Do any of the people who laughed and rolled their eyes at those of us stockpiling six months ago care to comment?

[StealthPolarBear]

I seem to remember some rather scathing comments. I wonder how many are quietly buying a few extra bits each week and smugly congratulating themselves on being prepared. Forgetting the scorn and contempt.

Thank you @Manontry

I've always been a 'make the best of what you have' kind of person, just makes sense!

Even in the best case where there was no delay – with 70-80% of trucks getting through customs easily – “you would still get delays under those circumstances because 20% of the 10,000 trucks a day would still cause Calais and Eurotunnel to clog up,” she said

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/04/no-deal-brexit-food-shortages-brc

Yes, mostly fresh produce. But stocking up on frozen veg is obviously Remoaner Project Fear...

Why wouldn't you have enough to get through a couple of weeks? What is there to lose?

The thread has moved on now, but just to answer on the government and stockpiling - no, the govt haven't told individuals to stockpile - I can't imagine they ever would, because it would cause panic-buying. But they have told supermarkets and the Dept of Health to stockpile food and medication, in the event of no deal. www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-07/u-k-tells-supermarkets-to-maximize-stockpiles-before-brexit

The leaked govt contingency plans also www.politicshome.com/news/uk/foreign-affairs/brexit/news/105971/leaked-whitehall-dossier-reveals-fuel-shortages-and-irish I've lined to this, because the Times one is behind a paywall.

When I read stuff like this - I hope it will never happen, but I prepare in case it does happen. When I hear Gove using carefully chosen words like "adequate food" - then alarm bells ring. When I hear people discussing rationing in the UK in 2019, then alarm bells ring.

So when I say "us" I mean "UK" us.

Threatening no deal doesn’t work because it hurts us more than it hurts them

But it would have still hurt the EU so threatening No Deal to get a better deal could have still worked if we had given it a chance.

How do we know how far they would have gone to reduce the losses they would have had.

No deal had to be on the table. Taking it off is just madness

Keeping it on the table and having literally nothing to offer as an alternative arrangement is what stupid fucking entitled twats do.

Of course it's our (remainers) fault the Brexit negotiations are going to shit. Rather than the 52% who voted to leave 🙄

How would the negotiations being shit, down to the people who voted leave?

When you negotiate, you need something to negotiate with. No deal was what we had, because it wound hurt the EU (not as much as it would us). But by the Remainer MPs shouting that they wouldnt let it happen, made the no deal bargaining chip worthless.

Our parliament clearly doesnt know how to play their card close to their chests.

And lets be honest, alot of the remain MPs, would argue against anything but just staying in. Yes some support Brexit, but not no deal Brexit . But some are just determined to stop it happening. Which makes the referendum a farce. And those MPs (not the anti no deal ones, the ones that we fight Brexit regardless) have shown they dont give a shit what people want.

I dont want to leave the EU. I certainly dont want no deal. But this whole thing is damaging politics completely. EU membership is meant to be optional. Its clearly not if you cant leave with ruining your country. Once you are in its mandatory.

I really dont like that idea.

I also dont like the idea that so many MPs will block what the majority of voters voted for, if they dont like it.

Either way. I think politics is fucked in the country.

My personal opinion is that we wont go anywhere. That in itself will cause problems.

How would the negotiations being shit, down to the people who voted leave?

Because it was widely reported at the time that negotiations would be shit. That politicians had their own agendas and wouldn’t act with principles. The Irish issue was mentioned many many times. It’s not hugely shocking news that this has gone badly, it was predicted but few chose to listen.

When you negotiate, you need something to negotiate with

Yes, like a vision of what you're actually standing FOR! Using suicide as a bargaining chip is no substitute for a coherent plan for the UK, which has been sorely lacking since the start of this nonsense.

We should revoke article 50 and no politician should be allowed to reignite this debacle again until they actually have a solid plan for people to vote for or against, that covers things like Northern Ireland, UK citizens abroad and EU citizens in Europe upfront, rather than leaving people dangling till the last minute like this on decisions which will have a huge impact on their lives.. Among other serious issues which still, at the 9th hour, haven't been sorted.

Oliversmumsarmy (hoping you weren't on that bandwagon...) Q: "How would we know the negotiations wouldn't have worked hysterical remainers who I presume have never haggled for anything in their lives never gave it a chance."

Not our circus, not our monkeys. It was for Leave to make this work. The tumbleweed rolled endlessly when Remainers asked what, exactly we were supposed to 'get behind' and 'support', and 'pull together'. On what?

Q: "Remoaners" (hard to 'get behind' someone who uses that terminology, eh, Oliver )... "wanted leaving to be shit and now they have got their wish.".

No, Leaving is a shitshow because that is all it could ever be. We gaily voted Leave with no plan, just blind belief. The most googled term on June 24th 2016 was 'What is the EU?'. That's the level of intelligence that went into this. And where was the clamour prior to 2016 to leave the EU? Entirely manufactured to shut UKIP down. A public schoolboy spat that engulfed us all because we doff our caps to our public school educated boys. It's genetic. The rest of Europe appears to have dealt with its right-wing political factions without the fear that births badly thought through, panicked, 'advisory' referenda, with no necessary sizeable majority, no minimum turn out (you know, like grown-up countries that use direct democracy would).

No wonder it's a shitshow.

I want desperately to be proved wrong about No Deal, because I am not stupid and so do not want to impoverish myself to make a point. However, all those pesky 'experts', all those industry leaders, all those doctors, all those government authored articles about the impact of Brexit, a parliament doing everything it can to take us back from the brink of No Deal because they all know how easy it is to accidentally get No Deal- they convince me that No Deal is a very bad idea and thus shouldn't even be used as a negotiating 'threat'.

Brussels may well say 'Go ahead'.

However, I made one prediction on June 24th- that no bad thing that ever comes out of Brexit will be owned by Leavers, and so it has come to pass. Remainers had every right to a) seek assurance that No Deal would be taken off the table as frankly, it terrifies anyone with half a brain; and b) to lobby to remain. Oh and c) not go along with a Boris bluff in order to 'scare' Brussels, given that those who surround Boris are deadly serious about wanting a No Deal. They have tax to hide. This isn't poker, it's people's lives, Oliver.

Q: "As for Corbyn getting in. Will the last person leaving the UK turn the lights off" -or re-nationalise the utility companies so profits are ploughed back into infrastructure, not share-holders' pockets? Hmm?

I'm struggling with this " make do with whatever's left" attitude.

Brexit was supposed to enhance our lives, not make us just 'get by'.

What is the actual point of Brexit?

No deal had to be on the table. Taking it off is just madness

Exactly, as anyone how negotiates/haggles knows. You have to be able to walk away - that's your fall back bargaining position. Right from the day of the referendum result, we should have been preparing for no deal and made it crystal clear that was our fall back position.

Until the other side believe you're prepared to walk away, whether it's no deal Brexit, a new car, a souvenir in a tourist market, or whatever, you have no bargaining power.

The politicians and civil servants involved with the Brexit negotiations have been utterly incompetent and clearly have no experience in negotiations. Perhaps it's now clear why the big public sector contracts are so badly run - i.e. perhaps it's the same incompetents who signed off PFI contracts for schools and hospitals???

If No Deal were openly and publicly being promoted the day after the referendum, the MPs who blindly triggered Article 50 would not have done so, faced with forensic analysis of what it would look like.

Until the other side believe you're prepared to walk away, whether it's no deal Brexit, a new car, a souvenir in a tourist market, or whatever, you have no bargaining power.

Only if the person you are negotiating with are trying to sell you something. You walking away means they don’t get the £10k for the new car or £10 for the souvenir. The EU aren’t selling us anything.

And if anyone says oh but what about all the Audi’s and BMW’s that the U.K. buy, well if you think that we’ll all still be able to afford Audi’s and BMWs after this mess, you’re wrong.

Not to mention that if people really want those, they can still get them after in a deal scenario anyway.

Remoaners" (hard to 'get behind' someone who uses that terminology

As someone who voted Remain I cannot use that term to describe those that cannot get over that we lost .

As for

Not our circus, not our monkeys. It was for Leave to make this work

So why all the interference.

The EU aren’t selling us anything

Of course they are.

Oliver Because it's not Remain's job to 'make it work' - that belongs to 'Leave' - if anything it fell to us to point out what a shitshow this was all going to be.

Given only one of my Leaver friends still wants to leave, I think our point is getting across.

The EU aren’t selling us anything

The EU isn't a shop.

Miljah But you are not pointing out you are hindering any negotiations

Only insomuch that Remainers assisting Leavers in understanding what they are mindlessly throwing away is 'pointing out'; yes- which of course will 'hinder' negotiations because it informs them.

And, furthermore, the number of Leavers now regretting their ill-informed vote tends to suggest Remain is getting through to them.

If a 'negotiator' begins to sense that the people he's advocating for actually aren't as fanatical as once they were, he's going to lose that mandate if he goes on being all hard line, given how so few want No Deal, and given that we all know BoJo has surrounded himself with fanatical No Dealers, and given that the EU may well yet say, 'Oh, OK'.

Risky, risky, risky.

Is this the moment to remind people that the 21 MPs who were purged from the Conservative party tended to be those who voted for the WA, while the people currently running the government were the people who voted against it?

If the purged MPs had prevailed, we'd be out of the EU and started negotiating our future relationship with them by now.

Just in case anyone things "remainers" were the ones hindering anything...

singasong Good point, well made.

The EU is, in fact a shop.

It's a trading organisation.