Leavers Lagoon - all systems are go. all lights are green

[surferjet]

Good news yesterday < gets out green highlighter >
Still work to be done but it’s another step in the right direction.

Ps: completely given up on the Brexit Arms as it’s been taken over by remainers.
This is our chilled out place to post on in the run up to March 2019.

Positive people only

If we were only EU in name only, why make a fuss about wanting to Leave?

I too wonder about the "Will of the people" - the will of NI/RoI was for the Good Friday Agreement, but Gove and the DUP don't like it, so let's pretend it's already redundant and we can scrap it. The will of the Gibraltarians was to remain in the EU. Funny this, it's only some peoples' will which must be set in stone for all time.

And that's the crux of the brexiteerism of Brexit for a lack of an acceptable word. We have enjoyed a very special and privileged position of perhaps the main gateway to Europe. It's been very profitable. Not sure what they will miss after they have taken over the juiciest bits of our European business, but we will certainly miss the lost business and the resulting tax receipts far exceeding our rebated EU contribution.

And the benefits we gain as an EU Member Stat
is also economic and way beyond the pure cash contribution to the EU, is access to a Europe wide security system,
is access to 750 agreements from full Free Trade Agreements to bilateral trade area specific agreements.
Retaining any of this post leaving the EU is not guaranteed.

How am I ruining your thread surfer?

The point I’m making is that a lot of leavers seem to think a (narrow) referendum win should signal the end of the discussion and Remainers should put up and shut up (you’re right that they haven’t done this). But democracies don’t work that way. If Remain had won would that have been the end of the matter for you?

You clearly didn’t get the memo from remain HQ.
They admitted their campaign was crap because they focused too much on the financial side. that’s why you lost ( old news to everyone but you )
Politics is about emotions now.
Keep up.

Remain HQ? Sounds pretty paranoid to me.
Although I forgot that the NI border problem is EU/Remain vote fault. My 10 year old tried to pass the blame for bad ill thought out decisions she makes too.

"Politics is about emotions now."

That's very true actually. Some politicians have recognised that a large chunk of the population has degraded to the point where they are basically incapable of reasoning, and hence can be easily manipulated by emotional messages in the Heil, algorithmically targeted fake news etc.

Is that still an effective democracy? Well, clearly not.

Surferjet maybe politics is about emotions, but what drives those emotions?

Hope & fear.

I find I scary as hell that people are actually proud of the fact politics is about emotions now.

Some people appear not to have the sense they were born with and think it's perfectly fine to ignore all facts as long as their gut tells them to.

I'm understanding more now why CA is such a problem.

Some of you really are happy to be brainwashed.

That fills me with dismay Surferjet.

And ignorance. Don’t forget the ignorance. Worn like a badge of honour.

"Politics is about emotions now." Ever thus surely.

When were the halcyon days of the perfectly informed well educated voting public?

There's a big difference between 'perfectly informed' and choosing only to rely on emotions.

The slightly smarter Brexiters often attempt to cause confusion by casting problem as black or white. Is Brexit going to cause a holocaust and a Mad-max scenario in the near future? No? Great, let's get on with it then.

Politics was always about emotions. Nothing new about that. Leave ran a great campaign, remain didn't. That's a tragedy in my eyes, but it is the truth.

The biggest change in modern day campaigning is the variety of information sources out there (mostly unofficial) and the degree to which people are exposed to only similar points of view to their own (mostly on social media). It can mean views become more entrenched, the other side of the argument doesn't get listened to.

The remain campaign should have been savvier.

Leave ran a great campaign? A bloody red bus and a flotilla on the Thames. The bar was sooo low.

I didn't agree with it and the ethics were obviously questionable, but purely as piece of marketing it was very strong. That's part of the reason why we're in this mess.

The 'take back control' slogan was brilliant. It got to the heart of what people wanted to feel. The money for the NHS, while being a claim they should never have been allowed to make, was also an excellent tactic, allowing people to feel good about their decision.

Great marketing in the wrong hands can be very dangerous.

What Laurie is saying and I agree is that this is a race to the bottom. If algorithmic fake news, buses, fake pints and scruffy hair etc. work then this is how the game needs to be played in brexiteerocracy. You just need to do what Leave.EU did - treat the people like simple voting automatons, figure out how to push their buttons and execute whatever it takes. If the way to deliver is to look and behave like a bit of a moron or show up in a pub with - what was the term Farage used? The unwashed? - then go ahead. If you need to invade people's privacy, or steal essential research data etc. then just get on with it.

If someone sets out to maintain a certain level or ethics or set standards they are dead on arrival (in Britain anyway).

The big question here is why would all those Old Etonians go through all this effort and take all those risks. The payouts must have been huge. Where did the money come from?

Yep...
It's all about the feelz now...
Facts?
Figures?
Experts?
Fuck em!
The daily mail and vera down the road on fb know more than they do!
The DexEU has released its projections for the uks future outside the eu.
It's pretty bleak. No. It's very bleak.
And that's from the dept overseeing this clusterfuck...

Take back control

Make America great again

^ same rhetoric
^ same type of voter

I have reported Nigel farage to DEFRA for polluting the Thames 👍

I think - generally - that getting your only information on an issue off the side of a bus - and then voting in an important (but not legally binding!!😁) referendum on said issue - is perhaps not the most sensible thing to do...

As many regretful leavers are realising...

Their response is going to be that they didn't really care about the bus. They have been thinking about the matter for a long time, by which they would mean mostly absorbing their Daily Heils and Facebook feeds.

So what about all the fish they have to discard at sea. Why can't there be allowances for what is caught so this can be used. Right now a dead fish is a dead fish, it may have been a biproduct.... But why should it be dumped....