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Brexit

Westminstenders: Supreme Democracy

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 15/09/2019 19:45

Tuesday is the big day about prorogation.

The Supreme Court hears the case of Cherry and Miller against the government.

This could test the constitution and the union. The Supreme Court sits as both as a Scottish Court and and English Court and applies Scottish / English law accordingly. And there are differences. It is possible that prorogation might only be illegal under one or the other but would have effect on parliament. Or its possible that the Supreme Court might decide to uphold the government position.

What is encouraging is the constitutional expert blogs which suggest that they lean to the court intervening. It's important that for the A50 case the Supreme Court referenced the arguments in these blogs.

But let's not get too carried away.

As it is Joe Moor, former director of legislative affairs at 10 Downing Street wrote in today's Telegraph that Johnson could merely prorogue again from Oct 14 "until at least Nov 6" thus preventing parliamentary scrutiny of no deal which would help enable in effect illegally. The Times also reported Cummings as having said this to advisors.

This has been dismissed by legal experts, but the point remains there is a willingness to both frustrate parliament and be as obstructive as possible in the days leading up to 31st.

There is also the 'Nobile Officium' Court action designed to stop illegal no deal by allowing the courts to write a letter to the EU to request an extension of Johnson refuses to.

It remains to be seen if it has even a chance of success.

The British press has been full of comments of optimism for a deal this weekend. This is after there was positive noises in a similar vein from Brussels. These has since been largely dismissed as mere political will with no practical progress. The British optimism has also been dismissed as mere posturing. And Priti Patel "misspoke" when she appeared to suggest that no deal was no policy this morning.

Other rumours include the French willing to grant a 2year extension but not a 3month one out of fear this will happen repeatedly. The French are now pushing for a deal and relaxing their approach as such (but Germany won't compromise the single market and Ireland the GFA so its all talk).

And do not forget, for all the talk of a deal there are certain time restrains.

Apparently Nikki da Costa has a timetable to get a deal through parliament in 'just ten days' on a spreadsheet. So that gives you an idea that the 19th October is possibly the last day to get a deal in front of parliament if you completely accept that we are leaving without any extension. This neglects the issue that a new deal isn't on the table from the EU and the backstop isn't going anywhere.

A last minute deal or no deal situation is highly risky with the ERG on one side and hard core Remainers who think Johnson won't defy the Benn Amendment and thus will try and block a deal to the last

It seems that we will have a game of cat and mouse until the bitter end.

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tava63 · 15/09/2019 23:29

I'm thinking Boris will now be in fighting mode after last week's disaster.

GeistohneGrenzen · 15/09/2019 23:44

Perhaps every town needs one of these for those who no longer have the benefit of cats?
www.webcamtaxi.com/en/usa/california/the-cat-cafe-san-diego.html

prettybird · 15/09/2019 23:49

There used to be a cat café close to me but I think it's shut down now Sad

prettybird · 15/09/2019 23:58

Seems I was wrong BlushSmile: still going strong. Never been as I have my own cat fixes Wink

https://purrplecatcafe.com

ARoomWithoutADoor · 16/09/2019 00:01

PmK
Agree that Cameron really cannot write for toffee.
I think the pic of him with Ivan on the front page of the ST along with rants about his old colleagues is really bad taste. Of course both are really important parts of his life and it IS his autobiography being serialised, it just made me uncomfortable.

Jason118 · 16/09/2019 00:04

It takes a big man to own up to a huge mistake and try to make amends. Cameron is tiny.

Motheroffourdragons · 16/09/2019 00:10

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

TheABC · 16/09/2019 00:13

facepalm
On the plus side, Boris is going to have his ego liberally massaged this week at the Conference which will hopefully distract him from any foreign adventures.

I have cats on my feet. Stockpiling to commence again. The problem is hiding the chocolate from the kids.

GeistohneGrenzen · 16/09/2019 00:27

prettybird will look at yours tomorrow - have just been watching the San Diego one and it was almost as interesting seeing the staff cleaning everything at close of play. Well, a good distraction from present times and any cat on a table was definitely alive Grin

Need to get to bed!

Peregrina · 16/09/2019 00:28

May had her ego massaged at her first conference - they couldn't get enough - citizens of nowhere stuff and all that. They lapped it up. But then she was stabbed in the back. Although she had more time on her side.

tobee · 16/09/2019 00:30

I think Johnson might end up getting stabbed from all sides.

Jason118 · 16/09/2019 00:47

Et tu Brutus et al Grin

pamperramper · 16/09/2019 01:18

So he's telling the EU he will not accept any extension that is offered. Completely disregarding the parliamentary vote. What is going on?

tobee · 16/09/2019 01:26

Skullduggery! Angry

tobee · 16/09/2019 01:27

That sounds too exciting and swashbuckling.

It's law breaking arsehole behaviour. AngryAngry

mathanxiety · 16/09/2019 02:30

Harking back to the last thread's discussion of flags.

The US flag is placed in a corner of every US classroom, and children recite the Pledge of Allegiance every morning, not the National Anthem.
(I pledge Allegiance to the flag
of the United States of America
and to the Republic for which it stands,
one nation under God, indivisible,
with Liberty and Justice for all.)
The significance of the pledge to the US flag lies in the victory of the Union in the Civil War, and with it the principle of indivisibility, and liberty and justice for all (all too often honoured in the breach of course but heyho)..
Confederate flags have always been a symbol of Southern atavism - racism and white supremacy and opposition to the federal project under different guises.

While the proliferation of American flags was a shock to me when I first moved to the US, I would prefer to live in a place where the flags, if people insist on flying them, are all Stars and Stripes, and not the Rebel flag.

Americans tend to put out more than just the US flag. The Confederate flag is a notorious alternative, but people fly emblems of their university during various university sport seasons, pride flags, Irish flags in March, flags of Brazil, Italy, Germany, Netherlands, France, etc during the World Cup. French flags appeared from nowhere in my neck of the woods after the Charlie Hebdo attacks.

Just for a bit more context, America is also the place where the trend of lighting up the outside of your house at Christmas and creating eye catching displays of reindeer, nativity scenes, and big inflatable Santas in your front yard got started.

NoWordForFluffy · 16/09/2019 05:08

Boris' current behaviour, combined with the evidence already in front of the - now 11, not 9! - Judges isn't really going to help the government's QC persuade anybody that the extension wasn't for nefarious purposes! All of this will be referred to as evidence.

I'm not sure if BoZo is an idiot or has some cunning plan up his sleeve.

Though the Court will be invited to find that it's politically rather than legally nefarious. It's got to be a fine line if it goes against the Scottish decision though.

borntobequiet · 16/09/2019 05:32

PMK. Having decided to distract myself from Brexit by having a (late) midlife crisis, can’t decide whether to resume stockpiling or spend the money on a lovely red leather jacket that’s in the sale.

0lga · 16/09/2019 05:38

The jacket. No contest.

borntobequiet · 16/09/2019 05:44

Thanks!

lonelyplanetmum · 16/09/2019 05:48

Another vote for the jacket!

Although the red toothbrush may be somewhat camouflaged on future demos...

QueenOfThorns · 16/09/2019 06:27

Get the jacket! It sounds like an appropriate antidote to the current situation.

CurlyWurlyTwirly · 16/09/2019 06:30

Thank you for the summary @RedToothBrush

Don’t forget BoJo is off to Luxembourg today to meet EC President à Jean Claude Juncker.
Apparently he is going to be like the Hulk and shake off the manacles of the EU....
However Mark Ruffalo who plays the Hulk came back with a great tweet.

Boris Johnson forgets that the Hulk only fights for the good of the whole. Mad and strong can also be dense and destructive. The Hulk works best when he is in unison with a team, and is a disaster when he is alone. Plus...he's always got Dr. Banner with science and reason.

Westminstenders: Supreme Democracy
bellinisurge · 16/09/2019 06:31

As a general prepper, I say get the jacket. In prepper language it sounds like a morale booster.

thecatfromjapan · 16/09/2019 07:01
Thanks