Brexit Megathread - Part 2 because it's not over by a long shot

[vera99]

Well getting to a 1000 posts didn't take too long so here we are.... everybody welcome!

So I held my nose and watched Thursday's QT. And I am glad I did.

..."We carefully chose the audience to be representative ..."

Of what ? A vote held over 5 years ago ? Why not see what peoples views on the Corn Laws are too, while you're at it.

Also, if you find you are struggling to find Brexit voters who are willing to own their vote, it is perfectly representative. And tells us a lot in itself.

Seem the Brexit row over QT served to minimised the shit Rosie Jones had to put up with for daring to appear in public with disabilities - (contrary to the Equality Act 2010). Especially when we all know she's only in it for the parking - as I am sure JRM would point out if he was asked.

Yes, I have to take any hope where I can just now, DGR.

I have seen Rosie Jones on loads of things, she's a stand up comedian if anyone doesn't know. Some people are twats, but I am sure she's seen off worse. It took me a minute or two to tune in to her this time, I think she was v angry.

Four pages already! PMK with disembodied head of (gammony) cat.

According to another thread Remain failed to mention the economic damage leaving the EU meant.

And that's the truth of it.

Apparently.

Which thread is that?

So what was our Project Fear then, which the Brexiters took delight in taunting us about?

@DGRossetti

According to another thread Remain failed to mention the economic damage leaving the EU meant.

And that's the truth of it.

Apparently.

That was me, I didn't say they failed to mention I said the campaign failed to communicate the economic realities of Brexit.

If anyone here really thinks the remain campaign was a good model for political communication, I hope you won't be involved in any future campaign to rejoin!

@Peregrina

Which thread is that?

So what was our Project Fear then, which the Brexiters took delight in taunting us about?

The point is everything remain said was so easily dismissed. Not helped by Cameron being such a key figure, Labour not fully getting behind it, the tactics taken from Indyref etc.

I am a confirmed remoaner, but the reality was remain campaign was lumpen, boring and badly led.

It’s true that the remain campaign was poor. But I think ironically if you have a case to make that’s really obvious, it can be harder to put it across eloquently. Whereas if you’re randomly making up lies like the leave campaign it’s easier to have eye catching slogans. It’s about focusing on the reality as opposed to the message.

I said the campaign failed to communicate the economic realities of Brexit.

How so? What was being dismissed as Project Fear then? We were treated to guff about easiest deals in history blah de blah, with a lot of la, la, la we are not listening to 'Remoaners'.

I agree that Cameron's case was thin - I thought so at the time. As a Remain supporter, he could have made a strong case for Remain, but chose not to, because for the Tories blaming the EU for Westminster Government failings was a bloody good excuse. This still had had nothing on the blatant lies of the Leave Campaign and Johnson's subsequent 'Oven Ready Deal' which was still to be purchased, never mind put in an oven, with which he won the 2019 election.

If Cameron hadn't had the old Etonian sense of entitlement when in reality he was a lightweight, he would have known to take a leaf out of Harold Wilson's book, and step aside from the Campaign. Wilson himself knew that if he fronted the 1975 campaign it would have been an opportunity to vote on his premiership. He was too crafty to let that happen.

There are myriad reasons why the remain campaign failed, my point is that voters didn't belive or understand how Brexit was going to harm them, their families, their communities, their country economically. I see this as a communication failure, I believe the remain campaign could have communicated better.

Agree Cameron should have stepped back. Corbyn didn't help either.

If they didn't realise then they were paying absolutely no attention whatsoever. There was so much information about the dangers of Brexit. There really was no excuse.

@OrangeBlossomsinthesun

If they didn't realise then they were paying absolutely no attention whatsoever. There was so much information about the dangers of Brexit. There really was no excuse.

I think this attitude from remain is partly why remain lost.

Voters never have anyone to blame but themselves... but wouldn't we have rather won?

We don't get to choose the electorate, campaigners have to work out where people are and work out how to communicate with them.

It just makes me terribly sad, the margin was tight, and watching it all unfurl now is dispiriting.

I agree. Cameron presented the argument 'What is wrong with Brexit' instead of 'What a bargain we get with the EU' but he was more concerned with appeasing the ERG, and it backfired badly on him. The only bonus is that he destroyed his own political career in the process, but no matter, he won't be too worried about the forthcoming price rises.

I've had enough of pandering to people too stupid not to do even the most basic research before deciding who to vote for. There was loads of information everywhere. Even illiterate people can watch the TV.
I didn't get to vote as I'd lived in the EU for over 15 years by then. The vote has meant I can basically never go back there to live unless I want to leave my husband and children. Although tbh I don't even care now. You wouldn't get me back there now.

Immigration was a big pulling point but we are not supposed to mention that, "not all leavers are racist", we kept being told, not sure how the remain campaign could have countered that.

It's always very difficult to campaign to stay in something, especially when promises are dangled like jewelled gonads at every turn to leave it. It's why supermajorities are there for large constitutional changes, or why such referenda are often advisory. Shame we didn't take note.

Yes a super majority should have been in place.

And now we don’t have clean drinking water in some areas. It’s contaminated with E. coli.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10072271/E-coli-tap-water-hits-thousands-homes-Surrey-Kent-residents-advised-boil-water.html

Is that Brexit related? The e.coli thing?

“Water firms had been told by the government last month that they could cut back on the amount of chemicals used to protect water because of Brexit-related supply problems. “

From the article I linked. It looks like it might be related.

Threats to water supply, due to the fact the chemicals were imported, was discussed during the referendum campaign.

I spoke to a friend who’s in that area, he’s now having to boil his water. Hadn’t thought it might be to do with chemical shortages.

It really is the gift that keeps on giving! Tainted waiter, yay!