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Brexit

Westministenders: The weasel DIDN'T die in a ditch

975 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 11:59

The EU has decided to grant the UK's request for an extension until 31 January.

This will be a "flextension",
i.e. if the WA is approved by the UK and EU Parliaments before that date, then we will leave earlier.

and .... despite all his blustering promises, the weasel BJ lives on,
preening his whiskers in self-love.

The more gullible Brexiters haven't yet twigged that he lies and lies.
And lies....

Meanwhile, another attempt by the UK to decide what to do:

From 2:30 pm today, MPs will debate whether to allow a GE on 12 December

This is a govt motion under the FTPA, which means BJ requires the votes of ⅔ of all MPs - that's 434

Hence he would need Labour support.

BJ's condition for a GE on this date is that MPs agree to pass the WA / WAB by 7 November,
which is the last day before Parliament would be automatically dissolved before the GE.

Corbyn said he'll only agree to a GE if BJ takes No Deal off the table.
This cannot be made legally binding, but as noone would take the word of a lying weasel, it is difficult for this condition to be satisfied.

Polls suggest that a GE after Brexit would be likely to give the Tories significantly more votes & seats than a GE before.
Both Labour & Tory want to game GE timing to their advantage.

Also, most Labour MPs are opposed to a GE after Brexit, for fear of losing the votes of millions of angry Labour Remainers - and their own seats.

A few on the Labour left do want a GE asap,
but Nick Brown, Labour’s chief whip, has warned Corbyn that many MPs would disobey orders to vote for 12 December.

Hence, BJ is expected to lose yet another HoC vote.
If so, reports suggest that the Cabinet are split over what to do next:

Some ministers, e.g. Gavin Williamson, want to agree to the SNP / LDem proposal to hold a GE on 9 December.

This would be via an amendment to the FTPA or a separate 1-line Act
and hence would require only a simple majority of MPs present
It would also be the last chance logistically for a GE before mid-February.
BUT
would require BJ to abandon attempts to pass the WAB before this.

Also, such a bill would be amendable and Tories fear the type of amendments could be added
e.g. a CU, or votes for 16-year-olds.

Hence other ministers and the Tory chairman James Cleverley oppose this idea.

It is unknown how BJ will decide.
His record is of aggressive bluster, then caving in at the last moment, while pretending he has won.

The EU have saved our bacon yet again, but may be running out of eye rolls "Please don't waste this time"

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MockersthefeMANist · 28/10/2019 18:18

Why worry? The country's going to explode before we can have an election.

www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/mark-francois-i-think-if-we-dont-leave-on-the-31st-of-october-this-country-will-explode-a4239126.html

(That's Firework Night, Mark.)

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 18:18

But exactly what else does he say we should do with the 3 month extension? Fuck all again? We cannot waste it; if we do, it WILL be the last (and may well be anyway).

This

How many more excuses is Corbyn going to come up with?

Didn’t he just say we can’t have a GE until BJ accepts to extension?

Well he has, in writing, so what’s the next excuse?

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 18:18

Lewis Goodall@lewisgoodall

Source says there was misreporting that SNP wouldn’t try to amend for these things earlier in the day and it was a commitment they’ve made:

“that might be true for the Lib Dems but not for us.”

hmmm. SNP source says:

“If we have the opportunity we would seek to amend a bill to introduce votes at 16 and votes for EU nationals
(both of which we’ve already introduced in scottish elections)

- but will need to study any bill...”

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prettybird · 28/10/2019 18:20

The Conservatives are rattled about the threat of the LibDems if they're now complaining about the LibDems' "broken promise" on tuition fees Confused given that the policy was led by the Conservatives Hmm

chomalungma · 28/10/2019 18:21

I think Boris was trying to call the Opposition's bluff.

The message was all about a cunning plan to defeat the Bill. He failed. He lied to us.

Cummings is a fan of The Art of War. Part of it says "Make yourself appear strong when you are weak".

Well, he failed...unless all this is part of the plan?

RedToothBrush · 28/10/2019 18:22

Many many many thanks BCF.

I've been struggling with illness, a 5 year old and half term...

... I'm hoping that I can be around a bit more than I have been.

TheMShip · 28/10/2019 18:22

Well, he failed...unless all this is part of the plan?

Visit the Brexit Arms and that's exactly what they'll tell you.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 18:23

Thank you to prettybird and miljah for your posts agreeing with my view point on no deal.

You’ve explained my thoughts well. I don’t wish harm on anyone, although, like miljah I have limited sympathy for those who voted Leave and can not afford the consequences

It’s the last thing I ever wanted but I really don’t see where else we go from here

A miracle would be fabulous though

NoWordForFluffy · 28/10/2019 18:23

I'm fed up of the bloody student thing being raised. They can register to vote at home and at uni. They will NOT be disenfranchised in that instance (not being able to vote in your preferred constituency is NOT disenfranchisement). If they're desperate to vote where they're at uni, they could maybe stay to do that. 12th Dec is bloody early to go home. My uni wasn't that cushy! 😂

prettybird · 28/10/2019 18:23

Well he has, in writing, so what’s the next excuse?

Because it is a flextension and Labour also want to block the WAB before any election - and BJ still wants to/could force it through before Parliament is dissolved for the election.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 18:24

Let's see if the SNP / LDem proposal comes to a vote tomorrow,
with a GE before Brexit

it would be very interesting to see what Corbyn decides then.

However, a Labour leader is under no obligation to agree to a GE at a bad time for Labour

  • behind in the polls, party organisation totally unprepared for a GE - to help the Tory party out of a hole it has dug for the country.

Corbyn may really fancy his chances after a Tory No Deal disaster.

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NoWordForFluffy · 28/10/2019 18:25

Visit the Brexit Arms and that's exactly what they'll tell you.

I hide this now, every time a new one pops up, I hide it. It's better for my sanity!

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 18:26

BCF just an aside - your post at 18.18 is one that looks bonkers on my screen

Pointy things, italics, asterix and underlining all over but nothing actually bolded.

No idea why it does that

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 18:26

Welcome back, @red Smile
I hope you are fighting fit again

We've missed your exellent analyses

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CurlyWurlyTwirly · 28/10/2019 18:27

Excellent point by Ken Clark, about all of the UK staying in a customs union during the transition period

NoWordForFluffy · 28/10/2019 18:27

Corbyn may really fancy his chances after a Tory No Deal disaster.

So people have to die just so Corbyn can become Prime Minster?! There are no words that adequately express my contempt for this if it's actually a real idea.

PotterHead1985 · 28/10/2019 18:27

*But exactly what else does he say we should do with the 3 month extension? Fuck all again? We cannot waste it; if we do, it WILL be the last (and may well be anyway).

We've got limited bloody options to try to change what's going on.*

They could use the three months to properly scrutinise and debate changes on his bill. Not the five fucking minutes he actually wants. Then come January they might be in a better position to get stuff sorted.

MockersthefeMANist · 28/10/2019 18:28

The DUP are not happy.

Amazing. You knife people and they hold it against you.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 18:28

Bear I have to use the App - afaik, my posts seem OK to fellow Appers

With my visual disability I really can't see well enough on Safari - so the text would be even crazier there !

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Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 18:29

Because it is a flextension and Labour also want to block the WAB before any election - and BJ still wants to/could force it through before Parliament is dissolved for the election.

So why doesn’t he say that instead of making such a twat of himself by saying ‘until X happens’ then when X has happened he moves onto Y and repeats

NoWordForFluffy · 28/10/2019 18:29

They could use the three months to properly scrutinise and debate changes on his bill. Not the five fucking minutes he actually wants. Then come January they might be in a better position to get stuff sorted.

If they got the time to do it. Don't forget Bercow finishes on Thursday. They'd have to SO24 it, most likely.

Basilpots · 28/10/2019 18:29

DUP are still cross then....

Alsohuman · 28/10/2019 18:30

.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 18:30

I thought it must be an app thing.

Goodness knows why they’d set it up so it looks so odd on the normal web version though

It just makes it really hard to see what is a quote etc

MockersthefeMANist · 28/10/2019 18:31

DUP still cross....

These are people who still shout "1690, No Surrender!"

Don't count on them letting it go.