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Brexit

Westminstenders: Showdown

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 13/10/2019 20:22

Big week ahead.

Johnson has until Tuesday Afternoon to get his shit together for the EU.

He thinks it can be down, but still lots to do in that time.

This week we have the Queen's Speech too, which is going to be misused as a party political broadcast.

Remember if the government can't pass the QS, there's a crisis that gets generated as a direct result. Sticking in proposals that any liberal or leftie will struggle with, is deliberately provoking a crisis of that nature. A proposal of that type would have to be anti democratic in nature, like... Ermmm... Voter ID. Hell, well what do you know.

Johnson is still after his election because as it stands he's a passenger stuck in the runaway train of his own creation.

Talk of a deal breakthrough is still overstated too. The DUP and many of the usual ERG suspects have poured water on the idea. And many on the opposition benches are pushing hard on a confirmary ref being needed for a deal - they don't have the numbers yet, but talk is that they are close. We also have loyalist military making threats about an Irish Sea Border solution.

Time for Project Shit Meets Fan.

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DGRossetti · 16/10/2019 14:47

Has anyone suggested charging people to post on social media as a "solution" to fake accounts and postings ?

Or rather, has anyone seen the suggestion yet (because it's being touted) ?

Puts Facebooks "Libra" into a different context for a start.

Imagine if Facebook had to pay (say) $10 tax per year per registered account. I bet they'd suddenly find a very quick way to get rid of fake accounts. See also Twitter.

Timeywimey10 · 16/10/2019 14:47

I am looking forward to my NI neighbours enjoying similar freedoms to the rest of us on abortion and same-sex marriage, after next week

Yes. At least there's some good news!

flouncyfanny · 16/10/2019 14:51

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Basilpots · 16/10/2019 14:52

Never really understood how the DUP get to cherrypick which rules/laws they want to choose to follow.

Hasenstein · 16/10/2019 14:55

DGR

"What was if Gandalf said ?

It does not do to leave a dragon out of your calculations if you happen to live near one.

Or sleeping giants, either. The US can take a while to process events abroad, but once it starts ..."

Or as Alfie Solomons said to Tommy Shelby, "Big fucks small".

DGRossetti · 16/10/2019 15:27

I wonder if the cancellation of the government proof-of-age-id requirement just announced is related to anything in particular ?

www.parliament.uk/writtenstatements

Controversial plans for mandatory age verification controls for pornographic websites have been scrapped, UK culture secretary Nicky Morgan announced today.

In a written statement, Morgan said the government "will not be commencing Part 3 of the Digital Economy Act 2017 concerning age verification for online pornography".

(contd).

RedToothBrush · 16/10/2019 15:35

DGR, I've seen the amount people spend on gaming. I don't think it would have as much effect as you think.

People desperate to 'win' an argument will be emotionally invested still and many will be prepared to sock puppet, including with fee to get their message across.

What you'd find is minority voices will become more invisible in on line debate and therefore more marginalised politically as politicians will get a distorted version if public opinion (which they do anyway) but with this idea that voices on social media are 'more legitimate' and social media represents falsely 'an accurate reflection of public opinion'. This negates pressure to question representation on social media and do more scientific research and consultation with the public.

It means that lobby groups and passionate activists have more power not less and you end up with more not less polarisation.

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RedToothBrush · 16/10/2019 15:36

Or as Alfie Solomons said to Tommy Shelby, "Big fucks small".

Didn't he die?

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Jason118 · 16/10/2019 15:40

So we're moving back to 'Ragged Trouser Philanthropy' days where money buys power through social media spend, and people's idea of what is going on is at first distorted by social media, and then, being the pack animals we are, we begin to go along with it. It's clever, virtual, rabble rousing.

DGRossetti · 16/10/2019 15:43

DGR, I've seen the amount people spend on gaming. I don't think it would have as much effect as you think.

I wasn't personally advocating a solution, but pointing out that others will and one of them will be to make people pay for posting. Pulled in by the ongoing net neutrality spaffs that are eventually going to see the internet segmented to match real life. "No riff raff" and all that.

I imagine the amount of hate mail being sent dropped to practically zero when the sender had to pay for postage as opposed to the recipient.

You and I might see that having to pay to post will simply favour the existing hegemonies, but then we also saw that Brexit wasn't a good idea either. And yet here we are.

I think there is actually something in the observation about changes in political outlook as you grow older. But in my case, it's just that with each passing day, I want less and less to live into the future. Quite how that translates into voting I don't know.

54321go · 16/10/2019 15:49

I want less and less to live into the future. Quite how that translates into voting I don't know.
vote Brexit and there will be less future?

RedToothBrush · 16/10/2019 15:53

Noises from Donald Tusk in the last half hour sound like deal is nearly there.

This just tweeted

Laura Kuenssberg@bbclaurak
Cabinet not briefed on full contents of a deal cos it isn't done yet - mood was 'steady as she goes', one of those present said

They did however discuss the plan to hold a Saturday sitting for MPs, and putting down a resolution to make that happen tomorrow

That suggests there will be something to debate on Saturday.

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BercowsFlyingFlamingo · 16/10/2019 16:01

Spin, spin, whiskey and gin...

TheMShip · 16/10/2019 16:03

Indicative vote on Saturday would be my guess.

Peregrina · 16/10/2019 16:13

Do I understand this correctly? Any WA that Johnson gets will be worse than that negotiated by May. Parliament voted down her agreement three times. Why should they vote for Johnson's agreement?

(Except he might keep the ERG on board, because after all he's an old Etonian bloke, so they can support him, when never in a million years could they support an ex grammar school girl.)

I hope that Saturday sees 2 million of us on the streets of London this time, and that Parliament gets the message that we don't want Johnson's Brexit, and preferably, non at all.

BigChocFrenzy · 16/10/2019 16:20
Confused John Cracee@JohnJCrace*

BREXIT just got more meta.

Richard Graham now demands committee chair Hilary Benn gives evidence to committee on why he is a traitor.

It’s turning into a Stalinist show trial

< Benn is chair of HoC Committee on Exiting EU; Graham is Tory Brexiter MP >

tobee · 16/10/2019 16:21

Because it's a farce!

tobee · 16/10/2019 16:21

That was to Peregrina

ListeningQuietly · 16/10/2019 16:22

I was asked today
'what is the point of going to London on Saturday'
to which I replied
'to stop a hard Brexit'
my questioner agreed with that aim

BigChocFrenzy · 16/10/2019 16:25

Furious Andrea Jenkyns demands Hilary Benn RESIGN for Brexit ‘bias’ in angry Commons clash

She's another Tory Brexiter MP

They are really laying into Benn today - angry over his bill causing an extension ?

www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1191490/brexit-news-Hilary-Benn-Andrea-Jenkyns-video-brexit-committee-no-deal-vote-leave

BigChocFrenzy · 16/10/2019 16:29

peregrina John Crace: "the prime minister is one of the few people who could haggle the price up in a carpet shop" 😂

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/15/rees-moggs-dim-brand-banter-entertains-no-one-but-himself

BigChocFrenzy · 16/10/2019 16:34

Tom Newton Dunn@tnewtondunn

Sir Ivan Rogers to European Scrutiny Committee:

"Ministers told me repeatedly,
'Don't worry Ivan, you don't understand, we're going to have a trade deal in place on the day after exit'.

I said, '
with the greatest respect, we're not'.

I think I've been proven right

< and if you think the WA has been difficult, wait until we start negotiating a future trade deal with the EU. Or with anyone >

BigChocFrenzy · 16/10/2019 16:35

Tony Connelly@tconnellyRTE

New:
Barnier briefing of EU27 ambassadors has been postponed again from 17hr to 19hr

RedToothBrush · 16/10/2019 16:37

Government have tabled a motion for tomorrow to sit on Saturday.

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taytosandwich · 16/10/2019 16:40

I wonder if it would be worth getting another big petition for 2nd ref going. Not the last one helped much but it would prove strength of feeling.