I'm Jack Monroe. Ask me anything.

[MxJackMonroe]

Hi Mumsnet.

It seems every time I am in the news, a MN thread about all things transgender crops up. I didn't see the last one (yesterday?) as I don't come on here very often these days - people who eavesdrop etc etc. I was cooking in a tent in a muddy field all day, having a ball, not googling myself on the internet!

The thread was deleted - which was nothing to do with me, nor my lawyer. The day I call him about a MN thread is the day I pack everything in for good. So far only the Mail and Hopkins have had legal action taken against them, and both for quite serious statements. I'm not rich enough nor quite bothered enough to call him every time someone says mean words on the internets.

ANYWAY. Threads about me tend to get deleted. So here's a new one. Because there are clearly some questions that keep coming up, criticisms that I could answer, speculation I could clarify and untruths that could do with correction.

So I'm taking questions. I'm an adult and I take an awful lot of criticism and unkindness online, on the chin. I am pretty mentally stable right now, and feel this could be a constructive discussion.

In order to stop this descending into pandemonium, using general 'chair' rules, to start with I'll take one question from each user - if it's quiet and everything gets answered, feel free to add follow up questions.

It doesn't have to be about boobs, dresses, hormones. Literally ask me anything.

MN - please don't delete this thread. I think people have valid things to say and I'm here with my big girl/boy pants on to hear them.

Over to you.

I did read a paper somewhere where people who weren't trans reacted 'mentally' in a bad way to HRT if it didn't feel right.

soren, Jack, you both do realise that tons of women take HRT, right? And feel pretty good on it? "Reacting well to taking artificial hormones" is not an accurate indicator of being trans.

The hormones thing doesn't sound right what about all the women who take the pill??

I have (ex) adult friends who mockingly refer to my beautiful child as "it" because they pronouns are such hard work. A lot of people think I am ridiculous for "indulging" them.

This is why using "they" and "them" (plural pronouns) is problematic.

I read the above sentence as meaning that people think you are ridiculous for indulging your friends (who are plural), not your child (who is singular).

Great post by Dog

You say that you don't like your breasts? Did you breast feed? If so, did you feel any differently about them? (not turning this into a breast feeding debate)

ArcheryAnnie:

Talk In the news
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MNHQ have commented on this thread.

I'm Jack Monroe. Ask me anything.705Show OP
Today 08:20 NotYoda

Bellsa

I agree

Today 08:24 Trills

Mephisto
You state that males who go through all the processes of transitioning to become trans women but are also sexual predators are not true trans women. How do you know that? Could they not just be trans women who are also sexual predators?

Somehow you managed to miss where Jack said "with the sole intention of abusing other women".

Even though it was in bold.

I can easily see how interviews get skewed away from the point a person wants to make if you can misunderstand that when it's right there in front of you, available for re-reading as many times as you need, in bold.

Today 08:27 wonkylampshade

What thedogstinks said.

Today 08:29 EmpressOfTheVaginaDentata

I've re-watched the interview, Jack, although I can see the conversation's moved on quite a bit since last night.

I still see you saying that transwomen are women & should have access to women's spaces without question, that Julia (and every other woman presumably) doesn't have the right to define what a woman is, and I still don't hear anything about gender being a harmful, oppressive and sexist concept.

I still think that the natural inference from what you've said is that if anyone can use a women's toilet anyone can use a communal women's shower at the pool - have I misinterpreted that?

Women & girls have self-preservation instincts drummed into them almost from birth. Man in the wrong place, get out, sound the alarm. But now we're meant to suppress our instincts because that's probably a transwoman.

Even if they look like Danielle?

Today 08:36 HandbagCrab

I think you are very admirable person Jack. I think you have done a lot of good in the world. I hope you can live your life however you see fit, without censure or abuse.

There's some ignorant sounding posters on here that should be ashamed of themselves. 'Oh I've never even heard of you', 'Hark at Lady Muck, needing formalwear', 'Stop worrying and wear a camisole and heels'. FFS.

dog's post really resonates with me. It feels likes it's ingrained to budge up and eat the burnt chop and I feel that's being taken advantage of. I can see why someone would not want to be a woman.

Today 08:37 JacquettaWoodville

Hear hear Basil.

Today 08:38 midcenturymodern

Brilliant post from thedog

It's not 'live and let live' at all. If only it were. It's women, budge up. It's women - know your place. It's your biology doesn't matter and if you say it does you are transphobic and reducing people to their genitals. You can have 'live and let live' or you can have 'women is feeling' so all sex based protections is gone, whether that means being able to access same sex accommodation in rape crisis, or a same sex carer or HCP, or competing only against women for a place on a sports team or a college scholarship.

Today 08:46 acatcalledjohn

Multivac, in my mind variances exist within both the binary forms, but on the whole I see it as binary. My gender is still very much female. Just not pink frilly female, though this doesn't mean I am more or less of a woman than someone who always wears dresses, high heels and war paint. But I am a woman, I identify as a woman in my head. My gender and sex are both female to me, despite not conforming to the societal stereotype of a woman. Even within a binary split there can be a society devised 'ideal' as far as I'm concerned. It may not be right to have that, but it's not impossible.

Whether any of this fits a certain label shouldn't really matter. As long as you are happy within yourself.

Today 08:55 midcenturymodern

Women & girls have self-preservation instincts drummed into them almost from birth. Man in the wrong place, get out, sound the alarm. But now we're meant to suppress our instincts because that's probably a transwoman.

I think this is really important. Remember those 'women - other people know better' posters that went up in women's toilets in some universities a few years ago? Women are socialised to put other peoples feelings ahead of our own. Other peoples oppression is more important than ours so of course we must accommodate everyone else. There was a thread a few weeks ago where a woman said if her 14yo dd objected to changing in front of an adult man in a womens changing room she would give her short shrift and tell her not to be so silly. It really summed up where women are placed, and how women's rights are regarded. It's all a bit silly.

Today 08:58 FoodPorn

Another +1 for thedogstinks and all of those others posters so eloquently expressing similar thoughts.

Today 09:09 SisterMoonshine

Not a direct question to you Jack, just generally, as gender stereotyping seems to be getting worse these days rather than better, I would be interested to know more about these gender clinics.
How many there are now compared to a while ago. How many people get referred and NOT diagnosed as trans. The attitudes of the staff there - I imagine them as stuck in thinking in rigid stereotypes or how can they be diagnosing people as trans?
I expect there's been a Channel 4 documentary I've missed.

Today 09:09 Alasalas2

Has your son been affected at all? How is he coping?

Today 09:12 JaWellNoFine

Thedog has nailed it.

Today 09:24 ArcheryAnnie: Jack, you have said that you are not a woman but non-binary, but in the recent piece you described yourself as a woman and also as a lesbian. If you are a woman born into a female body, how does that mean you are trans? This is not a snarky question - I am genuinely struggling to understand. If you are not a woman but non-binary, then why do you describe yourself as a woman, and feel entitled to eg, accept awards intended for women, or wear a t-shirt that says you are a lesbian? You have publicly asked not to be "rejected" from women-only spaces or lesbian-only spaces, but if you are not a woman and not a lesbian (in that you are non-binary and also occasionally have relationships - even if "exceptions" - with men) what makes you entitled to those spaces?

I don't feel 'entitled' to anything.

^FFS, cut and paste fail, but hopefully it makes sense.

Jack if you are dismissing women's concerns about safety because "women assault people too", are you in favour of desegregating sex-segregated spaces, so that all public loos, changing rooms, prisons, crisis centers, etc are mixed-sex and gender-neutral? And if not, why not?

Annie, I think the HRT comment refers to the hormones of the opposite sex? So Jack feels better on testosterone, but I wouldn't. Not saying I agree or its scientifically proven, just that I think that's what she means

You say that you don't like your breasts? Did you breast feed?

No. My son was an emergency c section. My milk didn't come in for a few days. He was in intensive care. We used someone elses milk kindly donated until mine came in. I expressed and bottle fed him on the advice of the nurses as he was in SCBU. This may be different from other peoples experiences.

...I worked out what you meant to post!

OK, then, forget the word "entitled". Why should you continue to have access to women-only space and lesbian-only space if you are not a woman or a lesbian? (Even if you'd like to think of yourself as a lesbian - if you are nonbinary, and are open to sleeping with men, those are two points which mean you don't fit the definition of "lesbian".) And do you concede that your access to either means that those spaces would no longer be women-only or lesbian-only?

I think it's like, how if a child genuinely has adhd, they are calmer on ritalin etc, but if they are incorrectly diagnosed, it makes them less calm?

Jack if you are dismissing women's concerns about safety because "women assault people too"

I'm not dismissing anybodys concerns. I said something in anger that was a wider point and I was not given time to expand on it further. I am keen for this not to be derailed into berating me about perceived MtF trans issues - which is not something I have any experience in. It's like berating the lesbians here for the behaviour of a small group of gay men. Please, stop. I came to answer questions about my own experiences. There is a core group here determined to steer away from that.

Further to my point above it being difficult to discuss this stuff due to being called transphobic.
I am on a local committee and the one way to ensure 'trouble in the ranks' - note I am not suggesting any comments are making trouble in the ranks - is to NOT let people have their say.

Even if they are in complete opposition to the proposal, as long as they can publicly make their views known, they will accept the vote much more happily.

So my view is that the shutting down of comments or criticism is what fuels anger in people about this issue.

So, Jack, I am wondering if you, in your prominent position socially, can encourage more open debate. We don't have to follow the US agenda of complete acceptance or hate behavior. But letting people have their say would help to move things forward.

But you were happy to take Julia Long to task for her points about 'perceived' () MtF trans issues?

ArcheryAnnie

Let me get this straight.

Penis-Owning-People cannot access womens spaces on account of their Dangerous Genitalia.

Vagina-Owning-People cannot access womens spaces if they are gender non conforming or non binary or have any hormonal imbalance or physical imbalance that leads them to conclude they are not entirely female despite owning a vagina.

If these are the rules, they're fucking reductive. And inconsistent.

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace: But you were happy to take Julia Long to task for her points about 'perceived' (hmm) MtF trans issues?

No. I was happy to do a Newsnight interview about Maria Miller and her new act being inclusive of non binary people. That was my brief. They sprang Long on me, and I was unprepared. And unprepared on live television. Made good telly though, and that's all they care about.

So, Jack, I am wondering if you, in your prominent position socially, can encourage more open debate.

That's why I started the thread.

If you only want to talk about you, and you view any sense that your issues might be related to wider ones as determined derailment, it might be wiser not to come and start threads inviting people to ask you anything, and not to go on newsnight to talk about things other than cooking on a budget!

Please, stop. I came to answer questions about my own experiences.

Ahem, your opening post said "Literally ask me anything." This is the opaqueness that I was commenting on - as soon as anything gets sticky you retreat to 'I only talk about my own experiences'.

High-fives seek

Alasalas2: Has your son been affected at all? How is he coping?

Er, no. I'm the same as I have always been, to him. I dress the same, look the same, hug the same, laugh the same. I haven't imposed anything on him. He's brilliant.

Er, I'm not "berating" anyone. I'm asking perfectly polite questions, based on information you have put into the public domain, on a thread in which you specifically invited questions to you on this subject. I am feeling quite attacked, here.

And yes, you are correct, dangerous penis-owning persons shouldn't be allowed to access women's spaces. And anyone who isn't a woman should not be in a woman's space. People who identify as non-binary, if one respects their self-identification, are by definition not women.

And where exactly have I said that gender non-conforming women should not be in women's spaces? They are women. Gender non-conforming women are very welcome in women's spaces, as far as I am concerned - I'm gender non-conforming, most women I know are gender non-conforming, and anyway most women's spaces were set up by gender non-conforming women.

If you want to break the gender binary and be non-binary, why ask to be included in a specifically binary space, one which is not yours? What's wrong with creating a third space?

Ahem, your opening post said "Literally ask me anything." This is the opaqueness that I was commenting on - as soon as anything gets sticky you retreat to 'I only talk about my own experiences'.

Unfair comment. I have answered some bloody sticky questions. I have talked about my own rapes and sexual abuse, for crying out loud. You can ask me anything. It doesn't mean I have all of the answers. Nobody does.

it might be wiser not to come and start threads inviting people to ask you anything, and not to go on newsnight to talk about things other than cooking on a budget!

Thankyou for the unsolicited career advice, which basically amounted to 'keep quiet and stay in the kitchen.' Yay, feminism 2016.