, I don't want to know the details of what happened to James because the very thought keeps me awake at night. I can still have feelings of sadness about his killers.