Shamima Begum loses appeal

[TheRedBalloon]

Just seen that the Supreme Court have ruled that she cannot return to the UK, her Appeal has been unsuccessful.

but if that’s the case, why not Irish Republican teenagers in Kilburn or teenage incels everywhere?

Err heard of Bloody Sunday, they just shot Irish teenagers instead.

I don’t give a shit about Shemima Begum - she can rot as far as I’m concerned but I wish that all the male Jihadis who have silently slunk back to the UK were being given the same media attention and hate as this young woman.

You have a point there

No remorse.

No sympathy.

No return.

You can’t go bleating human rights when you have left to join those who rejoice in murdering aid workers.

Right decision.

As my old nan would say ‘made yer bed now lie in it’.

@AnneElliott

As others have said, the case determining her appeal against deprivation of citizenship can still go ahead. This decision merely says that she isn't entitled to come here for the appeal.

I have to be careful what I say on here so will make no comment about the decision re citizenship, but for those wanting us to 'bring her here' who do you think should do that? Sending the military in to that camp would start WW3 therefore it's got to be civilians. And the group that runs the camp are unlikely to release her to a man. So you're asking a female civil servant - one of my foreign office colleagues to go in there and get her?

Far too dangerous and I don't know anyone who would be up for that job.

Nice to hear an informed view.

I think a lot of us as Jo Public are often guilty of thinking that there magical personnel with magic wands who can magically make anything at all happen under any prevailing conditions, but less inclined to listen to informed assessments of situations in the ground, risk etc.

Sorry @MarieFromStTropez I’m so cross about all this and that was far too terse.

I’m so sorry that you lost a friend in that way and I completely agree they are unspeakable monsters.

I’m bewildered anyone would defend any of them.

Absolutely the right decision.

Has she had another baby?!

@WitchesBritchesPumpkinPants

Well said and I couldn't agree more.

Shes unrepentant

@Sumwin1 yes we do, we do know what views influences her to go to Syria and join IS. She talks herself about watching beheading videos etc., in Britain before going. She gives an interview about her motivations. We know exactly what she is saying - that’s the point! She sought out IS after viewing material online and in TV news reports because they aligned with her ideology

I would have let her back in tbh. I don’t think what she did was too awful. She watched some videos as a teenager, thought entering a war zone was a good idea. Had a truly dreadful time , giving birth 3 times no medical assistance and 3 infants dying.

@stairway
The Daily Telegraph reported that SB served in ISIL's "morality police", and also tried to recruit other young women to join the jihadist group. She was allowed to carry a Kalashnikov rifle and was a strict enforcer of ISIL's laws, such as dress codes for women. An anti-ISIL activist told The Independent that there are separate allegations of "Begum [stitching] suicide bombers into explosive vests so they could not be removed without detonating".

Hardly just watching some videos

As I understand it, the right to Bangladeshi citizenship by descent is absolute if under a certain age. The fact that she hasn't applied is irrelevant. It would be relevant if she had been older at the time of the decision (over 21 i think)

@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

I thought the issue wasn't so much that she had been radicalised, but that she was unrepentant and regarded as a terror threat.

Absolutely this ^

‘ Extracts of MI5 assessments of the dangers posed by the return of those who joined Isis were read out on Monday at the start of a two-day hearing challenging the decision to revoke Begum’s citizenship and refuse her leave to enter the UK.
Sir James Eadie QC, for the Home Office, told the court the assessments gauged that Begum presented a serious threat “justifying the removal of her British citizenship and … the placing of serious impediments in the way of her return to the UK.”

I wish people would stop with their misplaced sympathy and outrage - this is a harsh decision by the Supreme Court ffs - the highest court in the land - these decisions are not taken lightly - she did not decide at 15 to go and smoke a spliff or do a line of coke with her mates in the park, shoplift or beat someone up - she researched, chose and prepared to go halfway across the globe and ally herself to a dangerous terrorist organisation.

She now wants forgiveness and to come back to the country she has a searing dislike and disrespect for - I’m sure her ideology will be better served where she is.

I have Muslim friends and 2 half Turkish children - no one I know thinks it is in any way reasonable or sensible for the UK to honour her British citizenship - she forfeited that by making such a reckless and dangerous choice.

But I think the debate about whether she has been made stateless is a slightly different issue anyhow. She can still appeal that.

I think the decision that she doesn't need to be in the UK for the case to happen is not unreasonable. I'm not really sure why she needs to be in the country for that to happen. It's going to be lawyers arguing the case, what contribution can she possibly make?

@toocold54

I wouldn't trust her at all and I do believe she still holds terrorist views. She should never be allowed back into the UK.

Why do people think she is more of a risk to the UK if she was imprisoned here? I would have thought it was the opposite.

Because if she was here, especially speaking out about Isis, their supporters may plan terror attacks to get her or just attack us. More innocent people could be killed due to her. Let her stay in the camp forever.

Right decision. Very dangerous individual.

@Wearywithteens,and their names are.....?

@stairway

I would have let her back in tbh. I don’t think what she did was too awful. She watched some videos as a teenager, thought entering a war zone was a good idea. Had a truly dreadful time , giving birth 3 times no medical assistance and 3 infants dying.

Ah that's ok then.

What about:
'When interviewed, Begum revealed that she .... did not regret her decision to join ISIL. She said she had been unfazed by seeing the head of a beheaded man as he was "an enemy of Islam". he said she was inspired to join ISIL by videos of fighters beheading hostages and also of "the good life" under the group. When asked about the Manchester Arena bombing, she claimed it was wrong to kill innocent people, but that ISIL deemed it justified as retaliation for the coalition bombing of ISIL-held areas. When questioned about the rape, enslavement and murder of Yazidi women, she claimed, "Shia do the same in Iraq". Ah that's ok then.
Also:
Reported that Begum served in ISIL's "morality police", and also tried to recruit other young women to join the jihadist group. She was allowed to carry a Kalashnikov rifle and earned a reputation as a strict enforcer of ISIL's laws, such as dress codes for women. An anti-ISIL activist told The Independent that there are separate allegations of "Begum [stitching] suicide bombers into explosive vests so they could not be removed without detonating".
But hey-ho she didn't nothing much in particular.
I watched her interview, she was cold and matter of fact about beheadings and explained away why ISIL did particular things - rape and kill..... Not a particularly nice individual.

Anyway all of that is irrelevant the law of the land denies her. I would feel the same if it was a female joining a white terrorist organisation as well.

She has no remorse. She deserves to stay exactly where she wanted to be.

@gildalilly

This is shocking. I can't believe we can just abandon a citizen. She was a child.

I can't believe she's completely unrepentant and does not condemn the actions of those she travelled to support.

@cuddlymunchkin

I think it's a good result.

Me too.

I'm ok with it. Unlike every other set of terrorists, Isis can and do kill people in the UK.

Ms B can have her chance to speak on Zoom - exactly as she would in London at the moment.

I am torn on this as I do feel for her in a weird way - but I do think its the right decision. The only two justifications I can think of are a. woman b. 'child'

If we do this for Begum we must let in all the men who joined isis.
The age of criminal responsibility in this country is 10 - she was 15 and a half when she left.

Remorse is nothing to do with it! It’s about whether she poses a terrorists threat. The Supreme Court was persuaded she did, so she cannot come back in person to plead her case about citizenship. She cannot, at the moment, pursue citizenship but could in the future. Except no one can predict when that will be. She remains stateless and I don’t suppose any country will open their arms to her.

We are talking about her returning to U.K. to face U.K. courts and U.K. justice. She left at 15 at that point she was a child, she should have been protected. Her subsequent actions were apalling but the U.K. should take the moral ground I how she is treated.

That’s the positive aspect of being out of the EU - we don’t have to comply with the ‘human rights’ laws they impose.

National security trumps individual wants/needs.