Can’t cope with being a transphobe.

[genandtonic]

DD is trans and has been encouraged to move out and go no contact. I thought wearing boys stuff was cool, I’m just not entirely sure testosterone is a good idea. We have been vilified by the school, Friends seem to think they should take sides against me. No one is looking at the real problems underneath.
I thought I was coping, but it’s driving a rift between me and DH and now DS is acting odd.
we desperately need a break and are too stressed to sort it -
My little world is collapsing around me and I now can’t cope. Help!

Thanks alnightingale I can recommend her podcasts, genspect the wider lens. I have to be careful listening though, I’m a bit sensitive atm.
unfotunately my daughter believes t saves lives and is safe, and that we are trying to keep them from being their true selves. Ok, what?
im so so stupid. I really thought it was nothing. Be androgynous! Even Enid blyton has heroines at Malory towers who all have a pash on an older girl. It’s been going on forever. Read Orlando, it’s fab. How, how can we suddenly have trans hate and trans genocide. I don’t actually think anyone cares except in a ‘ oh that’s nice dear’ kind of way.

This is exactly how youngsters are getting caught up in this. It’s being taught at school, promoted on tic toc and other social media platforms, and through friends. It basically a cult. You are following your instincts to protect your child OP. Please don’t feel bad for doing that. I’ve purchased the book “Trans” by Helen Joy in preparation for when my two get exposed to all this. It might offer some useful guidance. She is very knowledgeable on the subject and has done a number of videos on YouTube.

unfotunately my daughter believes t saves lives and is safe, and that we are trying to keep them from being their true selves.

Have you asked why she thinks she needs to be physically more "male" to be a boy/man?

Surely that is a very transphobic belief she is voicing to you? That they can't be a boy in a female body because boys are male? What's the difference between that and "terfs"?

https://x.com/psychgirl211/status/1808825717204922755?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

OP reflect on this.

Teenage girls beig swept up in psychological trends which harm them has a long history.

All the attempts to smear and to tell kids identifying as trans follow the pattern of cults. Here are some of the key features of cults which may feel familiar:

• Simplified goal or aim structure, such as to save something or introduce something to everyone.
• A society history, most new initiates are invariably required to learn and respect.
• There is a degree of intellectual limitation, so outside ideas or interaction with non members are not encouraged
• There is also a system of repercussions, such as shunning, "time out" or isolating or demotion.
• There is a system of development, so a person may be groomed or encouraged to go towards.
• Members are encouraged to do certain practices, methods and techniques and only those. There is no exploration, modification or comparison with other similar or different systems.
• The screening of new potential members is quite large as they filter looking for suitable like minded, or easily mold-able people.
• There is a noticeable degree of repetition, so ideas and mantras are encourage to make people think the same way.
• There is a medium degree of personal image inflation to make certain figures appear greater than they really were and that association with them is a great or noble thing.
• Members are all very similar and have minimal contact with the outside world, or the real world.
• There is a substantial amount of time, money, thought and encouragement invested in promotion, lobbying and marketing.
• Tax free status a major aspiration, or have already attained that.
• Manipulation of initiates is obvious to outsiders.
• It is very difficult, if not impossible to leave their society. The aim is to make the new person addicted to or so familiar with the cult that the person loses the ability to be independent, or their fears of repercussions are too high.
• There is a high degree of mental stagnation, so that there is a focusing on key principles or myths and general day to day knowledge is encouraged to be forgotten.
• There is a degree of mentally stressful or intensive practices. These maybe long meditation retreats with little sleep or food, high intensive workouts or other things. They may be branded with an element of mystique and privilege.
• There is an amount of secrecy surrounding the beliefs or inner workings of the organization as opposed to transparency.
• All actions committed by members are justified or will be praised. Martyrdom may be encouraged.
• There is a very effective propaganda system as well as intensive (but covert) political lobbying.
• There is not always a vast leadership structure, but there can be. The more manipulative cult leadership prefers a wide gap between their status and others so may practice a more flat working hierarchy.
• There is a top-down structure where the people on the bottom aren't allowed to question or challenge anyone above them.
• There is a definite separation from society.
• They discourage interaction with "non members" or those with a different ways of looking at things. In effect there is an entrenched discouragement to change ideas, while having a trained loyalty system. There is also a degree of reverence for political leaders in the past, only if they were of that particular party, but members who cross the floor are deemed traitors.
• Cults tend to be most successful recruiting people who are in stages/phases of transition in their life, like people who have lost a job or are going through a divorce.

Thanks popeydokey we’ve not had a chance to. She was, I now realise, isolated and love bombed and turned against us.
thanks redtooth I actually talked to a fabulous chap who runs a charity to support people escape cults. He said as everyone else does, question gently.
this trans thing doesn’t seem to allow that, its ‘ if you question you are transphobic’
’be Kind.. or else’ and the girl teens are swept up .

How old are your children?

This, if you want a relationship and love them, you have to accept them as they are, not their choices.

When will people learn that cults mean that even if you do this, you can lose your child anyway because of the nature of the issue?

Teach your child to question things and ask why generally and if someone says you can't question it, it's a problem. Why can't you question it? Everything should be questionable and not off limits even taboo subjects otherwise communication is restricted and that contains a void which is open to abuse.

We should be able to talk about the hardest and most difficult things in life. If we can't or we won't there is a problem.

We should be able to give answers to our 'enemies' and to understand 'our enemy' because that reduces conflict and increases understanding.

If we are just blocking conversation no one gains and it harms trans people ultimately.

Again: that is what she's doing. It's the people telling the child to change her body that are not accepting her as she is.

Is this intentional gaslighting, or are people using words they don't understand?

It’s fine to say accept your child, of course I do.
is it fine to accept your child taking life shortening drugs? Remember all the female athletes that took steroids? A lot now dead of heart attacks. No I don’t know exact figures.
one is enough.
We did say we accept your choices. I took her to buy boys clothes. I think it’s her partner that didn’t accept us - she pressured DD into believing we’d be cross, unaccepting , lying etc.
our therapist said what we described is a coercive relationship.
we are happy to apologise for stuff we have unintentionally done wrong - but we can’t! She is not giving us, or not being allowed to give us, chance to talk to her.
everyone just says, ‘oh you must be transphobic then’ . come on. What does that actually mean?

• where is the definition of transphobic? How is our behaviour measured against that? I have seen no tick boxes . Why have friends decided they have the moral right to judge us? how do we defend ourselves when we don’t know the definition of the crime? why is an unhealthy manipulative relationship not being recognised’because it’s trans’ i don’t know whether I’m angry, sad, grieving, if up is down. It is SO hard. And friends say, ‘oh she’d have moved out anyway’ well yes, but also very much well no. thanks redtoothbrush and pokeydokey

Have you read the Cass report?

It sounds really hard for you at the moment, and it doesn’t sound like you are a transphobe.
Is your child under 18? If you are concerned about coercive control/emotional abuse then a safeguarding referral to children’s services might be appropriate.

otherwise if they are no contact can you get a card or letter to them. Just to let them know you accept them however they are and you’re there when they are ready?

otherwise for the coping with overwhelm…this is one situation where mindfulness might help, or grounding exercises. This is a bad situation right now, but you can get through it.

Is your daughter an adult now?

Thanks dangermouse yes she’s now an adult.

Then unfortunately unless your adult child is vulnerable or you suspect a criminal offence is happening there is nothing you can do other than keep the lines of communication open.

I remember your previous threads OP and it's clear how much you love and miss her. Unfortunately, you really do need to let her go. Focus on yourself first, your own wellbeing, do what makes you happy.

Don't talk to your ds about her unless he brings it up as he has been caught up in all this and she is always the priority. Let him lead a normal life now. If your DH is still badgering you to 'solve' the problem tell him to stop now.

Remember about letting the line go slack. Be there if she contacts you, be friendly but don't ask intrusive questions. What it boils down to is that you actually have no choice. You cannot change her situation, all you can do is look after yourself.

I know it's tough. If it's any consolation one of my siblings cut our parents out of her life (not for gender stuff) for five years and then came back and they patched it all up and got on great. Some people just need a long time to mature. Let her go, wish her well, think of her often but mostly focus on your own future.

Thanks wallace very kind of you to respond. And very good advice that I will take.
I think every now annd then I get overwhelmed and i really can’t bore my mates in rl any more! also think I’m in an echo chamber. Need to keep away from too much reading, there are some scary facts out there. As hermione says, it’s well worth reading the cass report. And finding out about the quickly buried WPATH files.
look at the fuss caused by the banning of puberty blockers! Yet they are proven to be untested and very definitely harmful.
sorry, rant over!
I always actually thought what would my mum do? And she’d have left me to be an idiot, as she did many times, and was there, always there, when I’d realised I’d been an idiot.
As long as DD is happy. I’m even ambivalent about her taking testosterone now. Or having a double mastectomy. It’s such a permanent change for an impermanent fashion.
These kids will be like the wrinkly punks that still sport Mohicans 20 years after punk.
Obviously I think it’s appalling that this is being shamelessly pushed on kids. But as you say, I’m powerless, and people seem to be so judgmental and determined to force this stuff on kids who are far too young to be dealing with this manufactured stress and confusion.
as you say wallace I’m actually delighted to not be cleaning and what have you/ spending the driving lesson money on stuff for me!
always a silver lining, thanks for letting me de stress.

I've been through a similar situation with my own child, and it felt overwhelming at times. What really helped us was finding a family therapist who specializes in LGBTQ+ issues to mediate and guide us through the emotional and practical challenges. It allowed us to communicate better, understand each other's perspectives, and ultimately bring some stability back to our family. You're not alone, and seeking professional help can make a significant difference.

What matters more to you? Being right on trans issues or your relationship with your child? He's told you who he is, you can choose to accept him or lose him. I'm glad he has other people around him supporting him.

@MrsSunshine2b

OP's daughter is female.

'He's told you who is' does not make her daughter male. It makes her a young woman who wishes she had a male body and because of that is considering taking medication which may cause permanent damage.

If you are asking for respect, it's a 2 way street.

I'm not interested in arguing with you about what you believe to be true about gender. This is not your body, or my body, or OP's body, it belongs to her adult child and only that person has the right to make decisions about it.

OP has a decision to make, she can respect that and rebuild the relationship with her child, or she can continue to try to force her opinion on the matter and lose her child.

Telling her she's right and her child is not who they claim to be, or telling her she's wrong and a bigot, makes no difference to the situation she is in. Personally, I'd choose my child every time- even if I didn't understand, I'd believe them. If OP's beliefs about this are more important to her, she's entitled to choose those.

Does accepting mean telling them to change their body because the type of person they are somehow 'doesn't fit' with it?
Or is it saying 'you're fine as you are'?

@MrsSunshine2b do you believe that boys have a certain type of body - male?

Feel free not to answer or to pretend I asked something else if you're uncomfortable explaining what you think.

You are making a false equivalence argument.

A parent isn't there to necessarily stroke their child and say everything will work out just as they want when there is an underlying issue.

The parent knows because of reality there is a fair chance this will end in tears in someway. Whether that's transition or because there is a health issue caused by transition or a dawning realisation that it limits your long term relationship chances.

And guess what? Who is likely to be the one to pick up the pieces?

If a parent blindly just passively accepts it, then they risk the child later on going "why didn't you stop me / challenge me / question me?" Because unfortunately parents can't win. They are going to get the blame / backlash at some point. Because far too often a presentation of trans is marker for far wider emotional problems.

Many parents think that lying to their kids and going along with trans ideology is only encouraging more issues and is harmful in a variety of ways. So why on earth would they want to bury their head in the sand and ignore it.

The cult like demands that you must comply or you will lose your child are unhelpful and don't reflect the reality that many families are rejected by the person identifying as trans even if they go along with everything because they remain a reminder of the past and because the cult is all about isolation and escalation in search of a goal that ultimately unachievable because its about false promises and impossible standards.

It isn't kind to say someone has changed sex. Because it is impossible to change sex.

This is nonsense.

Honestly this. It isn't about your. Views n9w. Its about loving your child. You can have different views abd still be supportive to your child

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