Hilarys outburst what do we think?

[FaceFook]

here

I even object to the way it is being reported ' over sensitive'

I think not - i think the 'outburst' quite justified !

Why is it automatically sexism to think that a woman over reacted? There is an alarming trend on MN lately to label all criticism of a woman as misogyny and sexism. Women are not beyond reproach! Sometimes women do stuff that is stupid, or wrong, or silly.

She over reacted. She may have been pissed off, but there was no need to react in that way. Why not just get the person to repeat the question (there may well have been a lost in translation issue) and say something like, "well I don't know what President Clinton thinks about that, but as Secretary of State I think...."

"you're reading far too much into this on the grounds that you 'hate' her"

Now that IS projection.

Dittany; I think you're spot on re double standards for male and female politicians. Thanks for mention the stuff she has been doing in Congo - I think that is the real point.

Shame there are females here who criticise her for this - or are they still enjoying being defined by their husbands? What happens if he leaves you, hits you, you get sick of being patronised etc...

How does thinking she over reacted mean that I am "defined by my husband"?

She reacted badly. She sounded histronic. She didn't handle it well. Fine, be annoyed, but for God's sake, she's supposed to be a diplomat. She should act like one.

Oh was that directed at me? Do you think I am the submissive type?

My dislike for Hilary Clinton has nothing to do with her gender (or mine). I think it would be more insulting to follow her blindly just because we are both women. Let's see that logic applied to Condoleeza Rice shall we.

Or Sarah Palin. Let's see the MN cheerleaders come out for Sarah just because she's a woman... oh no, she's right wing so she doesn't count....

i dont think she overreacted georgimama

nor do i agree with your perception of modern munsnet

our society needs feminists

It is possible to be a feminist and not like Hilary Clinton. Take about standing by your man when he doesn't deserve it. What kind of role model is that?

Blindly endorsing everything a woman does just because she's a woman is hardly feminism. In fact it's demeaning.

Well georgimama, if you honestly are willing to criticise her minor loss of composure in face of the context - she was speaking in Congo, where gang rape and sexual violence is systematic and widespread - then you're not much of a sister are you? And probably parroting the patriarchal line.

well, no, it's an opinion. my opinion. i personally think you're reading too much into this, i think you're seeing a reaction that isn't there. it's probably motivated by your strong negative feelings towards the woman.

who is blindly endorsing?

i agree with hilary wholeheartedly

A sister? I'm sorry, a what? Is is now the Spare Rib forum - is everyone else wearing dungarees?

Men don't talk about a "brotherhood" and do you know why? Because they see themselves as people. Individuals. Try doing that and you might have a more positive experience interacting with the rest of the world.

She's not defined by her husband though is she? That's the point. If you are willing to weigh saying she has overreacted etc. then that sounds like a male view to me - that's all.

You are not only mistaken, Aitch, but quite likely you were projecting when you said I was as it is you who is seeing Hilary in the light in which you choose to see her. I have given her credit where it is due. She did react badly (for a politician in a diplomatic role). I have said repeatedly that the question was out of order, allowing the question was out of order, her response could have been so much more powerful if she hadn't snapped. A true leader will remain calm in the heat of a crisis. She failed that task. And I am clearly not alone in this view.

What is funny though, is the idea that you must blindly follow and support everything about Hilary Clinton or you are a misogynist or unsisterly . I actually have a brain which I use to judge people on their merit and not on whether or not we belong to the same gender. For what it's worth I hate Bill Clinton too. Is that sexist?

You are not only mistaken, Aitch, but quite likely you were projecting when you said I was as it is you who is seeing Hilary in the light in which you choose to see her. I have given her credit where it is due. She did react badly (for a politician in a diplomatic role). I have said repeatedly that the question was out of order, allowing the question was out of order, her response could have been so much more powerful if she hadn't snapped. A true leader will remain calm in the heat of a crisis. She failed that task. And I am clearly not alone in this view.

What is funny though, is the idea that you must blindly follow and support everything about Hilary Clinton or you are a misogynist or unsisterly . I actually have a brain which I use to judge people on their merit and not on whether or not we belong to the same gender. For what it's worth I hate Bill Clinton too. Is that sexist?

Well what are you then Georgimama - a SAHM, a DW? Sorry it's not Mumsnet enough for you.

You didn't respond to my general comment about the fact she was making her statement in Congo, where there is a major issue affecting the human rights of women...

Actually, Mitford, this thread is not about the greater goal of the mission. It is specifically about her "outburst" in the clip we have now all seen.

once again...

i didn't say you were being sexist. i just think you're seeing a reaction that isn't there on the film. you said this "In the clip you can see Hilary turn to her as if to say "Am I supposed to answer that insult?" and the questioner signal for her to answer it. At that point, Hilary stumbles. She is taken aback, and she she snaps back. If Hilary had lept her cool she could have made the the guy who asked the question look like a real arse. But, she lost and so she looks like the arse. Someone with her experience as first lady and senator not to mention lawyer really ought to know how to perform in the public eye. She appeared totally surprised. But, she shouldn't have been."

i don't see stumbling, i don't see snapping, i don't see her looking like an arse. i do see her looking surprised. and she should have been, because it was a mistake and the guy should've said Obama.

i'm not blindly following some line or other, i'm just saying what i see. it's so different from you that i'm guessing your feelings of hate towards the woman are distorting your view. i'd say i'm fairly neutral to HC, as it happens, although i have warmed to her greatly over this particular incident.

i also think you're a little in love with me... and the word projection, for some reason. have you ever worked in a cinema?

who's in love with who here?

I have only used the word projection repeated as a response to your misuse of the words in hopes of better education you.

I don't think I'm seeing things on that clip that aren't there. And I think I could find a wide range of examples of other people who saw the same thing.

And the comment about blindly following women because we are of the same gender was not directed at you. Apologies if it appeared to be.

well obviously i'm in love with you. and you seem to harbour strong feelings towards your dog and mr obama...

Yuck. Please can we not discuss Hilary Clinton and love on the same thread?

you wot, athene? lol. thanks for better education me, it means a lot.

Was it not a response rather than an 'outburst'? I suppose I get very fired up when I think of her being pilloried in this context. Shame on her for not being perfect.