Westministenders: Talks Walk Out?

[RedToothBrush]

We are now on the countdown to whether we get a backstop Withdrawal Deal. May is hoping to get the EU to backdown on this saying that we will stay in the customs union until a deal is agreed on NI. That would mean come 29th March, we'd have no transistion period, but we'd still have a hard border in NI because we were out of the single market. And if the EU don't agree to it we are into the chances of accidental Brexit being sky high. The only way out would be revoking a50. May has hinted that if Tory MPs don't give her support we could end up with no brexit at all - whether she means revoking a50 or Beano isn't clear.

So onward to 18th October...

Fortunately those Leavers I know, don't seem to be racist. They are more of the 'we were alright before school' and 'whatabout the way Greece was treated?'

A group of us have had some success with one from the alright before school, pointing out that now all the car factories are foreign owned and they weren't in the 1970s.

Some Leavers - especially those who didn't vote because of nationalism/ immigration, but just hoping for "change", or to kick Cameron -
are now quite worried they made a serious mistake

Human nature not to want to talk about that,
not to risk having to admit to having screwed the country's pooch

Even some fervent Brexiters are shouting Lalala rather too fervently to be as confident of sunny uplands as they claim

Fortunately those Leavers I know, don't seem to be racist. They are more of the 'we were alright before school' and 'whatabout the way Greece was treated?'

As regular posters will know I distinguish between Leavers and morons Brexiteers. The colleagues I referred to all had very well thought out and cogent reasons for wanting the UK to leave the EU. Mainly around direction of travel and the fact that while the EU is wonderful for the countries in the EU, it's not quite as glorious for the neighbouring countries which aren't. It's become academic though, as they would never vote Leave in a rerun. and are horrified at what has happened.

This time next year, they may have total amnesia about their vote

All the leavers I know have gone very quiet about it. Even the one that was very gloaty and just obnoxious.

Can't believe those RED jobs....

It's all feeling very dismal.

All the leavers I know have gone very quiet about it.

Well, just look at these threads ...

I don’t think any of my friends are leavers - there was a breakdown of the vote by location and our ward/borough (not sure of the granularity) was one of the remainiest in the UK - iirc it may have been around 90% . But Brexit is still never mentioned socially .

Mycatisbonkers Arlene Foster was elected by her constituents to represent them in the NI assembly. The Assembly obviously collapsed, but she was elected many times before that happened (unfortunately!).

I was very 'remain, but now I am not so sure.
Remaining IS still the best plan overall but since the Government have gone about it in such a terrible and destructive way I am having doubts that clawing a way backwards will be the best. No one in industry, or significant inward investors will take the UK seriously as the Gov have destroyed trust completely. There will be massive resentment against the UK by all 27 countries that have been forced to spend and reconfigure so much, and combined with the backdrop of the continual UK gov, both Tory and Labour who are clearly not attempting to come up with a coherent (and acceptable) plan.
With the redtops and worse, the Gov itself freely mocking and being generally 'abusive' to the EU, the UK does not deserve friendship.
All other world governments can understand that there are no 'sunny uplands' otherwise they would be doing it too. The world trade 'business models' are as they are and the UK wanting to be radically different simply won't fit. Combining this with a pretty 'broken down' society/economy makes things worse still. GDP may look good on paper but the inequity between the darlings of the South East and North East/South West hide the fact the UK is not is a good place.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45806063

I'm loving the comments ... not quite as Brexity big bollocks as before.

And this is pure gold:

This is the DUP tail wagging the government dog. A masterclass to show the Lib Dems what they could have done when they passively allowed massive austerity cuts, the destruction of our NHS and education system and, ultimately, caused Brexit.

The wheels on the bus go 'bump, bump, bump'.

Remaining IS still the best plan overall but since the Government have gone about it in such a terrible and destructive way I am having doubts that clawing a way backwards will be the best.

I think Remain is very much inextricably linked with a new government ... whether the reverse is true, I don't know.

It's gonna be hard to find anyone who voted leave once this clusterfuck comes home to roost

My mum's next door neighbour and my sister's boyfriend voted to Leave. They might get convenient amnesia after the fact - but I sure as hell won't.
The trouble is, for those that crowed, they cannot make other people forget what they did, even if they choose to forget, themselves.

The amnesia makes me bitter, I'm soft if people hold hands up and say this isn't going how I thought or whatever.

I did not even know you could leave comments on the BBC news website. The comments under the DUP article are eye-opening. Some people think there are 66 million voters in this country. Wow! Just wow!

No one in our family changed their minds. They are more pro-Brexit than ever. Still loving Farage.

I did not even know you could leave comments on the BBC news website.

Well most of Russia does ...

No one talks about Brexit, just as they don't talk about climate change and the 12 years to prevent uncontrolled temperature rises, how much news coverage did it get? a day? 3rd or 4th story?

If you don't give a shit about destroying the planet in your own life time, you wont give a 4X about Brexit dropping GDP by 2% or whatever.

The idea of a lack of medicines, flights, 100mile lorry parks etc is about as unreal as central London under 2m of water or Summer temps in southern England of 45'C

I despair.

I would imagine that when it goes horribly wrong, Leave voters will blame TM or Raab and say this isn't the Brexit we wanted.
You can see Johnson and Davis doing it already.
Although it sticks in my craw to say it, I have more respect for Gove [shudders] for being part of the Government than staying outside whining and pouting.
And so they will say their true faith was betrayed by sinners.
Twats.

And so they will say their true faith was betrayed by sinners.

Eerily echoing the narrative that allowed the Nazis in

.

At least Gove was prepared to put up for the PM's job, so he deserves a little bit of respect for that. Unlike Johnson - the job would have been his for the taking. Or Rees-Mogg, who prefers to snipe from the sidelines, whilst making sure that his businesses can trade from Dublin. or Farage, who can't get himself elected.

DG I see no indication that the EU would accept the UK without a genuine massive shift in UK public opinion.
So say 70% support for Remain required

They know that otherwise the Uk govt - certainly any Tory one - would just deliberately wreck the EU from the inside until it collapsed into just a glorified EFTA, headed (in their dreams) by the UK

Barnier's speech confirms NI backstop still required.

WA still only 80-85% agreed

Checks cannot occur between RoI and NI,
GB firms would complete custom forms when delivering goods to NI
The only new checks would be of containers on lorries for NI being scanned on ferries or at ports.

https://mobile.twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1050033431156064256