Parent living with us – fair household contributions and the legal position?

[whatsyouradvice]

We’re in England. My partner’s elderly parent lives with us and has a degenerative condition with substantial day-to-day care needs. Paid carers cover some of this, but we provide considerable unpaid support around their visits. There is also the care coordination, appointments, equipment, adaptations and extra household work.

We want to support them, but after several years of supporting older relatives, the impact on our lives is considerable. We have very little free time, rarely get away, and my employment choices are being shaped by the family’s needs.
My partners’ parent suggestion is that their contribution should cover their share of bills only, preserving their savings for future care. I understand why having money available for care matters. However, I’m concerned about keeping their living expenses low when doing so depends on substantial contributions from us, both financially and through our time and unpaid care. I’d like an arrangement that considers everyone’s needs and to take into account this huge change for us. And for me as the wife, it's falling on me more!

I’m not asking to be paid for care. I’m asking whether a contribution towards living in our home beyond their share of bills would be reasonable—for example, an additional £100–£150 a month towards household upkeep and unexpected costs.
For others who have had an elderly relative live with them:

• Did they pay rent or board - e.g. rent a room or contribute to household upkeep, or just cover bills?
• Is a contribution beyond bills legally acceptable, and could it raise deprivation-of-assets concerns if council-funded care is needed later?
• How did you agree a fair amount and record the arrangement?

Parent won't qualify for CHC as yet and gets a lower-level attendance allowance
I’d appreciate real experiences of making this fair and sustainable for everyone.

OP there’s good advice on here . I’d contact AgeUK for advice . My local one sent someone to my mum’s flat to discuss finances and helped fill in the form for attendance Allowance and the blue badge . Make sure your DH is there , as it might sink in that his DM can contribute more to the household expenses and that’s it’s not deprivation of assets .
Also keep all receipts and bills for any work done in the house for mil .
Does your dh have LPOA for his dm ?
OP I applaud you for caring for your PIL .
My DM is 91 and has carers which she hates and wants to live with me and my DH . I’m currently recovering from a knee injury , so can’t care for her as well . We’d also have to spend a small fortune making the house suitable for her.
You have my upmost respect and sympathy

It’s not your parent it should not affect your employment choices.

My MIL had cancer last year, DH was newly retired and it fucked up our plans. He travelled the 250 miles and lived with her for 2 months in total coming home for 6 weeks between the months.

My friend ended up in a similar situation this year so her DH travelled a 80 mile round trip three days a week.

You support partners but not to the detriment of your own career.

I hope you do push ahead with getting legal advice. I suspect you’ll be told it’s much more sensible to for them to contribute by paying market rent for room (have a legal agreement) plus bills plus expenses which is reflective of reasonable everyday living costs and not deprivation of assets. As opposed to one large “gift” to cover everything which could be seen as deprivation of assets.

It’s the same money but just needs to be given in a way that will satisfy any potential box tickers at the council in years to come.

Before your legal appointment I would have a think about things that it would legitimately make sense for them to pay for. For example how much do you use the car? if it’s predominantly their appointments as you work from home, it makes sense they could pay to own and run a car and hsve you insured on it. That’d be a couple of k per year for me. You are probably saving them £60-70k a year at a cost to yourself, it’s not unreasonable to try and balance out your losses and their savings.

you say partner here. you are not married? and you are risking your career prospects and your pension with zero protection for yourself. This is far too dodgy. Let him take care of his own parents and go and get yourself a job.

If you’re not married you could be in serious trouble…

I think that that contribution to rent, bills and the hours you are working for them isn't unreasonable especially as they have money. They sound happy to get it all for free ISH!

The big red flag here is you depriving yourself of earning potential to be the caregiver. It helps that you are married because you will have a right to share in assets, but the impact on your future earning potential is cumulative. Your husband is asking you to make yourself vulnerable to help his parent. At the very least he needs to acknowledge this reality.

It is perfectly normal for even an elderly person to pay rent. I do not understand the hang-up some people on this site have about paying rent. It’s normal to pay for housing whether through a mortgage or rent.

OK so what research has he actually done on this? Has he asked a solicitor, has he contacted Age UK, has he spoken to your local authority social workers in the adult care team?

I am guessing he's done none of that and is just insisting he knows best based on his own feelings. So now it's your turn to insist. He needs to do two things. One, consult one of the above sources to get an informed opinion (not ask his mate whose wife used to be a social worker..) Two, he needs to pick up the hands on work. You said

I make beds, wash up, do cleaning, etc etc etc

Stop. Just stop. If he thinks this is work that should be done for free, then he should do it. This is his parent, after all. You are BUSY. There is no time for you to do these things. You're working to earn money. He can do them himself or he can pay a cleaner etc to do them. Draw a line.

If this all feels mean, unkind, petty and so on, then ask yourself how kind it is to expect your life partner to do a load of work for nothing and get no benefit, for someone who's not your parent.

Get them to pay for a cleaner to clean up the extra mess for a start.

I would work out what your annual salary would be if you were working normally and what it is now to accommodate them and get them to pay the shortfall. Your family shouldn’t be picking up the cost of their care to preserve their savings

There is an easy solution here… go get the job that you think you’re being held back from. That would give you the security you need for the future AND force the hand of the situation to find a better way than dumping it all on you.

Where I live this would cost upwards of £700 a month (south west)- have you had a look at comparables locally- do that, and keep records, I can't see the local authority having a leg to stand on as regards deprivation of assets if you are charging the lower end of the market rate and thats without the caring on top

I think their condition has a huge impact on the direction this will take, especially financially. Is it one carer, one call a week? Depending on their condition and how much you are having to do to promote and maintain their independence, maybe more care is needed to lighten the load now before you burn out. Have you a social worker? Getting in touch with your adult social services would be the first step they can advice do a financial assessment on in-laws finances and their needs. They maybe able to contribute to the care. Have you had a referral to the occupational therapist? If your in law has paid for equipment themselves I’m assuming possibly not. Get a referral in because they provide things like that in most if not majority of councils.

i personally would only expect them to pay for their food etc. You do have to be careful keep all receipts. Have you got power of attorney for finance AS WELL as health. Many people just do finance but health is a must.

I agree.

Did you in-law sell a property to move in with you? Do they have other outgoings that they are spending their pension on? Definitely need to contribute more.

Council/adult social services will not accuse you of purposely wiltering their finances down. You just have to make sure for your own protection that you keep written documentation even do a tenancy agreement to cover your back. Saving money for future care is not worth the effort. Because they will still be entitled to care regardless how much money is in the bank and the cost of care for private clients their savings don’t last long anyway. Get in touch with adult social services for an assessment of their needs etc. they can also advise.

Hi,
My father in law lived with us for 3 years until he died. Its not the same situation as you, as we bought a house between the three of us and had it adapted to meet his needs, the plan was that he would never go into a care home, but would be cared for at home until he died. However, that was an agreement made between the three of us and included that I would not go back to work, I was on maternity leave when we made that decision, and would care for him, which I agreed to and wanted to do. We still had paid carers come in to do heavy lifting, i.e getting him out of bed in the morning and putting him to bed at night which he paid for.

We had a bank account with all three of us on it, this was where all bills and expenses were paid from, and we each contributed equally to that, but I did buy all the food and cook for all of us.

Have you been assessed by adult social care? We had a social worker and she was very good at supporting us, particularly around arranging respite care so we could go on holiday as a family. Even though my father in law self funded, the social worker was able to arrange things like respite.

I can't help much on the legal side of things as we were in a different situation, but do seek support from social services and action for carers who provide excellent advice and support for unpaid carers. Please also make sure you are registered with your GP as an unpaid carer as you can get some support that way.

Why are YOUR employment opportunities reduced when it is HIS parent?

My mother lives with us and contributes a third of all household bills (3 adult earners so 3 way split) and then gives me £100 a week towards food and petrol for appointments.

I understand that they can pay you for ‘admin’ of which I know there is a lot! I would suggest you think about how much of your time is spent organising medication, appointments and liaising with doctors and apply a minimum wage calculation at the very least.

Mum pays for her own carers twice a day, and if I go on holiday, my mum pays for her own respite care in a local nursing home (min two weeks) or increased care at home.

I would suggest that on top of their share of the bills that they pay £240/ month into your pension, as your work is the one affected, otherwise when you are elderly there will be no £200000 pot to provide for your care.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cr93zp78g580o

I’d be looking for 35-50% of the total household running costs. Including mortgage and all bills.
Saving money for care is ridiculous when you’re giving up your best years to care for them. No weekends away. No holidays. They should be paying for the things you are sacrificing

There is no deprivation of assets for a regular monthly contribution to the household that you are living as part of. Family do not need to be under formal contracts such as the rent a room scheme unless you wish to do so.
This affects your ability to do things & can also make other things more expensive for you.
My parent lives with me, has her own lounge, bedroom & bathroom, I pay for everything at home bills, food, decorating & heating, it would not be reasonable for her to just pay a minimal % as how does that cover the parts of my house that I now don't get to use. I do everything & organise everything.
At this point I do not provide any personal care but as they aged I didn't want them at the other end of the country.
When I made the offer I suggested a figure, if they weren't happy I said we could discuss it. I then left them to think about it, they had put their house on the market & moved in 8 weeks later before the sale completed.
If my siblings object then they can offer to house the parent.......

Can I ask what nationality you all are as families often think they have to keep up appearances etc.
I'd say get a job you want and tell your husband to get more carers in / deal with it.
Don't get bogged down in care only as its a miserable life for you.
If parent has substantial savings they shd be looking at passing it onto you both. You then put it in an isa each and keep it there.
I understand parent wanting it for care bt what if it they pass away and you have to pay 40% tax on it then?!
If they do have to move to care they can start fu ding and if they run out costs then get paid by local authority.
Don't bother about deprivation of assets.
Did they have a property before moving in with you?
Message me if u prefer

Your DH is being utterly ridiculous. Of course it's not "deprivation of assets" to pay a reasonable going rate for services received. They can pay you rent at market rates and wages for your time at market rates and it would not be deprivation of assets. It would only be investigated as potential Deprivation of Assets if it was ridiculously disproportionate eg if you started getting rent at £10,000pcm or were being paid £1000 per hour for caring services - ie massively overcharging in order to run down the savings balance to zero as quickly as possible.