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Brexit

Westministers: Operation Over The Cliff

978 replies

RedToothBrush · 26/06/2018 22:34

Bit late and didn't realise the last thread was so close to the end... so this is a very quick OP

What do you think the secret continency plan name the government have in place for the No Deal?

Suggestions Please

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22
Motheroffourdragons · 27/06/2018 09:04

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

Cailleach1 · 27/06/2018 09:14

Seymour Hersh on DP. It was sobering to hear him speak about how the US behaved in Vietnam. Slaughter and rape. The example of throwing babies in the air and having them land on a bayonet was really Nazi stuff. And yet there doesn't seem to have been any war crimes against humanity case in the Hague. A cover up and 3 month jail sentence in the US.

Currently, the children being separated from family and kept in cages in the US is a reminder, too. Their vulnerability in that situation doesn't bear thinking about. And some of the forces involved in Brexit.

lonelyplanetmum · 27/06/2018 09:18

A late place mat 👑.

I like a lot of the suggestions. Project Icarus is good. Also Project Emperor, like the emperor's new clothes.

My suggestion is a Bond like Project Nemesis.

This is in line with the old posts that Hubris was a factor getting us into this mess, which is followed in Greek Tragedy by Nemesis and Catharsis.

woman11017 · 27/06/2018 09:19

I also think that if you are privileged you tend to be blind to the worst of human failings and of the mindset that X will never happen

and

May's biggest vice as PM has been to foster and encourage a culture where potential lynchings are a possibility. Encouraging vigilantism is the stuff of fascists. It shows, ultimately, how far we have gone and moved away from democracy into a situation where parliamentary intimidation and vote rigging is real. With that the power of the people has already gone and been replaced by the power of thugs.

Yup.

'football lads alliance' are back in time for trump visit
Flowers and thanks RTB

20nil · 27/06/2018 09:29

Thanks Red.

The infuriating thing for me is that everything about this government is unravelling. Even putting Brexit aside, they are opening rowing among themselves, briefing against each other and having spats in public. And yet. And yet. They go in ruining this country and contributing to the terrifying rise of the hard right across the world. They should be toast but the opposition just isn’t up to it.

lonelyplanetmum · 27/06/2018 09:41

They should be toast but the opposition just isn’t up to it.

Sometimes David Miliband looks like he might be contemplating a rescue mission. Although today various sources including the Spectator and Piers Morgan seem to be doing their best to avert any chances of that.

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/06/david-miliband-takes-in-the-refugee-crisis-from-aspen/

SusanWalker · 27/06/2018 10:00

I watched a documentary once on the Vietnam war and what was done to some of the civilians was horrendous. One story will never leave me, it was so upsetting.

One of the very many things that upsets me about brexit, is the likelihood of much closer ties to the US. I don't hate Americans and I like that we have good relations with them, but I think we actually have less in common with them than we think. As I once heard someone say, America was founded by people wanting religious intolerance.

Hasenstein · 27/06/2018 10:13

I have noticed an interesting development in the BBC's Have Your Say sections relating to Brexit.

For the past 2 years, the Leavers were loud and goady in their support fror Brexit and dismissive of all "Remoaners", to the extent that I could only read a few pages without feeling suicidal. However, in recent weeks, views have been becoming far more balanced (in the sense of equal numbers, certainly not the intemperate language used!).

Yesterday, I saw an article about companies pulling out of the UK, which had well over 3,000 comments (unfortunately, it seems to have been taken down this morning). The comments were almost without exception anti-Brexit, with the majority saying that we need another vote. Quite a few of these were former Leavers who are waking up to the damage Brexit will cause and saying they would change their vote if given the chance. It was actually quite a pleasure to read the "Highest Rated" comments, every one of which took the view that we are stumbling towards disaster and destroying the economy. The only riposte from rabid Leavers was to complain about BBC bias for reporting the companies' plansGrin.

I know this is hardly a representative sample, but the recent turnround in attitudes has been remarkable. Maybe the march last Saturday has helped to show that a People's Vote is a possibility and a potential solution to the impending shitstorm. Of course, opinion polls show only slight movement to the Remain side, but avalanches start off small too. The only worry is the lack of time now to do a new vote.

WhatWouldScoobyDoo · 27/06/2018 10:15

Does anybody know if there are any more key dates (between now & next March) which will give any more clarity on where we are going to end up? Or is it the case that after last week’s votes the government can do anything now at any point? Are there any deadlines coming up with the EU?
Trying to work out (like others I’m sure) the urgency of trying to sort out an exit plan and when/whether there will be a clear indication that it is needed.

It’s a long shot in our case as DH would have to ask for a relocation within his company - he thinks they probably won’t be up for it though.

BrexitWife · 27/06/2018 10:18

Place mat king

DarlingNikita · 27/06/2018 10:24

Marking place. Thanks Red.

lonelyplanetmum · 27/06/2018 10:24

I think we actually have less in common with them than we think.

I am uncomfortable about closer US ties too. Especially with 65,800,000 + people who replaced Obama with Trump, and presumably thought the latter would be a great statesman.

I had an American boyfriend many years ago.Athough that's just one person, my predominant conclusion at the end of that relationship was that a common language tricks you into thinking you have more in common than you do.
Europe is an odd continent with such a concentration of different languages, but so many fundamental similarities. We are definitely culturally more similar to Danes, Germans or Portuguese than we are to most Americans, despite language differences.

BrexitWife · 27/06/2018 10:26

May's biggest vice as PM has been to foster and encourage a culture where potential lynchings are a possibility. Encouraging vigilantism is the stuff of fascists.
In and out of the governemnet.
So we have MPs receiving threats if they dint vote according to the PM.
Civilian population havung to keep an eye on their (foreign) neighbourg to check if they can actually live in the U.K./have NHS treatment etc...
And RESPECT too of course.

The deep conviction that Britain can not and will never be fascist or have a fascist government has made people blind.

AndSheSteppedOnTheBall · 27/06/2018 10:40

WhatWouldScoobyDoo

Key dates coming up:

There should have been one this week, when Theresa May was supposed to present our Brexit proposal to the EU, but she’s already said that’s not going to happen.

Next week is the cabinet sleepover at Chequers where they try to work out what the hell the plan is.

In theory, in October our final proposal should be agreed and goes before the E27 to vote on.

I think that’s about right. No idea when it might be make or break time though, it could all go down to the wire in March if nothing can be agreed on.

prettybird · 27/06/2018 10:46

WhatWouldScoobyDoo - you don't actually need to know any dates, just that the UK will miss them. Angry

Don't they know who we are? Deadlines aren't for the likes of us? You need us more than we need you etc etc Hmm

....and over the cliff we go Sad

DGRossetti · 27/06/2018 10:56

How do over 40s feel about paying more tax ?

20nil · 27/06/2018 10:58

Over 40 and happy to pay more tax.

RedToothBrush · 27/06/2018 11:20

How do over 40s feel about paying more tax ?

Rather pissed off. But that could be more to do with me just having had a significant birthday and this being a story to rub salt into the wounds!

Seriously though I'm currently not in employment so it won't affect me currently. What it does have is the the effect of making it harder for me to go back to work because its even less financially benefical for me to do so, if it were to happen in the near future. And that inturn also raises a point about woman who delayed getting pregnant until their late thirties because financially it was better. It also, if the situation arose, make it harder for me to leave my husband.

In principle the idea, isn't a terrible one. In practice I do think it depends on how exactly they do it. There could be unintended consequences the brunt of which are born most by women. As usual.

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RedToothBrush · 27/06/2018 11:26

I already know several professional women trying to juggle their work life and home life and balacing it with childcare costs.

The teacher has already decided to quit, and is doing so this year.
The part time gp is fed up enough of working 4 days a week, when she's only supposed to be working 3.

I know another who is literally already currently paying to work.

If they go in too heavily, it might be a tipping point for a lot of women.

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RedToothBrush · 27/06/2018 11:29

Sky News Breaking @skynewsbreaking
Andrew RT Davies has resigned as leader of the Welsh Conservatives

Sam Coates Times @SamCoatesTimes
More Airbus job losses announced

Sam Coates Times @SamCoatesTimes
4 days ago, in happier times because when I had more battery life:

Westministers: Operation Over The Cliff
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RedToothBrush · 27/06/2018 11:34

twitter.com/jg_environ/status/1011475118760095744

Read this thread about newspaper articles in 1934 in the NYT.

Its a sobering read.

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DGRossetti · 27/06/2018 11:37

How are Tories going to sell paying more tax .... to Tories ? Or are they so convinced that they have their support sewn up so tight - Leavers over Remainers - that they are going to try and sell tax rises to Leaver Tories, with the ever-present spectre of a Corbyn bogeyman to scare them into agreement ?

well, you have to pay more tax, you see, otherwise that Corbyn oik will get in ...

Of course, it's not all over-40s, is it ? Just the ones who aren't super-rich .....

GladAllOver · 27/06/2018 11:38

What do you think the secret continency plan name the government have in place for the No Deal?

It's called the "We don't give a stuff anyway because we all have nice MP pensions, consultancy jobs and private healthcare, and any time we like we can fuck off to our villas in France or Italy" Plan

BrexitWife · 27/06/2018 11:38

If they go in too heavily, it might be a tipping point for a lot of women.

Isn't that the point? When you are faced with a huge rise in unemployment, seeing people actually leaving work on their accord is a good thing. Figures look better! And does it matter if women can’t work, are not they supposed to be at home anyway?

Of course, they will forget very quickly that in recent years women are expected to be fully indépendant financially. So they will be the ones to totally screwed up when they want to get divorced etc..much more so than 15 or 20 years ago when being a SAHM was the norm (and they could get spousal maintenance).
So yep. Once again, it’s women who will be affected the most. Nothing ew there though. Numbers will look so much better!

RedToothBrush · 27/06/2018 11:39

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tony-blair-warns-return-dark-12800938#ICID=sharebar_twitter
Tony Blair warns return to the dark era of the Nazis is 'no longer far-fetched'

The former UK Prime Minister will sound the shocking warning about the surge of populists on the left and right in a major speech

Ahhhh fuck off Tony. You're not helping the credibility of the argument even though you are right.

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