Insomnia friends - I will sleep well tonight because I have told my unconscious I will

[BeckyBendyLegs]

And here it is!

Actually DH is coming around to the idea of ADs as he sees that I need a bit of a break from this stress I am putting myself under. But I've been skepitcal about them too for ages and ages (partly because I felt so crap taking fluoxitine). I've learnt a lot more about them though and recently found out my niece has taken and is back on the same sort you and CountryLover take as she says she has had big anxiety and insomnia issues. She also said, interestingly, she's never had any problems coming off them (one of my worries).

I slept really well, think I actually slept through the night without waking for the first time in ages!
Am feeling a bit down and tired at the moment though, a bit flat. Starting to worry about going back to work and sorting all of that out. Am also struggling a bit with feeding DD, some days it goes OK and other days she doesn't like anything. I thought that weaning would be 'fun' but it's quite tricky.
GetDown I've seen a book in the bookshop I think you recommended, the mindful way through depression or something like that? It has a CD with it? Maybe I'll get it, but like Becky said where do we get the time to read/do these things?! I read about two pages of my book each evening and that's it.

Arcadia weaning is so hit and miss sometimes. They aren't very consistent, babies! Drives me potty sometimes. It can be very rewarding when they enjoy something you've made but frustrating when they just reject it or won't eat at all.

I read my book: pushing the pushchair, in the loo, in the bath, while cooking, while everyone is watching CBeebies, whenever I get the chance! But I want to read for pleasure then though, not textbooky books.

Only one friend came round for coffee today - one other was working and the other had a sick child to look aftr. But it was nice to chat. I just worry about the state of the house - I am not at all like my mother-in-law!!!!

Arcadia it is so true that we have no time to do these mindfulness things. I have started reading the stuff WillSurvive sent me and it is useful. I could send it on to you afterwards if you like.

Oh I hated the weaning stage. The number of times I would cook up a batch of about 20 portions of something, only for DD to screw up her face and go "yuk" it used to drive me mad.

She's no better now, but at least if she doesn't eat it, I can eat it, or it goes to the dog. Not even the dog would eat purees

I agree time is a massive factor with regards to mindfulness. That book was ok but in retrospect I needed something more practical. It just seemed very "floaty" and "airy-fairy" I couldn't really get to grips with it.

Had another bad night, only four nights after the lsat one. DH is in Manchester today and I knew that he had no choice as it is for intervierws so that probably triggered it. I also have a meeting with DS2's new nursery teacher this am and the CMHT woman later. I am a tight ball of stress, wound up so tight I feel really unwell (sick and just stomach in total knots of anxiety). What is wrong with me? Why can't I just be normal like I used to be? I'm not sure how much longer I can do this, mindfulness aside. The anxiety about sleep is just the stupidist thing and it isn't going away and I don't know why - it's there all the time like a bad smell. I just want to curl up and go to sleep. I slept about 2-3 hours last night after using the ipod (two different ones - Paul McKenna first and another chap next). I guess I am a lost cause now. Why aren't I coping? I don't get it. I'm not sure how much longer I can stay positive. I'm not getting better.

Sorry Becky that you had another bad night. Just a hint of stress and it is bad news for us isn't it. I can't offer you any answers I am afraid. I know you hate to take tablets but do you think something mild might just break the cycle?
Stay strong today, let the MH people know how bad it gets for you when this happens.

I just want it to go away and I can return to how I used to be. This is just pants squared in my opinion. I'm a happy person. I'm not depressed at all. So where is this anxiety coming from? Ah well. The sun is shining. The DSs are happy today. It is 'wrong trousers' day where they have to wear PJ bottoms to school! Make the most of it and all that, what else can I do? Smile and keep bollocking on.

Try and get an early night tonight to give your self plenty of time to sleep I find the more hours I get before 12 the better I feel.

oh no becky

It's good you've got the CMHT lady today - at least this will be an opportunity for her to see you on a "not so good" day, as well as a good day?

When I'd had a rubbish night and I had an appointment the next day I used to comfort myself in the fact they would see how much this was affecting me without me having to describe it whilst feeling well!

I know that's not much consolation. It's totally understandable and the sleep anxiety is NOT the "stupidist" thing - it is actually a very logical thing.

You are a sensible person, you aren't just making this up. This sleep problem is a real problem. I know it feels like it will never go away, but gradually gradually you WILL get better. I am not fully there myself yet, but I have so many coping strategies now, and so do you.

I do fear sometimes that once you have sleep anxiety, do you always have it? How can you ever get "back to normal" - but the truth is we have learnt so much, have so many weapons now in our fight against it. I do believe that it is possible to be free of sleep anxiety.

FWIW I didn't have a great night either. Some friends came over last night and one made me a non-decaff tea without asking what I wanted and I was too unassertive and pathetic to say "oh no, I don't want that!" So I drank it and then was awake till about 1am.

You will be ok today. Tell the CMHT woman about it - hopefully she will be really helpfulx

how are you doing at the moment topsi?

Just got back from CMHT. Embarrassed myself by bursting into tears when I got there.

It was very useful again. She was focussing on why I have this anxiety about not coping / not getting enough sleep and she asked me lots of questions about my childhood, which I didn't expect. I had to wrack my brains a bit. She wonders whether part of my problem is to do with my dad's mental health (he had a 'nervous breakdown' (whatever that is - I'm not even sure really it's quite an old-fashioned term, isn't it?) when I was little and she thinks I am expecting the same to happen to me since I supposedly 'take after' him. She also talked about my love of routine and how babies upset routine and that has upset my sleep this time. Perhaps. I don't know.

She said, like you guys have said, I need to be kind to myself and just not get so cross with myself. I know this though! Doesn't make it easy for me to do though.

She did say I could always go back to the GP and try a different type of ADs but to be honest I have no faith in my GPs ability to know what to prescribe me, and when I am happy and sleeping I am fine! I don't know. I really don't know, guys, what to do.

She also went on about relaxation techniques and stuff again. She talked about lavender and herbal teas. Yeah, yeah, yeah!

I had to take DS3 with me, but he was very, very good, bless him.

Crikey I haven't had any lunch yet!

lavendar and herbal teas, I am not a violent person, but that would have tempted me!! Honestly, these people. Clearly have not experienced true insomnia.

Glad you found it kind of helpful tho... but why is she batting you back to the GP? For goodness sake, the GP referred you because it was beyond his expertise. You are being referred for their expertise. From what you've described this woman does not sound like she's a psychiatrist. You need to ask to see the psychiatrist. Lavendar indeed.

We've had this discussion before about depression - you do not actually have to be depressed to benefit from ADs. ADs are also prescribed for anxiety and for sleep problems. That bloke at my expensive London Sleep Clinic appointment helpfully explained that they are not separate things, they are all inter-connected. Same neurotransmitters involved in depression, anxiety and sleep.
Have you thought about giving mirtazapine a go, I know you are reluctant but you could try it just for two weeks and see what you think. If you change your mind you can always stop...

Interesting about what she said about your dad. I don't know you obviously, but I would doubt that is really what this is all about. You have had some kind of post-natal thing and that can happen to anyone regardless of their "past". FWIW there is no history of mental illness in any of my family, despite psychologists / psychiatrists etc. desperately trying to link it to something!!

PS, bursting into tears in appointments is nothing to be embarrassed about.

I do it all the time.

Just wanted to add that I've had chronic insomnia all my adult life and the only AD that ever helped it (tried a few)was mirtrazapine.

Obviously not qualified to give you direct advice about drugs but thought this may be useful for you are thinking of ADs anyway.

hiya lela is mirtazapine the one you are taking now? I saw from your other thread you are taking an AD but didn't know which one...

I found it better than zopiclone and temazepam in terms of sleep improvement, and not addictive either

no no I wish i could but cant in pregnancy, hence the temamzepan

Perhaps mental health professionals just want to find links then. I was very surprised when she suddenly started asking about my childhood and it seemed a bit probing really. She kept saying 'I think this thing goes deeper'. I said 'I think it's because at Christmas my sleep first went and I would beg DH to stay at home so now I fear that I won't cope when he's at work' and she said 'no it must go further back than that'.

She has referred me for CBT - waiting list is 12 months. I guess that's bad.

I give up. Do I go back to the GP? Seems a bit pointless really as you say he referred me because he was clueless. So there is no-one to help me really if I wanted medication that wasn't fluoxitine.

I do go back to see her in two weeks.

Lela how is your sleep now? I wouldn't say I have chronic insomnia. I'd say it is occassional, usually about once a week on average. I have no idea whether that is 'bad' enough for ADs or not?

that's weird as the psychiatrist I saw said that mirtazapine is fine in pregnancy - they sometimes even prescribe it for morning sickness.

you need to ask to see the psychiatrist becky - there will be one in the CMHT - I am a bit that you haven't seen him / her already TBH.

I just feel like giving up on the lot of them right now and carrying on as I have been. I can't cope with the hassle - so many other things to do and worry about - time to go get DS1 and DS2!

DS3 is being so cute at the moment. He's lying on the floor going 'dedaadeedaaa' and playing with a box. I adore that baby

I think you should be able to see the psychiatrist too Becky, it is worth a go. The waiting list for CBT is crap!! 12 months?!
A low dose AD mayhelp you sleep and reduce the anxiety.
Am feelin' a bit low Get Down, nothing in life seems to give me any joy at the moment. Life is just not much fun. Sleep is okish, have good and bad days.
How are you are you any further with the restless leg diagnosis?

becky my sleep is pretty much non existant right now and causing me huge problems.

I havent read your whole thread, but not sleeping just once a week or so does sound pretty manageable. However you do sound like it gets to you quite a bit, so I really dont know whether you should try ADs.

What I would say is that I took zopiclone years ago and it really worked, but it is meant only to be used in short term apparently and I became totally addicted to it. I personally believe that if I'd had better psychological help with my emotional health back then I may not have needed to be on medication all these years since- it just became that I gave in and believed I could never sleep naturally. I have not slept well since childhood and it seems to stem from never having felt safe and secure in my home or with my parents. Then about 14 years ago I had a sudden bereavement, started on the sleeping pills (instead of talking about it and accepting that I couldnt cope as had no support) and been on and off them ever since really. Everyone is different, but I now accept that these things do tend to have a root cause. So if you dont think you need ADs as its not affecting your life too badly yet, maybe talking through your underlying anxieties may still help.

Sorry to go on, I'm not meaning to take over your thread just have a LOT of experience of insomnia, and hoped any of it may be of any use to you.

LeLa don't worry at all about it - it's good to hear your experience. I feel like such a wimp for moaning about one bad night a week. You are right it is manageable. I should just toughen up and get on with it really. I can cope through these tired days. Even though DH is away until 9pm today I have coped really well today. It is just odd that I can't seem to convince myself that I can cope and still dread these days. I don't get it.

I did take zopiclone for 2 weeks and hated every minute of every day of those two weeks as I was much, much more anxious than I am now as I worried myself into a frenzy about getting addicted (I was obsessively googling zopiclone and found some horrendous stories). This was when the insomnia first started after Christmas, at that time I am sure it was hormonal, a result of post-natal hormones. I then moved on to diazepam, then herbal tablets, then tried homeopathy and finally hypnotherapy (where I am now really).

I feel for you, I really do, coping with your insomnia and pregnancy. You are doing brilliantly under the circumstances. I've seen your other thread too.

Listen I didn't for one second mean that you need to "toughen up and get on with it"- I would never say something like that. What I meant was it may sound manageable but its obviously really affecting you.

Its nice that you think I am coping well- specially as I'm lying on my sofa with a splitting headache looking and feeling like death right now haha.

You sound like you do have some form of anxiety (again not read your full thread) and all i was trying to say is that if you dont think ADs are the answer getting to the root of those feelings may help- sorry if you have already tried this I know its frustrating when people suggest stuff you've already done. When you dont sleep it can become an obsession which is counterproductive, I know thats what happened to me over the years, and having to stop all medication when I got pregnant and all the other stress that was going on for me is what has sent me over the edge now. There is a lot of hope for you to beat this still.

Noooo - I was kind of talking to myself really I know you didn't mean that at all. I think I need to toughen up about the sleep! The anxiety is bugging me. I did try fluoxitine and it sent me almost round the twist with insomnia and anxiety so stopped after 3 days. People keep telling me that I didn't give it long enough, but there was no way I could carry on. The GP doesn't seem to know what else to try really except diazepam which the CMHT woman described as 'evil' the first time I saw her! So I'm a bit stumped really. I know that mirtzapine is a great AD for anxiety and insomnia and also the one that CountryLover takes do-something I forgot but I don't feel able to just suggest these to the GP really. He's supposed to know more than me. So hey ho keep going on!