Westminstenders: Here we go again

[RedToothBrush]

Vote 12th March: Meaningful Vote on the Withdrawal Agreement

Vote 13th March: If WA fails, vote on No Deal

Vote 14th March: If WA fails, vote on A50 extension

Not much more to add at this stage that's not repeating what's been said before.

From William Hague's list, he doesn't include one huge group of

Remainers will blame the Tories/TM for never being honest with the country or seeking genuine consensus and making this all about her red lines. And/or for not investigating dark money.

Oh Cox is perfectly named.

I'm running on fumes at the moment, and struggling to keep up. Something has been nagging me about this all and I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Then this popped up and lightbulb moment:

@davidallengreen
Just as with Iraq, MPs are being invited to vote for something immensely consequential on the back of the improvised and politicised advice of a hesitant Attorney-General.

I'm sure this has already been figured out here of course, but I'm on a massive slow-go!

That's very interesting to hear about attitudes in former E Germany, fouroftwo

Yesterday afternoon, I had an interesting lecture on British exceptionalism from the AfD bigwig for our area after he found out I'm a Brit
(He was canvassing for the EP elections)

He said how stupid UK attitudes are towards Europe, because we are so obviously European

• then lecturing me about our French & German heritage and claimng that there was no bit of a British person or region that wasn't a mix of European ancestry

He expressed great pride in Europe, but then criticised the EU itself for having too many regulations, especially on the environment.
The AfD campaign locally is against the regs on diesel cars, saying it is interference that will cost jobs and reduce consumer choice
They seem to be the DIrty Party.

I've noticed that the AfD campaign in my region at least is to change the EU, not leave it
Maybe it's only since the UK's horrible bodge up !

They are not the German UKIP, much more sophisticated,
but both are islamophobic (fortunately he didn't get onto that topic)

WA will go through tonight or lose by such a small amount to have a 3rd MV at end of March.

No-deal is the battering ram she has used and the HoC will capitulate but was never a serious option, as it would have destroyed the Tory party's electoral chances for at least a decade.
I suspect the prepping was little more than window dressing, much work needed to be done ie for Operation stack and spending has been mixed up with monies already earmarked ie how many of those 5k fridges would have already been bought or ordered across the NHS or indeed govt?
Have a look at how the Govt boasted about record education spending by inc private school fees and student loans!!!!

This whole thing has been a charade from start to finish, the Strasbourg "Dash" done for effect to convince waivering MPs that this is the infamous last minute EU climb down.

Oh, and just to burst the Anglosphere idiots' bubble:

Former Australian PM calls Brexit trade plan ‘utter bollocks’
Kevin Rudd says UK striking deals with Commonwealth is not ‘magical alternative’ to EU

Think the Commonwealth can save Brexit Britain? That’s utter delusion

www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/mar/11/former-australian-pm-kevin-rudd-calls-brexit-trade-plan-utter-bollocks

That's doing Robert Helpmann a disservice QueenofThorns

Nodding in agreement as I am reading. Agree re: TM's intransigence and Codpiece's "cure" lacking integrity.

Agree overall though that this has been quite a clever move (given the dire circumstances). They've done the minimum (WA unchanged) and it could be given a face-saving interpretation. At the same time though, it has called out the ERG & DUP in the sense that they will have to pinpoint and explain/elucidate what it is exactly that they object to in the WA (just the back-stop or something else?) to a set deadline over which they have little control.

I haven’t often contributed to these threads but read them often and really appreciate being able to catch up on what is ( or isn’t) happening re Brexit. One of the big reasons I don’t write much, is because I spend so much time reading the threads and then have to get on with the rest of my life.

Like some of us here I’m a UKer living in the EU - for me France, and despite not being allowed to vote in the referendum, I am a remainer ( still getting over the conversation I had with a leaver who said she voted to leave because the UK couldn’t sell bendy cucumbers because of the EU 😞).

I want to thank everyone who shares all their information and different perspectives on Brexit here. I find it really helpful and interesting too.

My very strong feelings about the UK remaining in the EU mean that it’s complicated for me to understand where I am with the parliamentary votes over the next few days. My thinking that the only way for remainers to still have hope of a revoke, has lead me to think that it must be best if parliament doesn’t vote for May’s WA today. (Though, that may be too simplistic and I may have lost the plot).

My respect for Big Choc, and for her informed and insightful German perspective, has meant I’ve been listening to your point of view too BC. Thanks for the explanations about why you think it would be best for parliament to vote in favour of the WA today. Looking forward to reading more on the subject.

It was always expected that the EU would do their best to give May a final face-saver,
without changing the backstop
i.e. cosmetic not legal

What I find surprising is that Tory Remainer MPs are so vehement against the backstop

The backstop is to protect the GFA against current & future UK governments - clearly necessary when politicians and public alike have shown such disregard for Ireland

imo, they are Remainers only for economic reasons; they don't share the Ideals of the EU
Like the less ideological Leavers, they are "transactional" about the EU - a frequent EU complaint about British attitudes - but they just did their transaction sums differently.

Without a passion for the EU, they are less likely to risk their careers

Just caught up. We had a power cut last night from 6.30 to about 1am. So I missed everything, but it seems like I missed nothing in the end so perhaps I was better off reading my book!

I love the Tiggers amendment.
It would be the perfect solution if it passed, but I agree with red that it hasn't a chance

Failing that, Ireland / GFA is a major reason why I accept the WA as the least bad option

After the dreadful British / English history of crimes against Ireland, No Deal would be yet another act that shows callous disregard for harm to Ireland

susan Do you know why ?

voted to leave because the UK couldn’t sell bendy cucumbers because of the EU

I'm guessing that was another of Boris Johnson's oh so amusing articles in the Telegraph. Pah

So what is likely to happen?

Revoke - some sort of unicorn, May is not going to do it
PV - ditto
WA - highly likely to fail to pass
No-deal - Yes MPs may well vote against this BUT can they really get rid of the default option? (I think not)

What I find surprising is that Tory Remainer MPs are so vehement against the backstop

They are unionists. They would be happy with a Norway or remain.

I dont agree it's highly unlikely. I think it will go through today.

No deal means hard border within Ireland . WA means backstop in the sea. And so today's vote is about saving Ireland. Have I got that right ?

Is it also about really giving up all hope for remainers ?

Yup - banning bendy cucumbers was just more bollox. Grading for quality (which includes bend as that influences how many you can pack on a box) did not arise from EU and had been around for years.

I had the same argument regarding banning bendy bananas, unwashed veg and the sale of Canary Island bananas with my DM, which were her “valid” reasons why she didn’t like the EU and voted Leave.

Today's vote is not about "saving Ireland " fgs. It's about the version of Brexit Parliament is prepared to agree to. And, as Leavers are so fond of reminding us when it suits them NI is the UK as much as Rotherham or Exeter is.

Jon Snow
A Lawyer contact tells me that the legal world is aware that the Attorney General said NO last night to the validity of Mrs May's 'new EU deal'...he been told to go away and find a way to say YES: A cohort of lawyers has been summoned.

Geoffrey Cox QC MP@Geoffrey_Cox
Replying to @jonsnowC4
Bollocks

Good to see Cox is up and working.

I'm not sure why, but they started digging up the paving area outside our houses at 10pm so I assume something to do with the cabling?

I feel very grateful to them as we had bad wind last night and they were out there for quite a few hours.

Glad to see Cox is working hard and not wasting time on twitter, in the manner of a uni student with a deadline and a blank sheet of A4 in front of them.

Maybe he was saying bollocks because he went on a bender last night and when he woke up he forgot this was on his work schedule for today?

I am trying to focus on my work this morning, so I can finish early today. It isn't going very well.