At last they get it!

[fryingtoday]

Channel 4 at last realise the huge Northern vote was not primarily about immigration but about the decades of politicians having ignored them ...

Let's see how long it takes everyone else to twig and really start to understand why.

Surely you can see that there is no intention to totally leave the EU.

We are never going to tell them to fuck off and get everything on our own terms.

Freedom of movement isn't going to change as it will be a requisite of freedom of trade.

I'd also love to know where you think the investment in these areas is going to come from. If we are part of the EEA, which is looking like the most likely outcome, we'll still be paying into that, just without the rebates and the seat at the decision making tables .

You asked for some reasons

These are what I have heard and read why people voted leave

Of course they are not going to convenice you

I asked for convincing reasons.

What is the point in choosing anything based on a completey skewed belief it will change something else?

Where have the reasons you've quoted actually been touted as deliverable and beneficial by leaving the EU?

disturbed
You can't do any trade with EU unless you give up to the demand of free movement of people. They have made it abundantly clear. Tell me one convincing reason why we are not fucked ?

I don't know one person that voted stay! I don't think any of them voted because of immigration and I think it was purely because they couldn't take anymore of David Cameron's bullshit!
No one had faith in him anymore! He cut everything in his power and made it so much harder to live!
What did David Cameron give to the lower class (northerners) to make them believe in anything he said?
I honestly believe that if he had taken more care of the lower class people and not the fat cats people would have more faith in him and listened to what he had to say!

Leave voters are taking a long time to realise that we are actually a small island and not a full proper continent like US.

Red tape means eg being allowed to ask a woman to declare whether she intends to start a family at a job interview. 70% of employers think it is right that they should be allowed to ask this, and that they should be able to sack a woman who turns out to have been pregnant when she was interviewed, with no legal comeback on them. This is leadsom's territory. This is what she wants. She belongs in the dark ages.

But you won't be convinced by anything but others were

But others have been and this is what I have heard from voters they believe this and this along with many other reasons is why they voted out

The weeks leading up to the referendum hundreds upon hundreds of articles were written, radio and tv programmes discussed the issue, social media campaigns and then probably most damaging the campaigns themselves

besuty
That's the whole argument of the Remain camp against the Leave voters now: the Leavers voted in a referendum that did NOT ask whether you like David Cameo. Or not . I hate him by the way. Do you feel if we make all these Leave voters that you know sit an exam where we ask a question and they answer just the way they did by voting Leave, will you pass them? I think that's an abhorrent fail and I know ALL my teachers would fail me.

beautyqueen genuine question - given David Cameron originally said he would stick around whatever the outcome, what did you hope to achieve by voting to give him and his 'fat cats' control?

bearbehind
Ha ha ha ha ha . Spot on

Those voters aren't interested in "plans" that Cameron and the Etonians talk about, or lectures on "Punishment Budgets" or doom and gloom from public servants. People know it is all bullshit so they called their bluff.

Fucking right. And to that I will add that I can't summon up any remorse whatsoever that your kids may not be able to study or work abroad.


I don't want to be in any camp I don't want to undermine why people choose to vote the way they did or question their intelligence or disregard their experience that lead them to make the choices they did

But I really want to know why people voted the way they did. Both sides. And if I think it's bullshit on both sides, then I will call them on it. And so should everyone.

Beauty, what has anything you've said about people's voting behaviour got to do with the EU????

And to that I will add that I can't summon up any remorse whatsoever that your kids may not be able to study or work abroad.

Clearly some people are still in their own little bubble.

How do you think we will negotiate freedom of trade without freedom of movement?


What did David Cameron give to the lower class (northerners) to make them believe in anything he said?

I totally get that. I think what some of us are struggling with is how voting Leave and handing more power to Cameron (or his successors, as it turns out) helped to change that?

I can absolutely understand the anger and sense of disenfranchisement in many parts of the country, and the desire to lash out. I'm with winky on this - people voted for a wide variety of reasons on both sides. I'm just really, really worried that the very people who apparently voted leave because they feel angry, trapped and powerless may see things actually get worse as a result of Brexit, both short term and long term.

Queen, tbh I don't think anyone was expecting you to. But I am really worried about the people struggling to pay the grocery bill already who'll see it go up 10% if this is the new ceiling for the pound, the people who won't get to see a doctor because public funds have shrunk through a toxic combo of higher debt servicing (a good portion of the national debt is in dollars), and lower tax take due to a smaller economy and fewer net income tax contributors (which is what EU migrants are as a whole), and the people who'll see job opportunities disappearing from their regions because all the sweeteners in the world for Nissan and Siemens won't help when being in the EU was a critical reason for them being here.

disturbed
That's against the very soul of democracy if you say you want that. Surely democracy means listening to people who the principles for humanity and the right cause etc etc ? If you refuse to call the wrong doers out, you are in with them in every possible meanings of the word. The Leave voters made a big big error of judgement and calling them out on it is democracy isn't it?

Personally I didn't vote leave I'm talking about people I know that struggle day in day out!
I feel that no one really paid attention to anything he said even if it was right because of what he's done to the lower class since he gained power!

I believe it went like this! People were fed up of David taking the piss with the cuts and how he treat the lower class people like shit that no matter what he said he would have never have been right! Someone's come along that's gave them some hope of a brighter future when they were down on their ass so they went with him!
If you're down on your ass and someone comes along and promises to make things slightly better you're going to run with it rather than go with someone who has fucked you over in every way possible!

But where were the leave voters promised anything that wasn't lies or propaganda?

As an outsider I don't understand how any of you can call what went on democracy in any shape Or form

If it was big brother it would have been riveting

As real life it is terrifying

Calling them out on what

Their experience

What that have taken from information they have read/heard

On making a decision on how to
vote

There is discussion and debate but when people are giving their reasons for many it's not enough and never will be

The thing I have learnt from this referendum is that I had no idea that politicians were so out of touch with so many people that so many people were willing to take the gamble of there being a difficult time ahead in order for change to come about

It reminds me of the riots we have where pp completely trash their own neighbourhood.

Those lies and propaganda are more than they have ever been promised before!

All this naval gazing is too fucking late anyway. you voted. It's done.

The question is where do you go from here?

The tories are all set for a free trade race to the bottom I hope you know.

I was at a Brexit conference during the week and it was so depressing how much more red tape had been added to our lives.

And I'm not actually in the uk...