Brexit Arms. Empty Ditch for sale. Interested parties please contact owner by 12th Dec.

[Epicwaffle]

Apparently the usual landlady over ordered on Bar nuts on the last thread. Just step over them if you find them here, as we haven’t had a chance to clear them up yet.

Welcome to all friendly parties!

First drinks are free!

Shutting down debate is one way of making sure that only those around you affirm your views but it doesn't change statistical reality. And vitriol and name-calling never changed anyone's mind.

True dat Lily!

Agree with rest of your post too - I know a few extreme Brexiters & extreme remainers but the majority are just the normal middle ground:
Leave voters who aren't scorched earth types & Remain voters who are horrified at how much parliament have contorted & twisted to overturn the ref

*My personal experience: Remainers make up ridiculous 'didn't happen' stories and post them on twitter, Leavers go on drunken rants on public transport.

Neither is particularly edifying, tbh*

Goodjob agree with you on "apathetic" Leavers as per my previous post. These "apathetic" Leavers are likely to stay at home in Labour Leave areas rather than voting Labour as they did in 2017. They hold the balance in a lot of seats.

Remainers make up ridiculous 'didn't happen' stories and post them on twitter,

😮😮😮

Are you seriously telling me that there are not hordes of 4 yr olds constructing elegant political & economic arguments pertaining to membership of the EU?!

People aren't literally standing and applauding in prets across the country?!

Damn!

😘😂

Ok, for anyone watching JC, are you even more confused than before? Is he saying they are a sort of leave party now?

Sorry, got one eye here and one on sky atm...

‘Leave, but not really, maybe a little, but maybe not. Either way, nasty tories’

Is that the jist?

A typically incisive article from Charles Moore in the Telegraph on Saturday. He spoke of Jezza's first speech of the new election campaign. Jezza "attacked 'the City and tax dodgers', the 'gilded elites' and, by name, Mike Ashley. The Tories, he complained, were going on about Brexit but this was a distraction from 'the issues that affect people's lives every day'." The answer, declared Jezza, was "change".

Mr Moore then pointed out that this was actually his first speech of the 2017 snap election. He went on to say:

"The 2019 version is largely a cut-and-paste of the 2017 one, although some bright spark has added the word 'real' in front of the word 'change'."

So don't worry, Epic, you haven't missed anything. It's a case of rinse and repeat.

how many Leavers keep quiet in everyday conversation and let the opinions of others wash over them while saying nothing?

I 100% do this. I don’t want to fall out with anyone, so think not discussing politics is the best way. But where people do talk about it at work for example, it’s always pro remain. It’s just not seen as fashionable to be a vote leaver.

Kind of same with voting Tory. Most don’t discuss it for fear for being labelled as god knows what. But labour voters will voice their opinions from the tree tops and then they also think everyone is voting labour (esp online... those echo chambers!) and then get a shock come results day.

I quite liked what sky did yesterday - actually taking apart & critiquing the claim from Labour about cancelled operations

They said they're going to do that with all claims from all parties

I hope they stick to it - will make a refreshing change!

...how many Leavers keep quiet in everyday conversation and let the opinions of others wash over them while saying nothing?...
Yes I do this as well. Much less stressful than arguing and everyone getting upset.
I think everyone assumes I voted Leave.

“Kind of same with voting Tory. Most don’t discuss it for fear for being labelled as god knows what. But labour voters will voice their opinions from the tree tops and then they also think everyone is voting labour (esp online... those echo chambers!) and then get a shock come results day.”

This is why I am so very very grateful for this pub. Because here, the general consensus (despite occasional shiposting) we are able to debate from both sides in a way, that doesn’t risk friendships or family relationships , doesn’t risk jobs, doesn’t risk your kids being left out of events etc...

Correction, I think everyone assumes I voted Remain

Also when everyone slags off JRM I keep quiet because I like him.

“Yes I do this as well. Much less stressful than arguing and everyone getting upset.
I think everyone assumes I voted Leave.”

Ugh, it’s so toxic on both sides isn’t it? I wish we could all be more pragmatic, sorry youve experienced that from leavers too.

Boiled down.

We were given a ballot with two simple options.
Some went one way, some went the other. Both options were fair choices. End.

The ensuing carnage has been horrible.

slarti

Oops! My post still stands from the other side...!

So as yet then, no real consensus and associated anecdotes on leavers who might welcome a PV?

Unless I have misread any posts, in which case I apologise! (Am waiting to collect poorly DS from school, so a little distracted currently.)

Everyone assumes at first sight that I voted Remain too. After all, I speak in whole sentences. I don't wipe my snotty nose on my sleeve. I stand upright and certainly don't drag my knuckles along the ground when ambulatory.

Stereotypes. Wherever would we be without them? We'd have to treat everyone without prejudice and on their own merits. How exhausting

Oh, and I always stop what I'm doing and listen when Jacob is speaking. He's great.

After all, I speak in whole sentences.

Roflmao!

I believe labour will scrape in and go for a second referendum and Remain will win because of the sheer exhaustion and all the uncertainty. My prediction 🤣

So as yet then, no real consensus and associated anecdotes on leavers who might welcome a PV?

Not from me, Epic. I'm happy with the answer I gave in 2016. To be asked again if I'm really really sure would be an insult.

“I believe labour will scrape in and go for a second referendum and Remain will win because of the sheer exhaustion and all the uncertainty. My prediction 🤣”

God, I hope not, but I am so worried you are rght!

“Not from me, Epic. I'm happy with the answer I gave in 2016. To be asked again if I'm really really sure would be an insult.”

I feel the same, as do all the leavers I know...

I quite liked what sky did yesterday - actually taking apart & critiquing the claim from Labour about cancelled operations

Same @DustyDiamond
Kay Burley took apart Keir Starmer today about the labour claims that food standards will drop to US levels when we leave the EU. Ludicrous on many levels as firstly, when we leave we can set our own standards and hopefully improve them. If we go for any deal with the US, who knows what will be agreed and I really doubt that we will allow any substandard food into the Uk as it will undercut our own producers, who produce high quality food.
I also hate the US bashing, in my experience food standards are quite high in the US and they are fans of fresh food. What Kay Burley did was force Sir Keir to admit he had eaten in the US many times without issues and finding hairs and mouse droppings or whatever Corbz tried to claim.

Someone should probably let JC know...