Boy is Dad at age 13, he looks so very young

[Lizzylou]

Here, he just looks so young

h and I expect that if Maisie ends up like her mum, in fifteen years time we'll see people like you on internet sites condemning her.

IF there's no if about it, I would bet my life little Maisie if allowed to stay in that family will be in the same boat.

"Her morals were her own business right up until she asked me to pay for her child's welfare, then it's everybody's business."

Sorrento, I do hope you give your child benefit cheque to charity. And if you don't, I really hope that your morals are squeaky clean because if we're contributing to your household, then we want to know all your moral business.

And Kimi, poorly educated is really not the same as stupid.

I can't believe that there are posters attacking the children in this case. Why are they attacking the children when they are apparently so appalled that it is children having the baby? You can't have it both ways.

I don't think anyone is defending the situation as it is. I think most normal people are trying to find out why it happened and ways to prevent this happening again. It doesn't just happen, FFS.

Why are there apparently so many people who live in a moral vacuum and think it ok to live off benefits? Why don't they want to work, bring their children up to want more?

Oh right it is now all the fault of the people who work hard and make something of their lives. Treading on the little people.
15 years olds should not have babies, 13 year olds should not have sex, and as long as people say that its not their fault and how mean and nasty anyone who says it is their fault are it will never get any better,

Carry on having a go I don't care, I know these people are vile parents, their children know no better and never will, and that baby will be the same as her mother in years to come and people will say it is ok she knew no better.

Best place for that baby is in care, to be placed with some adults who will teach her how to be an asset and not a drain on society.

Why are there apparently so many people who live in a moral vacuum and think it ok to live off benefits? Why don't they want to work, bring their children up to want more?

Because anyone who tries to point this out is called names

It makes me laugh because there was a thread a while ago about a man who didn't pay tax on his business and the entire thread was slagging him off, he was working to support his family and buy his house etc but he'd have been lynched by all accounts.
This bunch of reprobates are felt sorry for and yet have a little look at entitledto.co.uk as to what they will be given in benefits and frankly you'll feel a right prat the day you ever went to work.

"Anyone who finds any thing in this whole mass acceptable should have a look up from their copy of the guardian"

And once again, you are ignoring the fact that no one has said this is acceptable.

Are you doing this deliberately as a dishonest debating tactic, or do you just not have enough critical thinking skills to grasp an argument?

By the way, I think plenty of non-guardian readers would feel horrified by your attitudes. Oh and I don't read the Guardian (except when it's linked to on Mumsnet).

Er, Sorrento I think the man who didn't pay tax on his business might have been a grown adult, while we are talking about children.

Maybe that chap had the right idea, dodge the tax man .
I would like my taxes to fund more hospitals, put books in to schools, help people who find themselves in dire need, build more prisons.

notto fund a bunch of layabouts to breed like rats and 15 year olds to have babies.
Want something to love you unconditionally get a sodding cat.

Sex education in schools is a must and as early as possible, I have had the talk with both my sons, long long ago, and not just the mechanics of sex and babies but the whole responsibility, emotion, life change, relationship bits as well.

that baby stands on chance if left where she is, that is the saddest thing in this whole mess

And again, nobody has said that it is acceptable for this family to live on benefits without a notion of working.

For some of us, finding this unacceptable, does not automatically translate into calling for forced adoptions or forced abortions, or harking back to the days when women were judged by their sexual behaviour rather than the content of their character.

I think you'll find that expecting a cat to love you unconditionally is a really fruitless exercise.

You don't even know that.

I thought you were blaming the parents Bella ? Are they not adults ? Well they aren't responsible adults we know that much.

What somebody needed to point out to that silly little cow before she went beyond the abortion date is that the economy the way it is, if inflation kicks in and unemployment continues to rise there will not be enough benefits available for her to feed that child.
I doubt that crossed her mind for a moment though.

"breeding like rats"

That's right, dehumanise people again.

She didn't want a baby, she wanted a doll, that evident in all the poor little sods in town called "get here" and dressed in track suits from 3 months old

Are you doing this deliberately as a dishonest debating tactic, or do you just not have enough critical thinking skills to grasp an argument?

I am just telling you how I see it, but carry on having a pop at me, it just makes you look sad.

The argument is that this is wrong, on every level. Dirty, nasty, wrong.

The absent father of the 13 year old went off with the friend of one of his step daughters, the whole family of the girl live off the tax payer, 3 yes 3 boys could be the father of the baby.
Not one adult in this mess is fit to parent their children and so that baby has no chance of being anything other then the same as those around her.

Who is going to teach her right from wrong? You?

You are entitled to say it is not the 15 year olds fault, the 13 year olds fault, the parents fault and so on just as I am entitled to say it is...the only one who had no say in this is a baby who has a very bleak future

I'm starting to think that we're dealing with not very intelligent people i.e. Kimi and Sorrento who don't understand that nobody here is condoning the situation and nobody here is saying it's ok to live on benefits for generations.

Kimi and Sorrento just keep ranting about it whereas most others on here are trying to debate as to how and why this keeps happening.

Wonder if 300 years ago parish records will show similar birth rates among children like this? Are we really in a moral decline? Hasn't it always been the way?

Do families like this really cost an awful lot of money?

Not as much as those morally reprehensible bankers and our shoring up their irresponsibility. White collar irresponsibility has cost this country far more than a few teenage mums ever could.

MY CATS LOVE ME JUST FINE THANKS....
Can I ask what YOU would do if these were your children

What is there to debate exactly ?

My character is just fine thank you very much, she's a dirty little slag who's been held up by her own parents for public ridicule.
That's the biggest shame of all that her own family couldn't support her financially or emotionally and so have hung her out to dry.
At least the boy seems to have somebody looking out for his interests.

For a moment there I thought I had gone on to the Daily Mail website by mistake.

Kimi and Sorrento
I cannot believe some of the comments you have made. Noone here is saying that it is a good thing that these people will get benefits paid by taxpayers. Noone is saying that it is right that they do not go out to work.

What is being debated is the fact that the adults in charge of these children have failed completely to protect their children. I do see it as a failure of the parents if (as some reports have suggested) the young girl was allowed to have several boys in her room. It is appalling that they are now cashing in on the situation by selling their story to the highest bidder.

I do not condemn the children, I condemn the adults.

Kimi
I hope that your daughter never falls pregnant before you deem it acceptable. Reading your post about forced abortion and forced adoption sent a shiver down my spine.

Sorrento
"a dirty little slag"

I have reported your post.

"What would you do if these were your children?"

Well, I would hope that they would be able to come to me to talk about their problem without fear of being called a silly cow, for starters.

It's not about middle class people who have been brought up well and who are bringing up their children well etc etc etc. It's all very snug and cosy to lambast and fire off hatred to these people.

But the question is, how is the cycle stopped? Because I bet you anything Kimi and Sorrento, if you two had been born into this family, the odds are you wouldn't have turned out much better.

So, instead of attacking like some dried up old fishwives, how about you think of ways to prevent this kind of thing happening again?

It keeps happening because there is no consequence, the state picks up the tab, the do gooders say no one is to blame and we all go off and forget about it till the next one pops up on the cover of the sun.

Parents do not know/care what their kids are doing in a lot of cases.

Generations carry on the same life patterns over and over.

It is illegal to have under age sex for a reason but no one is ever prosecuted in these cases.

Schools do not install worth or value in to children.

T.V uses sex to sell everything from aftershave to cars.

Children are given to many rights and have far to much.

Any mention of God or church is seen as madness.

if that 15 year old had to work now to feed, shelter, clothe, and keep the baby I bet she would not be a "mother" today.

Sorrento, there's something wrong with you. Do you usually attack children?

MmeLindt I do not have daughters I was saying IF I did