Any more Leave supporters on MN?

[SacrebleuLondres]

I've not been on here for a while.

I'm seeing only anti Brexit threads on here.

Any Leave voters out there?

What do we have to look forward to when we Brexit?

We are leaving whether we like it or not. We all need to come to terms with it.

To OP

Such threads serve only to build the wall between those who voted leave and remain and seem to be initiated by remain supporters in hope that leave supporters will change their minds.

Have any leave supporters who have read the the Brexit threads on MN changed their minds?

It is the type of leave that has become the point of concern. Most seem to agree that leaving the EU with a deal is a better outcome than no deal. Even Johnson has said he would prefer a deal to a no deal.

WA was rejected three times by parliament by significant majorities in each case. As most MPs are pro remain that suggests that even the remain MPs must have thought it was a bad deal?

All hinged around the backstop. Hence Johnson has said the backstop is removed or UK leaves with no deal.

The Norway arrangement would be my preferred leave route.

So, I asked earlier if any of you would accept a border in the sea. I'll ask again. Would you? I think Johnson's letter doesn't rule it out so, as he is the saviour of Brexit for you with his new backstop, would you?

This thread demonstrates why it’s pointless discussing this with Leavers now; their views are too entrenched and there’s absolutely no way they are going to let the facts change that.

For example copper has been told countless times about the remit of the ECJ and the fact what she says is more about the ECHR but she still insists ‘the principle’ is what she objects to, the fact even ‘the principle’ is incorrect

After more than 3 years, with still no tangible reason for doing this, the only solution is to go for no deal and prove what an epic disaster it will be

^^ ‘despite’ the fact

Saw this.

If even one thing is true then it's slightly disturbing.

@Coppersulphate

When Michael Gove was Secretary of State at DEFRA he gave an undertaking that the govt would extend the ban on neonics after Brexit

Gove or this current Govt have not got good form for keeping their promises, they made a strong commitment that FOM wouldn't end until arrangements were in place via their immigration bill, they've rowed back on both.

Currently the beekeeping lobby in this country is strong

Not strong enough to perhaps stop the importation of GM both products and seeds in post brexit deals.

However the main threats to honey bees are not neonics but loss of habitat, Asian hornets (which I think are already here) and viruses

Totally agree, habitat is vital for all wildlife, no species is an island, we all rely on each other, most living organisms thrive through cooperation and pooling resource.

I absolutely love bees, fascinating to watch some white tail bumble bees using an old apple tree as a hive over the summer in our garden.

The govt are concerned because of the need for pollination

Johnson seems particularly interested in pollination, so perhaps you are right.

There are a number of leavers, some who don’t even live in UK or EU and won’t be impacted. None of them have ever come up with an even halfway positive plus for leaving and the civil servant on the thread who doesn’t appear to know how UK legislation is enacted and how EU legislation becomes part of U.K. law is a bit worrying.

And how people think the likes of Johnson, Javid, Patel and co will make life any better for them than being in the EU is puzzling.

I have some left leaning friends that voted leave. Their thinking is along the lines of you could never have a truly socialist government in the EU. You would not be able to enact policies that go against the neo liberal consensus. And the treatment of Greece was another factor. I have right leaning friends that don't like immigration and so voted leave.

@jewel1968 , they are Lexiteers and just as contemptible as right wingers.

This thread demonstrates why it’s pointless discussing this with Leavers now

But they don't discuss... that PP - "the former senior civil servant" was asked what laws the EU forces the UK to adopt.... could only come back with VAT on tampons, nothing else! and even that has changed whilst we are IN the EU.
Time4chocolate then came up with a couple of bizarre jokes, Copper did gave it a go with her (non existent) concerns over the ECJ.

If the EU was controlling how we spend taxes or healthcare/educational spending then fair enough, i'd be voting leave. but from my pov, the Working Time Directive/workers rights, ease of travel, making exporting (to the EU) as easily as selling in the UK, is worth every penny of our EU membership contribution.

Quite a few remain posters want to chuck people out of the country if they haven't found a job within 3 months - that doesn't sound very friendly to me either.

I haven't seen any Remain posters say this. What I have seen is some Leave posters,-the ones who say that for them it's all about immigration, be told that existing laws enable us to ask EU citizens to leave if they haven't found a job within 3 months. Not the same at all.

Windrush was more than not being friendly either. Citizens, often those who had come as children of parents who were invited to come to the UK to help Britain re-establish itself after the war years, and had worked here their whole lives, were kicked out. That it the big disgrace. I don't see many Leavers screaming about this. I say many because one or two do speak out.

Quite a few remain posters want to chuck people out of the country if they haven't found a job within 3 months - that doesn't sound very friendly to me either.

Another reason these discussions go no where - Leavers are rewriting history to suit their own narrative

Interesting thread.

It seems to me that 'our' problems with the EU were not really caused by the EU, but by our own, democratically elected government.

I was hoping this thread would provide me with something good to look forward to... but all I've got is vat-free tampons. Maybe.

I e not spotted any Leaver responding to my question: would you be happy with a border in the sea? I'd take it. But then, I know what it means. Guessing it's too complicated a question. Or just not patriotic enough.

Time4chocolate then came up with a couple of bizarre jokes

Did I?

DH is type 1 diabetic. Insulin is a major worry. I cannot describe how angry I feel towards leavers.

My brother is type 1 diabetic too. He and my parents voted leave. I'd expect them to be concerned but no, it's all 'scaremongering'. I think my mother in particular is in denial. It's just too hard for her to face the possibility.
Many members of my family are on drugs which are probably not considered life saving in the extreme sense, but could potentially have life changing or even ending consequences if they were stopped suddenly.
It's very difficult finding out what drugs are produced where. And if any one has useful links I'd be grateful.
to you and DH, littlequestion

Is this helpful Socks?

www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-are-insulin-supplies-really-at-risk-from-a-no-deal-brexit

Thanks, appreciate the link. It's amlodipine, lanzoprazole, warfarin, prednisolone, tegretol and sertraline I'm interested in really.

would you be happy with a border in the sea? I'd take it. But then, I know what it means. Guessing it's too complicated a question. Or just not patriotic enough

Rather try the Norway arrangement as it is already established. That the WA was rejected three times by MPs (who are majority remain) makes me think there is something seriously wrong with the WA?

@MysteryTripAgain , don't care what version it is but time is ticking and an NI only backstop has not been before Parliament.

Time4chocolate then came up with a couple of bizarre jokes

Did I?

No you didn't i was being polite!

But you didn't come up with any benefits of brexit either.

NI only backstop has not been before Parliament

Vote of No Confidence and all that follows will not leave much time to put anything else in front of parliament.