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Original poster

How plausible do we find John Terry's defense?

305 replies

Condover · 09/07/2012 12:35

That he was only repeating words Anton Ferdinand has accused him of saying.

I can't imagine saying those words ever. I'd be very upset to be accused of saying them, but I wouldn't repeat them in my denial, but then I'm not John Terry....

OP posts:
Yama · 09/07/2012 12:39

It is staggering that he thinks anyone will believe him. Truly staggering.

I guess that is what happens when you are surrounded by yes men and get away with appalling behviour repeatedly.

An example needs to be set here.

AdventuresWithVoles · 09/07/2012 12:40

I understand Terry claims he said
"I did not call you XYZ"
I am afraid I could end up saying exactly that, in a heated moment, so seems perfectly plausible to me. They live in a rough and direct world & are used to hearing words like that from the crowd, is not so shocking to them, perhaps, to bother giving the words themselves such power.

Does Terry have previous record for saying racist things?

Original poster
Condover · 09/07/2012 12:51

Voles, I don't think either of them would win any prizes for good character TBH, but I understand Terry is claiming that anyone who knows him knows he's not racist - he does good works for the Kick it Out campaign you know Wink

OP posts:
mayorquimby · 09/07/2012 13:02

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Yama · 09/07/2012 13:08

Would you really Mayor?

Seems a bit shortsighted considering how easily things can be taken out of context.

I still don't believe him.

mayorquimby · 09/07/2012 13:17

I'm not saying it would be clever and I've never been accused of anything like that but in the heat of an argument if someone made a claim like that out of nowhere id think it so ridiculous and pathetic that I'd try and make a show of them.

I don't believe either ad Ferdinand says he wasn't aware of any racial element until his gf showed him a video later so it makes no sense.

chicaguapa · 09/07/2012 13:22

I believe him. Ashley Cole has stuck up for him and I'm sure if he thought JT was a racist, he wouldn't have done. Anton Ferdinand himself has said he doesn't think it was racist.

The charge is that the words he used demonstrated hostility based on Anton Ferdinand being black. Whether he said it or not, any hostility was based on the fact that they were trading insults like a couple of school boys, not because of his race.

I don't condone the use of mentioning his race in an insult but I think after however many uses of the word c*, he'd probably run out of all the words in his vocabulary. Hmm

Original poster
Condover · 09/07/2012 14:17

I'm not sure I believe either of them TBH. Terry's story seems unlikely, but I also don't see how Ferdinand can have been completely unaware at the time.

I also think it's an odd system that can bring a case when the "victim" didn't know the offense had occurred.

OP posts:
EdithWeston · 09/07/2012 14:23

I can't quite make sense of how the lunchtime news has reported the testimony so far. It seemed to be saying that Terry was repeating insults that Ferdinand had already hurled. Which logically means Ferdinand called Terry a black , which is of course nonsensical.

Perhaps it will become clearer after more testimony?

mayorquimby · 09/07/2012 14:59

No terry is saying that Ferdinand accused him of calling Ferdinand a black cunt and he repeated this in denying the accusation.

So Terry's version is more or less
AF; did you call me a black cunt
Jt; I never called you a black cunt

EdithWeston · 09/07/2012 15:05

Thanks - that's far more logical. But not a version events that fits with Ferdinand's testimony as things stand so far.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2012 18:18

I'm still mystified why adding the word 'black' to any string of expletives automatically makes it worse. Professional sportsmen shouldn't be slinging insults or making hand gestures. I think these two seem as bad as each other.

clam · 09/07/2012 18:26

I think that JT is lying through his teeth, frankly. You have only to look at his facial expression on the video. That wasn't a "What? Moi?" expression. It was a "you b* c**" one.

CharlieBoo · 09/07/2012 22:06

Ferdinand is loving the press and drama from all this.. Makes him feel important... Can't stick either of them but why the hell wasnt Suarez had up in court for what he said to Evra?! It's a witch hunt on John Terry's part!!

iceandsliceplease · 09/07/2012 22:19

CharlieBoo in the Suarez/Evra case, I don't think there was any direct footage (it seemed like much more 'he said/I said'), plus there was a language/cultural slant. In this case, it was seen clearly on telly at the time.

I can't stand John Terry and find it all too believable that he might have said something like this. Whether he did or not I guess we'll find out soon enough.

As for Anton Ferdinand, I think it's perfectly possible that he wasn't aware of what Terry said to him until later - they'd had a clear the air meeting in the dressing room after the match and the 'black c*' comment wasn't brought up then, although Ashley Cole (whom I like about as much as I like John Terry) told Ferdinand 'You can't talk like that to JT' - presumably it's ok for JT to speak to Ferdinand in the way he did? Hmm

edam · 09/07/2012 23:17

I don't understand why Terry is apparently such a hate figure in the first place. So he went out with someone who used to go out with another player - so what? (OK, he was married at the time, that's bad, but not unprecedented and most adulterers don't attract such hatred - what gets football fans heated seems to be that he went out with someone else's ex.) Do they think they have perpetual ownership rights in their former partners or something?

CharlieBoo · 10/07/2012 06:42

Suarez called Evra a LOT worse and used the term about 10 times during the match, and admitted it and no court case.

Any other player would not be hauled up in court in this way. The tax payers money is being completely wasted here, the most John terry can get is a 2.5k fine!! It's a joke! It's a witch hunt because of his previous infidelities. Do you think Lampars would be in court for this? Ferdinand didn't even hear it, but He saw his chance for hos little bit of limelight and to stitch John Terry up.

EdithWeston · 10/07/2012 06:56

Players use foul language in every match. They are not prosecuted.

Whether or not you think the captain of the England football team should be prosecuted for including racial terms in addition to profanity probably comes down to whether or not you support the aims of the "kick out racism" campaign.

CharlieBoo · 10/07/2012 07:04

I agree with the campaign, it's the inconsistencies that I disagree with, one rule for one and one rule for another....

Lottapianos · 10/07/2012 07:19

'I don't condone the use of mentioning his race in an insult but I think after however many uses of the word c*, he'd probably run out of all the words in his vocabulary'

Indeed Grin

Apparently AF said that he as ok with being called a 'c', because he would expect that Hmm but 'black c' was beyond the pale. I agree with Cogito, I think both insults are equally foul - what the hell are grown men doing insulting each other like this? They all need to grow up by the sounds of it.

Alibabaandthe40nappies · 10/07/2012 07:20

He is a bullshitting cunt.

clam · 10/07/2012 07:57

"I don't understand why Terry is apparently such a hate figure in the first place"

I don't suppose it's all about this though, or him shagging someone else's ex. I suspect he's generally loathed. I have to say I think he looks an extremely nasty piece of work. I feel very sorry for his wife.

hackmum · 10/07/2012 09:22

I do think this trial is a waste of money. I deplore racism and think that calling someone a "black c" is pretty vile but context is everything, isn't it? These are two not-very-articulate blokes, losing their tempers and abusing each other in a football match, which I imagine happens all the time, and one of them, instead of just being abusive, was racially abusive. So it's OK in the law to call someone a "c" but not a "black c*".

I imagine this sort of language is heard all the time on the terraces, but do any of the fans ever get prosecuted for inciting racial hatred? Nope.

It's a matter that could easily have been dealt with by the FA.

mayorquimby · 10/07/2012 13:37

I don't understand why Terry is apparently such a hate figure in the first place. So he went out with someone who used to go out with another player - so what? (OK, he was married at the time, that's bad, but not unprecedented and most adulterers don't attract such hatred"

Nothing to dowith the adultery he was hated long before that by football fans.
Mainly for his self-im

mayorquimby · 10/07/2012 13:41

Portant lionheart bullshit. Partly for being a terrible cheat on the pitch with a god comes. The parking in disabled spaces, pissing in night clubs, selling tours of. Chelsea training ground on the sly and abusing Americans in an airport about 9/11 the day after it happened all just help.
He's just a bit of a twat who was overhyped by certain parts of the media p