Any remainers here who don't think civilisation is about to collapse?

[Bloodylovepotatoes]

Die hard remainer here. Was gutted with referendum result, but I think it'll probably be a bit crap after for a while, then it'll level out and basically be fine. Don't think society will collapse.

Apparently this is a very unpopular opinion and either I should be a defiant leaver saying all will be wonderful and we'll have our sovereignty back and our blue passports and all those nasty foreigners will be gone, or I should be boarding up all my doors and windows and preparing myself for economic collapse and societal disintegration?

Is there no one like me?! No middle ground????

If anyone wishes to donate we are currently collecting bed linen and pjs. I would like to know if you are putting in the same hours as we are actually helping those that find themselves in difficulty? Rather than just sitting on forums using them as weapons?

Well, considering that you are a random stranger on the internet who happens to be claiming to volunteer at a food bank (whilst being surprised to learn that families are in desperate situations and at risk of getting yet more desperate) how would I know if my work matches yours?

I know I'm a teacher - who has worked for years in one of the most deprived postcodes in the country - who has taught plenty of children who come into school without breakfast, and has made sure they got some, who has spent masses of my own cash in topping up supplies for the children - both things school should be providing but can't afford to and things parents should be providing but can't afford to/ are not in a situation to look after their children's needs properly.

It's almost as if my concern for the vulnerable comes from my contact with them. That I understand why this could be such a dreadful thing because I see everyday, with my own eyes - how dreadful things already are... and that there is no room for them getting worse. And yet they may get worse.

But then I am an equally random person on the internet. You already don't believe I'm British or have ever visited, so why would you believe anything else?

If we had another vote that was RESOUNDING Remain, that would prevent civil disorder. Anything less & the saga continues forever.

It's almost as if my concern for the vulnerable comes from my contact with them. That I understand why this could be such a dreadful thing because I see everyday, with my own eyes - how dreadful things already are... and that there is no room for them getting worse. And yet they may get worse.

I'm finding it hugely insulting that you are implying those of us who happen to think Brexit might not be that bad because we simply don't know what is happening have no concern for the vulnerable.

I was one of those hungry children you are referring to.

If we had another vote that was RESOUNDING Remain, that would prevent civil disorder. Anything less & the saga continues forever.
or at least the Farage 5%

Even the most ardent remainers must realise that TM must negotiate with a no deal as a option, if the EU know a no deal is not an option they can give any shit deal and know it will be rejected

The EU want the UK to stay in the Customs Union (and ideally the EU)
I do not regard that as a shit deal

If you know how bad it can be out there - you know there are people for whom even minor price rices on everyday necessities causes real alarm - and that there are parents going hungry so their children can eat ... how can you think it won't be that bad?

Here's the thing - I hope we get some kind of deal (well I hope we remain but failing that...) in this event you are quite right - there will be no collapse of civilisation, stockpiles will simply get used up as normal. But for most people there will be a general shittening (it's a word) of quality of life. That will hit the poorest first, and hardest. Will some kind of deal make things 'that bad' for me? No - probably not*, my life will be a bit poorer, a bit less fun - but all right. I may even learn to forget what I once had. But for the poorest children I teach? and their families? Yes it will be 'that bad'. And for me that simply isn't good enough.

• assuming education budgets aren't slashed so hard I am out of a job.

A deal, anything but the softest of soft brexits, won't mean Armageddon but it will be a terrible thing for the most vulnerable. I would class that as 'that bad'. In fact I would classify it as 'unacceptable.'

In the event of no deal - then yes, we will be looking at shortages and civil disorder. And that will affect everybody negatively.

If you have experience of what poverty is like - and you still don't think guaranteed job losses and price rises and squeezed incomes (the govt reports state that no matter what the deal every family will be hundreds or thousands of pounds worse off per year) will be 'that bad' ... then I don't know what to say to you.

I never hear vicious anger on Remain side

You haven't read many of the threads on MN then..it's been chock full of vicious anger levelled directly at leave voters.

My god, we are in trouble of you are teaching the next generation. All the handouts in the world are not going to make up for the level of bitterness and lack of objectivity you are subjecting those poor children to. Are you actually like this with the children? Brainwashing them in the same way?

Truly a very sobering post that is causing me a great deal of concern
and alarm. I would not advertise too often you are a teacher tbh, you are doing the profession no favours whatsoever.

Does this count as a personal attack? It certainly doesn't add anything to the debate does it... and to think this poster accused me of being aggressive and saying things that were uncalled for

Ta1kinpeace That can not happen unless the EU relax FOM, it’s in there hands if they really want the U.K. to stay in the Custom union as it is at present

That can not happen unless the EU relax FOM, it’s in there hands if they really want the U.K. to stay in the Custom union as it is at present
Um no,
the whole point is that the EU want the UK to stay in the Customs Union

red lines about FOM are a silly Tory ploy
because the UK needs EU workers

Young people I work with are going hungry -we do direct them to food banks.

So this thread is all about how Brexit might cause some people to suffer a bit so it's ok. So Brexit is probably a bad thing but it will just be a bit or hunger. No one will die, people might lose their jobs but it's not that bad.

You know it's not good thing, you know society will suffer, but we're "plucky" so that's ok?

Well I don't think that's ok. I don't think civilisation will end but I want more than that for my country and the people in it.

This is the worst kind of 'Britishness' let's not make a fuss.

That can not happen unless the EU relax FOM, it’s in there hands if they really want the U.K. to stay in the Custom union as it is at present

The EU are not going to change their rules for the convenience of the member who wishes to abandon them. And that is not an unreasonable stance for them to take. They have to think of their remaining members.

It is only our red lines stopping the UK staying in the Customs Union. It is us who must budge or crash out. The EU can do nothing about that - except let us go with love.

Mousse

I do not think Brexit is a good thing. But I do not think there is anything to be done about it now, so I think we need to focus on finding a way to make the best of it and ensuring as few people as possible suffer.

Genuine question - how do you propose we do that?

Yes, we need foreign workers, but not FOM

Icantreachthepretzels Perhaps they could negotiate with love

Wonder why they are so twitchy
Anglo fascism is going so well, and it's so popular[ hmm]
icanreachthepretzels I am glad you are a teacher

Yes, we need foreign workers, but not FOM

What is so wrong with Freedom of Movement ?
bear in mind that the areas with the highest levels of immigrants voted remain and the lowest voted leave
EU migrants come here to work.
Brits go to Spain to retire / get drunk

I am glad you are a teacher

I'm not it's a mug's game!

Icantreachthepretzels

Go for as soft a Brexit as possible. That's what I'm hoping for anyway.

I don't know why people on these threads always say "well what do YOU think should be done then?". I haven't got a clue. I'm not in government. I don't work in policy. I'm not an economist. I vote in elections and I put my trust in those I elect. That doesn't mean they always do what I want - they very often don't. I didn't vote for a Tory government, and yet I've got one. I didn't vote for the Iraq war, and yet we went to war (and btw I remember at the time thinking that really was going to result in societal collapse). I didn't vote for Brexit, and yet we're getting Brexit (thanks David Cameron).

I assume even Theresa May et al don't actually want to crash out of the EU with no deal and cope with millions of starving, angry citizens en masse, and therefore I assume they will cobble something together. It may not be something I'd have done, if I were them, but that's not my job. I'm not a politician. I've never wanted to be.

If there is any minor cutting of the education budget, it is likely that we will have to lose a teacher and have classes bigger than 30. We're already down to the bone on TAs.

My volunteer role already gives me sleepless nights so to be honest I think I'd have to resign and concentrate on my business.
I don't think I'd be the only one.
Volunteering or paying the mortgage?
So no it won't be catastrophic but even a smaller level of shitness tends to fray the fabric of society.

Frankly I think a lot of answers to these potential problems could be solved by taxing the top 10% of earners more, but there you go, no one wants to pay any more tax, do they.

But the education budget is nothing to do with the EU
its a decision taken at Whitehall to keep UK taxes low and austerity crippling the public sector.
It could be reversed next week if the Chancellor chose.