Part 5: Israeli-Palestinian conflict

[AndHarry]

New thread again.

Thread 1 - started when 3 Israeli boys were found murdered.

Thread 2 - in which we mainly discussed Operation Protective Edge.

Thread 3 - in which we continued to discuss Operation Protective Edge, the wider conflict and international involvement.

Thread 4 - in which Operation Protective Edge was examined further and we looked at the different views from inside Israel and the international community.

Another reminder of the Mumsnet Talk Guidelines.

another source same story

yet another source

Itismebut are you finding it hard seeing the evidence of the Israelis brutality towards the Palestinians, especially to it's children hard to stomach? Even harder to justify.

we're doing the same old shit with the latest apologist. they must do shift work. why are we wasting more breath?

he/she has made clear they're ok with the slaughter of women and children and civilians. what more is there to say to someone like that?

round of applause for ireland. any signs of us recalling parliament here? or would it disrupt the holidays in the carribean?

goldvelvet .... of course I'm not having trouble seeing 'evidence' of children getting hurt, as I did when Hamas was trying to blow up school buses via suicide vests.

Are you finding hard to understand that when an Islamic Jihadist party like Hamas states that it wants to destroy Israel, that after Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2003, and the temporary vacuum was not filled with Fatah looking for a solution, but with Hamas looking to wage war whenever they are ready, there will be war until they have gone.

Do YOU support Islamic Jihadists and their aims?

As by accusing others of myopia without grasping the basic fact that if Hamas had not taken over when they did and reversed any goodwill fatah was building on - the current conflict is unlikely to have started - so that, and cheap point point scoring after someone has to go, says quite a lot about your political sympathies.

P.S. I'll get back to you on your '2/3rds of the Gaza population are children'.

I love when Russell Brand explained for the really thick shits out there, that even if Hamas had strapped little babies to their backs as human shields, they still wouldn't be killed if Israel didn't drop bombs on them.

Why should Israel be armed and Palestine not be armed?

Isitme are you going to type nicely when you come back, a little less bold, caps lock and underlining and we might read your posts? I love how you go round and round in circles, trying to justify what's going on here. It's really illuminating. You sounds just like that charmer, Mark Regev: "We don't know as fact it as the IDF that bombed the UN schools."

It's revolting.

Again, can you answer, why should Israel be armed by the US and the UK, and Palestinians not be armed?

Why do Israel have the right to blockade and wage war on Gaza, and Gaza do not have the right to resist?

Look at this "terrorist". He's a boy. With a rock. A fucking rock. You must be terrified in your bed at night, with him out there, half starved and behind a giant wall.

P.S. I'll get back to you on your '2/3rds of the Gaza population are children'.

This

[[http://www.pcbs.gov.ps/Portals/_pcbs/PressRelease/int_Pop_2012e.pdf
On the Eve of International Population Day, the Palestinian Central Bureau of Statistics (PCBS) released the following statistical review on the status of the Palestinian Population:]]

the reason why Gaza's populatio is so young

Data revealed that the population of the Palestinian Territory is a young population; the percentage of individuals aged (0-14) constituted 40.4% of the total population at mid 2012 of which 38.4% in the West Bank and 43.7% in Gaza Strip. The elderly population aged (65 years and over ) constituted 2.9% of the total population of which 3.3% in the West Bank and 2.4% in Gaza Strip of mid 2012.

Children are classed as being under 16 on the channel 4 recorded interview which states 2/3 are chidden in Gaza.
But I would class under 18 as still a child.

Can you now show me why i'm wrong please about Gaza having a young population.

I live in the Middle East and am so horrified by the mainstream media's Israel bias. Following this thread.

Isitme I have reported your post at 16.32 as it is a personal attack.

One last attempt: you will never get rid of Hamas or something like it until their grievances are addressed.

Another day, another apologist...
Has anyone noticed how completely over the top crazy paranoid they are? and how they come on here trying to whip us all into a frenzy over the Islamic jihadists/isis/boko haram/whatever all those muslims are the same crap. I really think colllective therapy is needed for Israelis. if indeed 90% support Nutinyahoo's mass slaughter of children then there are some seriously mentally disturbed folks in Israel.

Kelly what are they showing in the middle east media regarding the conflict?

The Economist have a live q&a with their Gaza correspondent now (4-6pm); it's on their Facebook page

I have just posted a couple of questions halfdrunkcoffee

Gold velvet it's much more balanced here and pro Palestinian.

I recommend some Facebook news sources: Al Jazeera English and the Saudi gazette. Also the national, based out of Abu Dhabi.

I would go as far to say that everyone here is pro palestine and we are beyind sickened.

I've visited palestine and tel aviv, and it was this trip that changed my world view of everything. When you see how the Palestinians are treated, the atrocity, it opened my eyes.

thanks halfdrunkcoffee

Really interesting especially hearing that the journalists are allowed to report freely & honestly. So all the zionist can stop preaching we're being sold a pack of lies through any media outlet that isn't one that they are viewing and it's not really happening, that Hamas are staging the attacks from Army for their own gains.

stream.aljazeera.com/story/201408051929-0024014

Uk activists shut down Israeli Arms factory, peaceful but effective.

There is a fantastic piece of banter between the protesters and police:-

Police in cherrypicker trying desperately hard to engage us in conversation. "whats your msg?" have they not seen the 20ft banner?! #bds So British!

Thank you Kelly. I think most of the word are horrified by the conflict especially with the power of social media. There are so many more raw images available that are too upsetting to make mainstream media.

In Israel most of the reporting shows images of tanks and ''brave'' soldiers patrolling they don't show the displaced children's bodies. Babies screaming whilst having shrapnel that litters their tiny bodies removed under no anaesthetic, because there is no time!

I have heard your story over and over again of people that have visited Israel and palestine and have just been agog by the goings on. One of the ladies that I read about was a South African woman who lived through the apartheid and she said what she witnessed was worse than anything she had had to face..... which is a strong statement.

Good to know that Baroness Warsi felt no need to resign in regard of the government's policy on Syria, Libya and Afghanistan, to name but three conflicts which have seen many more civilians and specifically children killed. And of course the UK is actively involved in the last two.

notgeorgesabra.wordpress.com/2014/07/22/selective-internationalism-an-activist-disorder/

Bloody well done those protesters - and the police actually.

Just also read an article about a little boy taken to his injured mother's bedside before his burial.
And I honestly can't wrap my head around it. Your beloved little child, and suddenly in the blink of an eye they are reduced from their whole, breathing selves to rags and blood. Right in front of you. And someone did that deliberately.
i don't know how anyone could stay sane after the sheer searing shock and horror of something like that.

It looks like this current conflict is winding down, but nearly 2000 people are dead forever, thousands more with life-changing injuries, and yet more will be suffering grief and trauma that they can never overcome.

Houses and infrastructure gone.... and I'm so scared that once this is no longer on the front pages, the world will forget, and they'll carry on suffering, "dying anyway".

The Gaurdian: Senior British lawyers write to ICC calling on it to launch investigation into crimes committed in Gaza, including the destruction of homes, hospitals and schools.

"The initiation of an investigation would send a clear and unequivocal message to those involved in the commission of these crimes that the accountability and justice called for by the United Nations on the part of victims are not hollow watchwords," the letter states.

"It would bring about an end to the impunity which has prevailed in the region to date, fuelling ever increasingly brutal cycles of violence. The international community cannot continue to act simply as witness to such bloodshed and extreme civilian suffering."

Good on them.