Part 2: Israeli-Palestinian conflict

[AndHarry]

Starting a new thread as the original is almost full.

The original thread is here. It was started on 1st July after three Israeli boys were found murdered, before the murder of the Palestinian boy and the resumption of sustained rocket attacks and Operation Protective edge.

There are lots of excellent posts and links in the original thread showcasing a variety of views. The main consensus was that there is fault on both sides. We also considered various options for people on both sides of the conflict to work towards a lasting peace.

Anyone supporting Israel is complicit in the murders and has blood on their hands. That includes Cameron and Obama. I absolutely cannot understand the viewpoint of any living being who defends Israeli actions, particularly these last few weeks.

How many more innocent refugee lives taken before Israel is satiated?

And of it was the Muslims doing what the Israelis are doing they would get called terrorists.

Absolutely disgusting how they are attacking the sick.

I saw a baby beimg pulled out of rubble the other day.

Quivering had repeatedly said that the attacks on civilian targets by the IDF are immoral i.e. she agrees with everyone else

curious as to what has happened to the personnel who killed these children? am i right in thinking in most 'civilised' nations they'd be under investigation right now and off of active duty?

Andharry yes she has. But sadly she presents as completely disingenuous by then stating that collective punishment is moral and trying to defend israels actions.

You cannot defend Israel and at the very same time be sympathetic to the civilians being killed. Just as I cannot lambast Israel but blame palestinians for their fate.

Apologies quivering I did misread your post.

Just for a bit of balance:

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1508090639403460&id=1504033769809147

Obama should be stripped of his Nobel Peace Prize what a completely premature award that was. The politicians are all parroting the same simplistic mantra that Israel has a right to defend itself. Well of course it does. No mention at all why they need to defend themseves in the first place. You simply cannot oppress, occupy, steal natural resources, deny basic human rights and expect no comeback. Why is that so hard to understand?

Backinthering Fri 18-Jul-14 07:08:06
And re the suicide bombs. They are wrong but I understand why they happened. It's an act of supreme desperation.

Do you feel the same for the 7/7 bombing then?

no, if israel was held to the same standards of international law as elsewhere it would have ended long ago. if america had ceased funding it's terrorism it would have ended long ago.

it's not complex it's that it has been allowed to act with impunity with full backing financially and morally from the world for decades.

I have read this thread and its predecessor with some interest and the thing that has occurred to me is the basic human need to assign a 'goodie' and 'baddie' in a conflict.

If I believe that the Palestinians are being mistreated, that means that they must be the good ones and Israel's every action is wrong or vice versa.

The thing that is so hard with this situation is that there a about a million different shades of grey. These debates rage back and forth because it is so hard to accept there are no goodies or baddies, just human beings on both sides. Sometimes they don't act like anything we would recognise as human, but then sometimes, neither do any of us.

I understand the need a apportion blame, but in this case I do not think it is helpful. Propaganda on both sides just serves to fuel hatred. Take a look when you go on your marches and see how many banners call for peace in comparison to how many send messages of hate.

I'm sorry Karen but the video u posted is full of inaccuracies. I switched off as I couldn't get past 'myth' no 3......it's untrue that the Jews accepted the UN partition plan of 1947 while the Palestinians rejected it. The truth then as it is now – is that the colonial powers sought to strip the Palestinians of their rights and their homeland without even consulting them....a bit like the 'Egyptian ceasefire' u keep mentioning where Hamas were not even consulted on and was hatched by the US, Netanyahu and Blair.

I'm travelling over 200 miles tomorrow to attend my first ever demonstration to show my solidarity with the innocent victims in this mess - the Palestinians. I'm far from being an activist of any kind believe me, but after what I have seen and read
this week I feel I have to do something.

Simply put Israel are occupying and degrading palestine. The complexity arises when the world is complicit in the oppression and supports and finances the aggressor.

Lemon - you do not think it's important to apportion blame? Really? Would you feel the same if your children were murdered whilst feeding pigeons, or with their grandmother travelling in a taxi, or if your home was blown up killing 18 members of your family?

Apportioning blame and calling out the wrong party surely is one of the most basic principles of justice. I haven't been on a demo this week, I will be going tmrw, but from the photos and coverage I have seen from people who went they are demanding peace and the basic right to live.

The ferocity of the ground invasion is being played out on twitter and fb. Reports suggest there is indiscriminate firing from tanks, aeroplanes and naval ships. Israel really is there to kill every last palestinian this time.

When I went on a march it was all about peace. Peace for palestinians and that the people around the world are praying for the conflict to end.

Why would I march around for hours for Israeli peace when they are killing so many innocent people?

How many Israelis have died so far quivering?

Every single image or news report has shown Israelis sat on beaches, in coffee shops, sitting in spare rooms fully equipped bunkers or cheering on bombs.

I feel for the Israelis who are against the oppression and murder of palestinians. I have no sympathy for those who support and cheer on their troops.