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Brexit

Westministenders: The weasel DIDN'T die in a ditch

975 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 11:59

The EU has decided to grant the UK's request for an extension until 31 January.

This will be a "flextension",
i.e. if the WA is approved by the UK and EU Parliaments before that date, then we will leave earlier.

and .... despite all his blustering promises, the weasel BJ lives on,
preening his whiskers in self-love.

The more gullible Brexiters haven't yet twigged that he lies and lies.
And lies....

Meanwhile, another attempt by the UK to decide what to do:

From 2:30 pm today, MPs will debate whether to allow a GE on 12 December

This is a govt motion under the FTPA, which means BJ requires the votes of ⅔ of all MPs - that's 434

Hence he would need Labour support.

BJ's condition for a GE on this date is that MPs agree to pass the WA / WAB by 7 November,
which is the last day before Parliament would be automatically dissolved before the GE.

Corbyn said he'll only agree to a GE if BJ takes No Deal off the table.
This cannot be made legally binding, but as noone would take the word of a lying weasel, it is difficult for this condition to be satisfied.

Polls suggest that a GE after Brexit would be likely to give the Tories significantly more votes & seats than a GE before.
Both Labour & Tory want to game GE timing to their advantage.

Also, most Labour MPs are opposed to a GE after Brexit, for fear of losing the votes of millions of angry Labour Remainers - and their own seats.

A few on the Labour left do want a GE asap,
but Nick Brown, Labour’s chief whip, has warned Corbyn that many MPs would disobey orders to vote for 12 December.

Hence, BJ is expected to lose yet another HoC vote.
If so, reports suggest that the Cabinet are split over what to do next:

Some ministers, e.g. Gavin Williamson, want to agree to the SNP / LDem proposal to hold a GE on 9 December.

This would be via an amendment to the FTPA or a separate 1-line Act
and hence would require only a simple majority of MPs present
It would also be the last chance logistically for a GE before mid-February.
BUT
would require BJ to abandon attempts to pass the WAB before this.

Also, such a bill would be amendable and Tories fear the type of amendments could be added
e.g. a CU, or votes for 16-year-olds.

Hence other ministers and the Tory chairman James Cleverley oppose this idea.

It is unknown how BJ will decide.
His record is of aggressive bluster, then caving in at the last moment, while pretending he has won.

The EU have saved our bacon yet again, but may be running out of eye rolls "Please don't waste this time"

OP posts:
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OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/10/2019 13:22

damnit. ok.
I'll start the thread. Then we can collate responses there.

Hoooo · 29/10/2019 13:25

Well done 👏

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/10/2019 13:32

I've posted about that Yolo on the new thread. Let me know if it doesn't sufficiently answer your questions.

lonelyplanetmum · 29/10/2019 13:32

Fucking Leadsome

"this government's proud record on employment rights"

Er what?
Like reducing employment claims by 70% due to tribunal fees? Increasing the unfair dismissal qualifying period to 2 years?
Like introducing employee shareholder obligations which involved sacrificing some unfair dismissal, redundancy and maternity notification periods ?

Yeah great record there.

Let's try an amendment to have a PV at the same. Hell its all such a mess and so unknown just go for a meltdown.

MaddieElla · 29/10/2019 13:33

I bet they could turn around the votes for 16 year olds. I had to register my DD just after her 16th birthday so she is good to go and would absolutely go out and vote. We do talk politics and have BBC Parliament on at home though, I'm not sure that's the same for most households.

prettybird · 29/10/2019 13:37

I don't think huge numbers of 16 to 17 year olds are desperate to vote and most wouldn't bother.

Actually, the experience in Scotland is that they're more likely to vote than the 18-24 year olds! Grin

Admittedly a small base of Indyref (2014), a Scottish Parliament election (2016) and the nationwide council elections (2017) - so it could just have been the novelty factor Wink (ds was able to vote for the 1st time in 2017). But if you get them into the habit early, then they're more likely to continue voting - rather than (as someone on here can't remember who ) witnessed, a c80 year old voting for the first time in the EU Referendum Hmm

BigChocFrenzy · 29/10/2019 13:40

Lewis Goodall@lewisgoodall

Am told Labour are going to try and change the date of the election to the 9th

Labour will support votes for 16-18 year olds amendment if allowed
but they are pessimistic it will be.

Labour had planned a Vote of No Conf later in the week but that has now been pulled.
PM’s adoption of Lib Dem/SNP bill put pay to that plan.

OP posts:
NoWordForFluffy · 29/10/2019 13:41

Proxy vote info.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 29/10/2019 13:42

HOC Trying to get Bercow to stay on for a few days

tobee · 29/10/2019 13:44

Ooh that's interesting Just! Wonder what will happen?

NoWordForFluffy · 29/10/2019 13:44

It would make sense for him to do those extra days really. Hopefully he agrees.

prettybird · 29/10/2019 13:46

Debate will only be allowed for 4 hours and Bercow has accepted Stella Creasey's amendment.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 29/10/2019 13:46

stellacreasy
@stellacreasy
·
16m
🚨 amendment I have proposed to restore standing orders of parliament for today’s bill and so ensure all MPs can table amendments, not just ministers, has been selected. That means all MPs can vote to restore rule book and stop mogg’s attempt to silence his opposition. Pls RT!🚨

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2019 13:47

Hannah Al-Othman @hannahalothman
Bercow has allowed Stella Creasy's amendment which allows... more amendments! to the election bill

tobee · 29/10/2019 13:48

I'll be interested to see how much a general election held in the next few weeks will end up being a one issue affair.

As to whether I am in favour of a GE or not (as asked earlier) I can't come down on one side or the other. (Just call me Jeremy Corbyn Wink)

My gut instinct is go and hibernate for the winter, probably. Confused

prettybird · 29/10/2019 14:01

So Stella Creasy's amendment is a trapdoor to allow more amendment Wink - but the debate (if the business motion is accepted Hmm) is still constrained to just 4 hours for the 2nd Reading and only 2 hours for the committee stage. Confused

ArseDarkly · 29/10/2019 14:05

I don't think the GE will be a one-issue affair because Brexit itself was never really just about Brexit.

For many people it wasn't really about the EU, as they only had the vaguest idea about the workings of our membership (including myself in that) - it was about the damage and deprivations to their lives and communities which were actually the result of austerity, privatisation and under-funding over decades.

The lack of resources to the NHS and education; zero hours contracts; lack of decent housing etc etc All falsely framed as being the result of FOM or too much money going to the EU.

I think there's a lot of very persuadable people out there who really need to hear the truth about Brexit and some hope for the future - conservatives aren't going to be able to offer that.

TheMShip · 29/10/2019 14:07

Oooh! I get to say it!

Division!!

TheMShip · 29/10/2019 14:08

Never got to say it before. Halloween Grin

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/10/2019 14:08

I think it's impossible to decide one issue with a general election. The clue is in the name I think (she says simplistically)

Butterymuffin · 29/10/2019 14:09

Creasy is very shrewd about how to get things done using parliamentary procedure. Good for her. Wish we had more like her.

tobee · 29/10/2019 14:09

Sorry if this has been mentioned before but I see Heidi Allen is standing down as an MP. She sites her reasons as being "utterly dehumanising" abuse amongst other things. Whatever one thinks of Heidi Allen, it seems that, once again, the vilest members of the public are having their own way, hounding out moderate voices.

TheMShip · 29/10/2019 14:11

I saw that tobee. Sad to see her go.

wondering7777 · 29/10/2019 14:12

This is the most optimistic I've felt in ages - there's a real chance to stop Brexit and end this nightmare for good! Grin