I lied to ds about his pip. Because he was violent.

[Pipanger]

In a nut shell. Ds has some mental health issues. He was very aggressive and violent to me. It was awful and went on for sometime. Eventually ds went into supported accommodation. But he was still at my house alot more so than the accommodation he would spend most of his days amd nights in my house. Eating food, doing washing . Using the gas/electric.

Because of his aggression and violence. I couldn't explain to him that he needed to pay his way. So I lied to him about his pip. I told him that he was getting middle rate when he was actually getting heigh rate. I did this so I could take just under 300 for monthly house keeping

Things have changed now hes not really stayed at my house for the past 3 months. So I can't justify taking that money anymore. I have been saving it for him for the past 3 months.

The problem is that I lied but I done it out of safety and the fact I couldn't afford to pay for the stuff he was using.

But now hes not here he needs the full amount the problem is it don't want it to cause a massive fall out. I cant even just tell him theres been a change in his rate here's the money. Because hes claiming for a free bus pass and needs the proof of pip. So hes going to know when it all started. I cant just say you had to pay your way because he doesn't think he should and doesn't really know the cost of running things.

Hes also extremely bad with money his money is gone within 2-3 days of payment. Then he borrows money of everyone he knows. And the extra money he gets wont change that as he will do the same thing. Im an ideal world I would like to keep saving it for him

I have not been told that at all i even asked about it. I won't be discussing that side of it but longer because I know I didn't do wrong. He couldn't live in my house for free. And I wasn't willing to put myself at risk .

He doesn't have a social worker. There's no one i can contact.

I do agree that its now better for ds to have complete control of all money. That would i can completely step away money wise and there's no risk of something simlar happening again . If he has his full money then can t come to me.

Also hes been told he has 6 months to proove himself where he has to make sure he doesn't get into rent arrears. He buys food/cooks . Looks after himself. Can help himself regarding his mental health . So his full pip needs to be a part of that learning that's hes doing over the next 6 months .

What do you mean "good understanding of the value of money"?

OP actually said
doesn't really know the cost of running things.
He's also extremely bad with money his money is gone within 2 -3 days of payment. Then he borrows money of everyone he knows.

How can that possibly mean what you claimed she said, "good understanding of the value of money"?

The usual concocted mumsnet stuff....

And the usual questioning of why someone is receiving PIP, as if DWP have got their assessment wrong.

There's always one.
You suit your username, by the way.

What a load of codswallop!

He was under 18.
OP was his appointee.
The money was paid into HER account.

Behave yourself!

Just because you're an appointee it doesn't mean you can do what you want with the money. Your job is to manage the money on that person's behalf, with their knowledge, not hide it from them. It's their money, not yours.
I have a disabled 20 year old son, he is difficult and aggressive at times, i wouldn't dream of lying to him about the money that is rightfully his.

My son was physically violence to me. He couldn't live at my house for free. I wasn't going to put myself at risk.

It seems to me that people want to down play his violence and for me to put myself at risk . Yet if i was saying my partner was violent and aggressive there would be more understanding.

I'm not saying he should have been living there for free. You should have told him what you were doing with his money. It's his money not yours. My son has also been physically violent to me, it doesn't give me right to do what I want with his money.

Well im sorry but I wasn't willing to get physically hurt by him. I didn't deserve it snd my younger kids didn't deserve to witness it .

You're not sorry though. You're more worried about getting caught out.

No im more worried about my safety..

Doesn't justify lying about not giving him the full amount of a benefit awarded in his name though. That's wrong and you know this hence this thread.

It would be helpful to separate out the violence- it makes more sense when that is separate from the payments.

So- some of his PiP was given directly to him. Some of his PiP covered his expenses at your house.
That’s fine.

When it became apparent he hadn’t come back much, that part of the money had accumulated slightly- so he has a small pot of savings.
That’s fine.

You were unable to discuss how his money was managed with him, because of his aggressive behaviour. You needed to protect yourself.
That’s fine.

You are now looking forward to being relieved of the responsibility of managing his money. You needed to protect help to manage that transition as he will be angry about some of the historic decisions you made in his best interests.

You also need to be really clear with him going forward that there is no money at your house for him to spend- no extra food, no extra hot water etc. The clearer you are initially, the easier the transition will be for him. Over time you can relax it a bit, but initially you need to be really clear- Fred, your hot water is at Your house. Shower there. Fred your food is at your house. Eat there. Fred that is my dinner. You mustn’t eat it.

What should she have done?
She had every right to use some money to cover his costs at her house.
She couldn’t tell him she was doing that without him flying into a rage and lashing out at her.
What should she have done?

It's just all very easy to get muddy isn't it.

A holiday he isn't invited on
Payment plans for credit cards and store cards

There's a reason you aren't supposed to do this.

Yes I went on holiday without him. Im allowed a break he had already been on holiday.

I dont have credit card debt I do have catalogue debt. Which i have worked out a plan to pay it all off .

This had absolutely nothing tk do with ds pip ? Are you implying that's what i use it for? If that was the case I wouldn't have the debts would I. And I wouldn't have been saving ds mire recent money for him would I it would be gone . Its not its there.

I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that's why you aren't supposed to do what you've done. Because it gets all very muddy.

You having a break has nothing to do with it.

I think that the violence massively complicates things here.

My suggestion would be that firstly you try and get the evidence for the bus pass without having the money amounts on the letter. He needs a bus pass, it's good that he is organizing this himself, and it's reasonable that he's asked for a proof of PIP. All of that is very very positive in terms of his development.

With regard to the money, I would just let him know that his pip is going up to x amount from y date. And give him the choice that either you save the difference for him in a separate account in his name (to be used for furnishing a new place) or he has the money into his bank account. Support him to understand the choice, ideally with the help of his support worker, but let him have a free choice.

If he chooses to save, I would just add the PIP savings to his money and not mention them. If he chooses to spend I would hold onto the money just for now, and use it for an emergency in future.

Hi OP, I have a friend who can’t manage her UC and PIP at all - she was paid monthly and all the money used to be spent in the first week, a complete disaster. She asked me for help and we decided it would be better for her to be paid in installments so we asked for 4 payments a month. I was prepared for them turn us down and to try again for fortnightly but they agreed straight away. Might 4 payments a month be a better option for your son? It doesn’t work out on same day every month because it’s 4 a month not weekly if you see what I mean, so it might be 7 days, 7 days, 7 days 10 days in a 31 day month. We literally wrote a message on her UC journal saying she was getting into debt because she couldn’t manage monthly payments and could she switch to 4 a month and they replied within a couple of days to say yes and it will start next month. Might be worth a try?

So are you saying because I went on holiday and have debts i should not have been looking after his money?

I mean, you've lied so I think you'll have to tell another lie. Just say they have awarded him the higher rate, and lucky him, he doesn't need to do an assessment.

You know it's not right what you did but if it was for your own safety just carry on with one more lie and then don't get involved in his benefits anymore, and certainly no more lying.

With his ice he gets that every 2 weeks. I will suggest it to him. I doubt he will agree because he likes to see that bigger sum of money. I will definitely suggest it though . It woukd be do much easier.

That's not entirely true.

I can't get up stairs so I need ground floor accommodation which can be more expensive.

My cooking skills depend on my health, sometimes it is meals on wheels, sometimes it is cook from scratch but using utensils like an electric can opener and a food processor to grate cheese.

I might need to buy already prepped veg, they are more expensive, I might need to get a take away.

My clothing needs to be able to slip on without doing up buttons.

So yes everyone has to pay rent, buy food and clothes but with a disability these can be more expensive.

but he is only just 18
so surely apart from the wrong level, taking his money was above board.