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Brexit

Westministenders: The weasel DIDN'T die in a ditch

975 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 11:59

The EU has decided to grant the UK's request for an extension until 31 January.

This will be a "flextension",
i.e. if the WA is approved by the UK and EU Parliaments before that date, then we will leave earlier.

and .... despite all his blustering promises, the weasel BJ lives on,
preening his whiskers in self-love.

The more gullible Brexiters haven't yet twigged that he lies and lies.
And lies....

Meanwhile, another attempt by the UK to decide what to do:

From 2:30 pm today, MPs will debate whether to allow a GE on 12 December

This is a govt motion under the FTPA, which means BJ requires the votes of â…” of all MPs - that's 434

Hence he would need Labour support.

BJ's condition for a GE on this date is that MPs agree to pass the WA / WAB by 7 November,
which is the last day before Parliament would be automatically dissolved before the GE.

Corbyn said he'll only agree to a GE if BJ takes No Deal off the table.
This cannot be made legally binding, but as noone would take the word of a lying weasel, it is difficult for this condition to be satisfied.

Polls suggest that a GE after Brexit would be likely to give the Tories significantly more votes & seats than a GE before.
Both Labour & Tory want to game GE timing to their advantage.

Also, most Labour MPs are opposed to a GE after Brexit, for fear of losing the votes of millions of angry Labour Remainers - and their own seats.

A few on the Labour left do want a GE asap,
but Nick Brown, Labour’s chief whip, has warned Corbyn that many MPs would disobey orders to vote for 12 December.

Hence, BJ is expected to lose yet another HoC vote.
If so, reports suggest that the Cabinet are split over what to do next:

Some ministers, e.g. Gavin Williamson, want to agree to the SNP / LDem proposal to hold a GE on 9 December.

This would be via an amendment to the FTPA or a separate 1-line Act
and hence would require only a simple majority of MPs present
It would also be the last chance logistically for a GE before mid-February.
BUT
would require BJ to abandon attempts to pass the WAB before this.

Also, such a bill would be amendable and Tories fear the type of amendments could be added
e.g. a CU, or votes for 16-year-olds.

Hence other ministers and the Tory chairman James Cleverley oppose this idea.

It is unknown how BJ will decide.
His record is of aggressive bluster, then caving in at the last moment, while pretending he has won.

The EU have saved our bacon yet again, but may be running out of eye rolls "Please don't waste this time"

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HoneyandSpice · 28/10/2019 20:53

Dianne Abbott should probably not be quoted, to be fair. For obvious reasons.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 20:53

You're letting your emotions cloud your reading

Eh?

It’s Corbyn who is refusing the GE for every reason under the sun

They have no choice but to support the one line bill because it will pass with or without them

thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 20:54

I get the feeling you're just angry, Bear. You want things that don't exist.

Brexit has always been about sensible options getting ruled out by party numbers and trying to game the system.

It's been a wrecking ball to the UK's political system.

Which was always the intention of some of its proponents.

Which makes it all the more baffling that so many 'patriots' voted for it.

thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 20:55

No, Bear. It isn't.

There was a sit in Labour.

Look at the tweet from Diane Abbott Justa posted.

NoWordForFluffy · 28/10/2019 20:56

The reason BoZo's attempt today failed is because under the FTPA, the PM can control the GE date, so he could've set it for Feb 1st and we'd then no deal.

The LD / SNP bill has a fixed date, so the GE has to be then, meaning no 'accidental' no deal.

thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 20:56

Split.

A split in Labour.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 20:57

I hold Cameron, May & BJ to account for Brexit,
just as I hold Blair to account for the Iraq war debacle and not the Tories

When a PM starts something and makes a disaster of it, I allocate them almost all the blame,
because they are the ones in govt

"The buck stops here"

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thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 20:57

The reason BoZo's attempt today failed is because under the FTPA, the PM can control the GE date, so he could've set it for Feb 1st and we'd then no deal.
**
The LD / SNP bill has a fixed date, so the GE has to be then, meaning no 'accidental' no deal.

Re-posting Fluffy because it is so wise.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 20:58

I get the feeling you're just angry, Bear. You want things that don't exist.

That’s about as far from the truth as is possible

I was angry, I’m now just resigned to this mess

And I absolutely don’t want things that don’t exist - in case you hadn’t noticed I’m one of the few banging the drum for not wishing for things that aren’t possible

OhYouBadBadKitten · 28/10/2019 20:58

Weary pmk.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 20:59

When a PM starts something and makes a disaster of it, I allocate them almost all the blame, because they are the ones in govt

FFS - this is ridiculous

Blame helps no one

Miljah · 28/10/2019 21:01

MN, I will shortly be reporting myself here as I now understand that it's not permissible to comment on the bullying going on in the other place.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 21:01

"They have no choice but to support the one line bill because it will pass with or without them"

It will be the only opportunity so far to have a GE before Brexit,
so it was right to oppose BJ's previous attempts

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Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 21:01

A split in Labour.

It still doesn’t matter. Labour could all vote against it and it will still pass if it has the support of the other parties because it only needs a simple majority

FadingStar · 28/10/2019 21:01

It's terrifying having a PM that absolutely no one, not even people in his party, has any trust in.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 21:02

bear You keep blaming Corbyn and demnding we join in

I don't spend much time blaming anyone, but if there is to be blame, ot should fall on the corrcet people

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Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 21:02

MN, I will shortly be reporting myself here as I now understand that it's not permissible to comment on the bullying going on in the other place

Eh? It’s your behaviour that’s the most provocative on that thread.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 21:03

Being so angry all the time at Corbyn / Labour is pointless when they are not driving this Brexshit

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Basilpots · 28/10/2019 21:04

www.electionpolling.co.uk/battleground/targets/conservative

Target seats I think someone was asking for the other day. Couldn’t find at the time might have been about 3 threads ago.

thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 21:04

But, Bear, you wNt some kind of Super-Opposition, which can leap over the obstacles of a media that is pro-Brexit and/or de-fanged and scared; an electorate which until recently obdurately supported Brexit, Parliamentary numbers that don't align for any clear route ...

You attribute positions to Corbyn that he doesn't hold.

You don't want blame for Brexit to be attributed to the Party that brought it in and has kept it going and voted to put a proven liar in charge ...

It's hard to work out what it is you wNt.

I suspect what you want is for this to be Labour's fault, so you can settle what you can see with your own eyes in accordance with a long-held belief system (and I would guess that is something like, 'despite their faults, the Conservatives are competent',).

Well, sadly, we can't give you that. Because it's not true.

Bearbehind · 28/10/2019 21:04

I’m not blaming Corbyn, I’m staying he’s the only one who can actually make a difference now and he isn’t doing so

And defending that is no better than voting Tory yourself, and we all khow hateful you find that

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 21:06

Be careful, miljah
Our lovely talkinpeace was banned because a poster took a dislike to her and kept stalking & reporting her.
I suggest you stay out of their echo chamber, if they are determined to bully out all dissenting voices

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Miljah · 28/10/2019 21:06

I am disgusted in the 'report/delete' policy going on, on MN. I'm gone

14 years.

thecatfromjapan · 28/10/2019 21:07

I think no-one can make a difference now.

The only thing that can stop this is a PV - and that boat has sailed.

It's a GE now.

And Labour are almost certainly going to back it.

I don't know what you want from Corbyn.
Magic? To roll back time to stop Cameron cslling the referendum?

BigChocFrenzy · 28/10/2019 21:08

"he’s the only one who can actually make a difference now"

No
BJ is the one who can really make a difference

If you reply that it's impossible for the PM to change policy, then why keep demanding the Opposition leader do so ?

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