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Brexit

Westministenders: The weasel DIDN'T die in a ditch

975 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 11:59

The EU has decided to grant the UK's request for an extension until 31 January.

This will be a "flextension",
i.e. if the WA is approved by the UK and EU Parliaments before that date, then we will leave earlier.

and .... despite all his blustering promises, the weasel BJ lives on,
preening his whiskers in self-love.

The more gullible Brexiters haven't yet twigged that he lies and lies.
And lies....

Meanwhile, another attempt by the UK to decide what to do:

From 2:30 pm today, MPs will debate whether to allow a GE on 12 December

This is a govt motion under the FTPA, which means BJ requires the votes of â…” of all MPs - that's 434

Hence he would need Labour support.

BJ's condition for a GE on this date is that MPs agree to pass the WA / WAB by 7 November,
which is the last day before Parliament would be automatically dissolved before the GE.

Corbyn said he'll only agree to a GE if BJ takes No Deal off the table.
This cannot be made legally binding, but as noone would take the word of a lying weasel, it is difficult for this condition to be satisfied.

Polls suggest that a GE after Brexit would be likely to give the Tories significantly more votes & seats than a GE before.
Both Labour & Tory want to game GE timing to their advantage.

Also, most Labour MPs are opposed to a GE after Brexit, for fear of losing the votes of millions of angry Labour Remainers - and their own seats.

A few on the Labour left do want a GE asap,
but Nick Brown, Labour’s chief whip, has warned Corbyn that many MPs would disobey orders to vote for 12 December.

Hence, BJ is expected to lose yet another HoC vote.
If so, reports suggest that the Cabinet are split over what to do next:

Some ministers, e.g. Gavin Williamson, want to agree to the SNP / LDem proposal to hold a GE on 9 December.

This would be via an amendment to the FTPA or a separate 1-line Act
and hence would require only a simple majority of MPs present
It would also be the last chance logistically for a GE before mid-February.
BUT
would require BJ to abandon attempts to pass the WAB before this.

Also, such a bill would be amendable and Tories fear the type of amendments could be added
e.g. a CU, or votes for 16-year-olds.

Hence other ministers and the Tory chairman James Cleverley oppose this idea.

It is unknown how BJ will decide.
His record is of aggressive bluster, then caving in at the last moment, while pretending he has won.

The EU have saved our bacon yet again, but may be running out of eye rolls "Please don't waste this time"

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Basilpots · 29/10/2019 09:26

Sun and mild if you don’t mind kitten

JustAnotherPoster00 · 29/10/2019 09:28

Kitten I could really go for snow if I'm honest, could it start Wed evening please Grin

Bearbehind · 29/10/2019 09:28

Force Boris to carry on. Let the FTPA do the job it was intended to do and either force a consensus government, or make the incumbents carry the can for the decisions they've made.

And how does that resolve the issue of Brexit?

This mess is caused by the fact that a non-party issue is being fought along party lines.

It could be the best deal in the world but Labour wouldn’t vote for it because it is a Tory initiative

OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 29/10/2019 09:29

The there's also the fact Lib Dems are becoming the refuge for former conservative remain voters.
They're also becoming the home of former Labour remain voters too. May depend regionally of course.

Violetparis · 29/10/2019 09:29

I don't think huge numbers of 16 to 17 year olds are desperate to vote and most wouldn't bother.

Basilpots · 29/10/2019 09:34

I don't think huge numbers of 16 to 17 year olds are desperate to vote and most wouldn't bother.

Never going to know unless you ask them.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 29/10/2019 09:34

Andrew Adonis
@Andrew_Adonis
A bill to override the Fixed Term Parliaments Act is a constitutional monstrosity. It overrides the safeguards inserted by Parliament to prevent a narrow majority of MPs fixing the election date to their advantage

The House of Lords must act as guardian of the constitution

DGRossetti · 29/10/2019 09:34

And how does that resolve the issue of Brexit?

Maybe, just maybe, nothing will "resolve the issue of Brexit" ?

And if we start from that assumption, we end up having to assess the least-worst outcome, rather than the most-preferred ?

placemats · 29/10/2019 09:34

She is Basil.

She and I have much respect for Lady Hermon and Naomi Long.

Angryresister · 29/10/2019 09:35

It would be good if an amendment could be added restoring the vote to those of us who live in other EU countries who are affected badly by the Brexit proposals. Removal of healthcare and stopping pension annual increases for starters. Loss of freedom of movement also. At a recent meeting we held all would vote remain but only half still have a vote.

Bearbehind · 29/10/2019 09:37

And if we start from that assumption, we end up having to assess the least-worst outcome, rather than the most-preferred ?

We reached that point a long time ago, it’s just a lot of people on here haven’t realised that.

Right now a GE probably is ‘least worst’, largely because there’s no viable alternative

wondering7777 · 29/10/2019 09:38

The only saving grace in the coming election is that every party has a clear position on Brexit. Yes,there will be other issues but you can't complain afterwards "this wasn't what we voted for"

Very true.

Basilpots · 29/10/2019 09:38

Angry absolutely it is really odd that you have no say but Commonwealth do ? It makes no sense.

placemats · 29/10/2019 09:38

Brexit is the modern day Sword of Damocles. Forever hanging over our heads.

Bearbehind · 29/10/2019 09:40

The reason most on here don’t want a GE is because it won’t deliver the result they want.

It will be a Tory majority or a Tory / BXP coalition.

But that is the fault of the opposition and not a reason to stop it happening

wondering7777 · 29/10/2019 09:43

The reason most on here don’t want a GE is because it won’t deliver the result they want.

It will be a Tory majority or a Tory / BXP coalition.

I want an election because I don’t think the Tories are as safe as people think. And it could be our last chance to stop Brexit.

DGRossetti · 29/10/2019 09:47

It will be a Tory majority or a Tory / BXP coalition.

I'm happy to restate I will be taken aback if BXP get one seat, and we're into hat-eating territory if they get more than 5.

TheMShip · 29/10/2019 09:48

I'm pleased to see that Vauxhall has selected a Labour candidate who actually seems human.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/28/replace-kate-hoey-local-party-stitch-ups-not-working

wondering7777 · 29/10/2019 09:53

I'm pleased to see that Vauxhall has selected a Labour candidate who actually seems human.

Excellent! But can they get rid of Keith Vaz now, please?

Violetparis · 29/10/2019 09:54

I think if people vote tactically an election may not lead to a Tory landslide, hope so anyway.

thecatfromjapan · 29/10/2019 09:54

Yes, MShip, the Vauxhall result is Good News. 🙂

BercowsFlyingFlamingo · 29/10/2019 09:54

Can we just order six inches of snow for the areas with the most leavers and Tories? Grin or a plague of locusts. Whatever works Grin

Basilpots · 29/10/2019 09:56

He’s likely gone Wondering probable recall petition.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-50212221

wondering7777 · 29/10/2019 09:59

He’s likely gone Wondering probable recall petition.

I hope so. The man seems to be made of Teflon.

placemats · 29/10/2019 10:02

It's painting by numbers here now re the GE.

9, 11, 12.

Silly and childish.

Johnson should be forced to sweat this out. So far, evidence reveals, he isn't capable of doing this.

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