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Brexit

An open letter to leavers

999 replies

LoveInTokyo · 02/08/2018 12:54

Dear Leavers

I’m sorry that David Cameron offered us a referendum and promised to respect the outcome, whatever it was.

Unfortunately, he was fucking with you.

He promised that referendum when he didn’t think he stood a cat’s chance in hell of getting a majority, and never thought he’d actually have to deliver on it. When he got his surprise majority, he made a big show of going to Brussels and pretending to negotiate with the EU to get us a “better deal”. Unfortunately, he already knew perfectly well that the UK already had a better deal than any other country in the EU, and that they were not going to bend over backwards to get us to stay. So he made a big show of negotiating and then tried to pretend that he had done something meaningful. He then went through the motions of holding a referendum, half-heartedly campaigning to remain. He did absolutely no contingency planning, partly because he never believed that leave would actually win, and partly because he already knew that he had no intention of staying to deal with the fallout if they did. That’s why he resigned the day after the referendum and waltzed off, whistling a merry tune.

He played a high risk game of poker with our money, and lost.

I understand that many of you feel defensive about your decision and dislike being labelled “thick” by angry remainers. As a remainer myself, I feel saddened and frustrated that none of you seem able to articulate any benefits that will actually come out of Brexit. But at this stage, I would quite happily accept that there will be no benefits, and settle for damage limitation. Unfortunately none of you seem able to explain how we limit the damage either.

We cannot leave the single market and customs union without there being a hard border in Ireland, which will put people’s lives at risk. We cannot leave the single market and customs union without severely damaging most sectors of the economy, which would cause untold hardship for millions of people living in the UK. I realise that remaining in the single market and customs union would make leaving the EU pointless, but it is the only way to limit the damage.

The government has made almost no progress towards getting a workable deal in place, and time is running out. We don’t have the infrastructure in place to ensure that supply chains of essential food and medicine will not be disrupted after Brexit day. We don’t have a plan to ensure that planes will still be able to take off and land, or that satnav will still work. We do not have any trade deals lined up. We simply do not have time to do any of these things.

Dear leavers, you do not have solutions to any of these problems, and more importantly, neither do Theresa May, Boris Johnson, David Davis, Liam Fox, Nigel Farage, Jacob Rees-Mogg, Andrea Leadsom, Daniel Hannan, Jeremy Corbyn, Kate Hoey or any of the people who claim to think Brexit is the right choice for the UK.

A no-deal Brexit is unthinkable. It is not an option.

I realise that many of you will feel betrayed if we do not get the kind of Brexit you want. But to be honest, you’re going to feel betrayed even if you do get the kind of Brexit you want, because it will be unimaginably shit. This is not "project fear", it is "project reality".

The government has a duty to act in the best interests of the country as a whole. It’s not good enough to lay the blame at David Cameron’s door and say he held the referendum so we have to respect the vote. David Cameron has been out of office for two years. It is now plainer than ever that leaving the EU is a terrible idea, and there is still time to put the brakes on and not go through with it. If the government goes through with this when they could put a stop to it, they cannot continue to blame David Cameron and claim that their hands were tied. They are not.

It is time for Theresa May to do the decent thing and say, “I’m sorry, I know it’s what the people voted for, but it simply can’t be done without causing a totally unacceptable amount of harm to the country. And I have a duty of care towards everyone, not just the 51.8% who voted leave.”

OP posts:
Moussemoose · 05/08/2018 20:21

Rosstac sure school is 5 - 11 but the community is from where?

A second language at this level is not all consuming especially when linked to excellent maths skills and all round education. If children are literate in there first language learning a second is relatively easy. Bi lingual children often work at a similar if not higher level to their peers.

Most children benefit significantly from learning in a bilingual environment that includes first and second language learners.

Commitment to education and parental involvement is key. Students from immigrant parents often have a significantly higher commitment to education. The worse performing ethnic groups in the U.K. are white, British boys, boys from Afro Caribbean, Pakistani or Bangladeshi backgrounds.

I am interested to know which European students are impacting negatively on education in your opinion.

Rosstac · 05/08/2018 20:21

Bearbehind So my real life expectancies are just Chinese whispers, perhaps this is some of the problem, people don’t like the truth if it doesn’t fit in with what they want, what do I have to gain by lying on a small forum ?

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:22

Prove me wrong then fangirl

Prove to me why people are right to have an issue with immigration, so severe it's worth fucking up our entire economy.

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:24

rosstac what are your real life experiences that make all this worth while then?

Moussemoose · 05/08/2018 20:24

So *Rosstac the communities impacting negatively on education in your experience are......?

Rosstac · 05/08/2018 20:25

Moussemoose When you have a class of 30 and 6-8 of them speak no English and have an interpreter at a taxpayers cost how can that not slow down the learning, add to that more children of various ages joining through the year

surferjet · 05/08/2018 20:26

Bearbehind - you’re about 10 years behind on the immigration debate.
Read up on it ( & maybe put the wine down )

Peregrina · 05/08/2018 20:26

But don't go around telling everyone it definitely will happen as a fact because it might just not snow all winter.

We don't know where you live, but if you are posting from northern Norway or Canada you can definitely say it will snow. You can say this as much as I can say that the sun will rise tomorrow in the UK (or not in the Arctic in winter). Without a deal, or getting a UK authority up and running with the necessary agreements, the planes will not be certified to fly. That part is factual.

LikeIDo1 · 05/08/2018 20:28

Not all people who are against FOM are against immigration full stop. Some are but not all.

It's perfectly valid to want controlled immigration rather than free movement so to tar everyone with these worries as racist is predictable at best and extremely insulting at worst.

Rosstac · 05/08/2018 20:29

Boston area, I’m not giving my exact location out

frumpety · 05/08/2018 20:29

Rosstac your area must have an abundance of social housing if they are able to hand them out to EU citizens at the drop of a hat ? The waiting list here is very long , think years and years. Are you sure they are all EU nationals , is it possible that some could be refugees ?

Moussemoose · 05/08/2018 20:30

Very few children 'speak no English' and if they do it's not for long.

It also very much depends on their educational background which is why I keep on asking what community you are referring to.

A significant potion of the curriculum is maths and Polish children (in my experience) have excellent maths skills. Once the terminology is taught they may well be pulling up the weaker 'English' students.

So which European community is holding back the education of others in your area? I must admit I am puzzled by this.

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:33

you’re about 10 years behind on the immigration debate

I'm really not- it's you who wants them all to go home so your sons prospects improve surfer

LikeIDo1 · 05/08/2018 20:33

I'm in the U.K. and it was just an example of how you can predict something that might happen and it's ok to prepare but don't go around saying it will happen when they don't know.

People saying "everything's lives will be damaged for generations" is not helping their debate, it's undermining it. Saying "a lot of people's lives could be damaged in the future" would still be a valid argument but it wouldn't be adding to the hysteria.

Moussemoose · 05/08/2018 20:34

I will confidently say the sun will rise tomorrow. Am I wrong?

surferjet · 05/08/2018 20:35

Bear. You’re becoming hysterical - take a break.

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:36

like do you not think it's pretty pathetic to be arguing over semantics anyway.

Brexit was supposed to be perfect.

Easiest deal in history.

We'd have the exact same benefits.

Now you're arguing the toss over whether one can categorically say the sun will rise tomorrow or not.

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:37

I'm not hysterical surfer, I'm just fucking angry all your and your fellow Leavers arguments are still so pathetically weak,

SoloD · 05/08/2018 20:37

@LikeIDo1

The fact remains that the UK will be much poorer financially for leaving the EU. How much money are you personally willing to sacrifice for Brexit?

The issues with the EASA/CAA are not speculation. The UK is leaving the EASA, and if it's a hard brexit we are leaving in March. We have zero international agreements to fall back on. UK registered aircraft will need to be certified by the CAA but the CAA does not have the resources to do this. You can't pretend this is going to be somehow okay.

It worries me how ignorant people actually are to the effects.

SoloD · 05/08/2018 20:38

@Bearbehind

Your not the only one.

SoloD · 05/08/2018 20:40

@surferjet

I assume you are one of the 1% who will be better off after brexit. Do bare in mind that real people are going to lose jobs and incomes because of the Brexit.

time4chocolate · 05/08/2018 20:40

Bear - what the jeff is wrong with you tonight?

LikeIDo1 · 05/08/2018 20:40

I have to agree that people arguing that their children's education is suffering because of non English speaking children or they have to wait in A & E longer doesn't help with what could be a legitimate argument about school places being a problem as a whole due to a rising number in population.

It sounds like something in the DM along with "Muslims being offended by Christmas trees" and takes away from a valid debate about too many bodies on a small island wanting access to our ever stretched services (and I mean U.K. born citizens too here.)

LikeIDo1 · 05/08/2018 20:44

Mousse the harsh winter thing was just an example of preparing and predictions. It's wasn't supposed to be taken literally.

Bearbehind · 05/08/2018 20:44

time, I've sadly got sucked in today and am horrified that the level of thought has actually gone down.

I can't believe Leavers are actually spouting such nonsense now.

The pinnacle was surfers 'everything bad is all going to be the EUs fault for not agreeing to our demands'

Every time I think I've heard it all before, it sinks lower.