People’s Vote Delusion

[PersonaNonGarter]

It isn’t going to happen. For the following reasons:

1. May Government won’t vote for a second referendum
2. No new post-May Tory Government will vote for a second referendum
3. Jeremy Corbyn and those in the Labour Party front benches won’t vote for a second referendum
4. There is no agreement about what the referendum would ask.
5. There is no plausible timetable for a referendum.

Why would Corbyn want a second referendum? He is a Leaver wanting to win in Leave seats. And he wants to implement his domestic agenda, not waste any further time on Brexit votes. The current situation SUITS him.

Sorry, quote fail there. First sentence is a quote from the OP, if it's not obvious.

Who are the snowflakes now? Are the nasty Remainers being cross with the pure of soul?

Life goes on' if you're a retiree or don't depend on your job.

And even if you are a retiree you will be fucked because your currency will be devalued.

^What’s interesting is that not many people seem to think they play any part in healing the division after Brexit. There is so much aggression, abuse etc. (All one way, on this thread).

None of the angry ‘fuck em’ type posters seem to think that they could be part of the problem going forward.^

What are you banging on about? You honestly believe people should make nicey nice as they watch themselves and their families suffer over other peoples' stupidity? And with a government who has consistently shown over the past 8 years they don't give a fuck about the populace? If that's not deluded then I don't know what is.

The problem going forward is not Remainers who refuse to proffer olive branches but a shitstorm of a government who doesn't give a toss.

I agree a second ref won't happen. It lacks credibility and authenticity as another will almost certainly be demanded by either side causing a endless cycle of referendums. It would also demoralise and damage the structures of democracy perhaps beyond all repair. Society would no longer trust any kind of establishment/government, vote or referendum.

Why do you think it would damage the structures of democracy? I am not an expert but I know that Switzerland has regular referenda. I am not aware that they are regarded as being undemocratic. It might be considered so in the UK because our primary democracy is still a Parliamentary one, but it would be perfectly possible to rewrite the laws to say that we had regular referenda. If we did so, it would be hoped that they would build in some proper safeguards, rather than appear to be writing the rules up on the back of an envelope. Also no glib statements by politicians should be allowed to trump what is written down. The 2016 Referendum was advisory, so whatever Cameron or May or Uncle Tom Cobbley an' all said they think or wanted it to be should be disregarded as irrelevant.

Tbh, it is pretty grim to ‘wish harm’ on other people.

Yes, on this I agree, especially when you do it by voting for something that's going to harm a vast many people and then cry, 'Oh, people are so nasty!'

The irony is strong in this one, Master Yoda.

Quite a plea from the people who have been threatening violence in the streets if their Brexit isn't "hard" enough.

What are you banging on about? You honestly believe people should make nicey nice as they watch themselves and their families suffer over other peoples' stupidity? And with a government who has consistently shown over the past 8 years they don't give a fuck about the populace? If that's not deluded then I don't know what is.

Bravo!

@PersonaNonGarter
There is so much aggression, abuse etc.

Yes there is but this is what happens when people's livelihoods and their children's prospects are threatened. That's not to condone it but it is understandable and at least it shows that people understand what's at stake.

Why not help us to bridge the divide OP? If a 2nd referendum isn't the way out what is the right way forward? Do you think proceeding with a Chequers deal or no deal will reconcile remainers and leavers or would you accept an EEA/EFTA+CU option?

I'm still hopeful that I'll wake up one day and Brexshit will just be a bad memory. The Tories have a history of making U-turns, remember the Poll tax riots?

How is it aggressive to say "you caused this shitshow and I hope you and yours suffer food shortages; job losses etc same as the rest of us".

It was good to see so many people making their feelings known. I don't expect it to change anything and not sure it should. I voted remain and when the result came in, I dearly wished I was wrong. (It's becoming apparent that I wasn't tho). But. The ship
has already sailed, if they call a second ref, leavers will just be moaning that it makes a mockery of democracy and you can't keep having a ref until it gets the result you want. So intensifying divisions. It would be better to see through this shitshow so that leavers can see what they voted for. Although I know if it is shit they will blame project fear, remoaners and the bullying EU. However, I think there is a possibility that it may be cancelled without a second ref and it seems to be impossible to achieve anything. There is no majority mandate for a hard Brexit either.

Quite a plea from the people who have been threatening violence in the streets if their Brexit isn't "hard" enough.

Indeed.

Contrast with the march on Sunday which whatever you may think of its purpose was remarkably good natured and required minimal policing.

Because on your marches you’re completely different to how you are online.
Where were the banners saying ‘all leavers are thick ignorant racists’ - ‘why give these idiots the vote they can’t even spell!’ - ‘hold another referendum now, hopefully 1000’s of racists have died!’
I could list at least another 10 insults I’ve heard regularly on these boards alone.

No, on the march you’re all nice ordinary people wanting the best for the country. ( don’t want the real you getting into the European press now do we )

But we know what you’re really like.

OK surfer. Next time I march, I'll carry a poster saying 'Leavers can go fuck themselves.'
Happy?

"We know what you're really like" . Am I supposed to liken all Leavers with the twats who sent Polish vermin messages to children. Am I supposed to liken allLeavers to the idiots who keep posting " just get over it " nonsense.

Yeah - be honest with your banners.
Say what you really think.
That’s the whole bloody point of marching!

Silly silly silly

We were v honest with our banner.

Brexit: Disaster Capitalism dressed in democracy's clothing.

It's a con job.

You think 750,000 on Saturday weren't saying what they were really thinking?

That's some impressive coordination, that.

I thought a lot of the banners were quite direct. I particularly liked the LIAR ones.

Were there any banners aimed at leave voters?
I mean, 50% of what gets posted on here is about how ignorant leavers are so that’s clearly a big issue for you.
Did you get that point across? What you think of leave voters?

Doesn't "Liar" do it for you. If you believed those lies.

Recent thread on here with a Leaver suggesting that the DUP should compromise a bit and that NI should import stuff from Ireland via the UK.
What? Are we not supposed to call that out?

No remainer ever gives a straight answer.

You didn’t mention your real thoughts about leavers because it would be bad publicity & you were probably warned not to.

Who warned us then, Surfer?