Overheard my mother talking to my sister

[Thegreengreengrassofhomes]

Currently staying with DM (93). I have been living abroad for 12 years but we have been thinking about moving back home to be closer to DM & have been looking into schools etc for DC (aged 9 and 10). DM is very independent but we have been visiting regularly since covid (long-haul flight away) and I’ve been helping with lots of things which have enabled her to stay safe & independent.

My sister and I have never been close. Sister has a high-powered job, also lives abroad but can’t visit DM as often or move home to help her due to her work. DH & I can continue to do our jobs in either place, so things are easier for us in that sense.

Since I first mentioned the idea of moving back a few months ago, DM hasn’t seemed very enthusiastic. I have asked her about this and she said she was worried about my dc’s education. The school systems in both countries are fairly similar and dc would be attending good private schools either way, so this didn’t make much sense to me.

I’ve just overheard DM on the phone to my sister, talking about me as though I were an inconvenient house guest (I have spent the week helping her with all sorts of quite serious practical things). She then started to discuss my planned move in a very disparaging, negative way. She mentioned that it was a bad idea but that unfortunately she “wouldn’t have any say in the matter.” At that point I went out into the garden to compose myself!

I’ve always found that my DM has a habit of telling people what she thinks they want to hear, so I’m rather curious why she was saying these things to my sister.

Had she been as frank with me, I would have dismissed the idea of moving. I was becoming resigned to it and DH/DC were starting to talk about with more enthusiasm but we are actually much happier where we are and certainly not bothered if the move doesn’t happen.

The whole idea was just about helping my DM. I am DM’s primary POA if anything happens to her, and I felt that she would be able to stay independent for longer if I were nearby.

Just wondering if anyone can offer any words of wisdom as I’m feeling quite hurt and confused.

One more vote for stay put and tell her why.

I’d do as PP’s have advised-tell your Mum and sister that you overheard their conversation and now that you realize that your Mum really doesn’t want you to move closer, you’re cancelling your plans. Don’t pretend that you’ve just changed your mind, tell them the truth.

Does mum moan to you about your sister, is it a bit of game playing you off against each other.

I’m 48, my sister is 54.

It's apparent that, for whatever reason, your Mum doesn't want you to make the move. I think it could actually be genuine guilt. You'd be giving up (presumably) a good lifestyle in a country where you are happy and where the kids are settled.

When she told your sister "it was a bad idea" and "she wouldn't have any say in the matter" perhaps she meant exactly that and nothing disparaging or any deeper. She feels it is foolish for you to move but you have obviously made up your mind and she feels she can't dissuade you.

Is it also possible that she is concerned about playing a greater role as a grandmother which at 93 is probably daunting?

DH’s parents are much younger than DM. They live elsewhere, very independent, but have his sisters nearby if needed.

DH has been incredibly patient about all of this, was happy to let me take the lead as long as the DC were ok about the plans (which they were).

@Raincloudsonasunnyday

I’ve learned over the years not to try to make sense of it. Sense isn’t what matters to them. It’s the ability to maintain a certain sense of themselves that they want.

So true. Old relatives, by marriage, have been 'a thing' in recent years and I have learned to cut them some slack but back off.

Making a major change in circumstances over a distant (emotionally and geographically) 93 year old relative is not sensible. What state will they be in in, say, two years? How long will they live? And then what's the fall-out?

The surest thing is that it probably won't play out as you imagine.

It might not actually be about your sister at all. It might just be that your move is a reminder that she can’t be as self-sufficient or independent as she once was. Rather than facing these feelings, she might be redirecting her resentment towards you.

As PP have said, you’re not going to know until you talk to her.

Tbh OP, when I’m 93, I wouldn’t want my child making any major moves for my sake either. The reality is that your Mum may not wake up tomorrow, her time is v. limited now. She may feel guilty that you’re making a move that could turn out to be pointless.

In your mums head she’s the completely independent person she always was. pretty standard as she is living by herself and she’s ok. the stuff you do is something she can do for herself etc

you know it’s not true and your mum probably knows at the back of her mind she needs help. You moving closer means that she really has to face the fact she older and needs help

it doesn’t sound like she’s dealing with this well and the overhead conversation is a result.

I would have a conversation to dm and dsis around the fact dm doesn’t seem keen on you moving and after consideration you are staying put.

If you don’t have the discussion, be prepared for her to turn this back on you when something happens and for your dsis to agree that you said you were moving and if you had whatever emergency has arisen is now your fault. So dsis keeps her halo, and her cosy life, and firmly puts the emergency in your court to solve

This. And as PP said mum's do tend to tailor what they say to their kids in different ways.

Actually not really. She is always praising her successful career etc.

She does express worries about my sister being single/lonely - she divorced many years ago and has one grown up child, no partner for many years.

Must say, I’m very grateful indeed to everyone who has responded. So many thoughtful & constructive responses.

To me it seems as if she's telling you both what she thinks you want to hear.

I think, at these times, you have to imagine what you would do and feel at 93 years old. Would you want your kids to give up their lives, to make their lives more difficult, because of you. I know i wouldn’t. I would want to put them first as I always have. (And I’m aware it’s easy to say that now, with no health issues, cognitive decline etc. But your children are still young. You have to put them first)

She's 93. Cut her some slack. She's compos mentis but less independent and knows she won't be around for very much longer (probably) even if she doesn't say that. Who knows why she was being dismissive but maybe she was spinning a line for your sister's benefit.

I think you're in danger of falling out over nothing, which isn't going to make you or her happy.

Yep. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. Your mum doesn't want help.

It's sad. But it is what it is.

I think you definitely need to challenge ber first asking her what she said and why.

I think in your position I would
a) be really bloody pissed off and be unable to stop giving her a piece of my mind
b) be going home
c) be scrapping any move plans
d) telling her why you are doing B&C as part of the piece of my mind in part A
e) mentioning all of the above next time she wants your help.

Unless there is some cognitive decline at play here there is no excuse for being rude about the person you want to help you.

I agree with posters who say do not tell your DM you overheard her. She will either deny, claim total blank, or get angry and divert attention to your "eavesdropping". This will derail any possibility of a discussion.

My dad was very difficult.... discussing anything with him necessitated a casual but well planned script. Faux breezy. He has dementia now and is in care so i just kind of agree with everything. So I'm talking from years of experience.

It sounds like your DM isn't keen on the move. I would tell her you've been thinking about what she said about the schools and maybe it's best not to move right now. Ask what she thinks.... as if puzzling out any other positives or negatives and she may give some clue. Reassure her that you will be available to visit and support her, like you have been doing - use examples from this trip. And say that you can always consider a move "later on". In my experience older people seem to like kicking decisions down the road - goodness knows why!

What do you think?

Ah so actually what you mean is that you get stuck with the donkey work such as care and the grief of POA while your mum slags you off to your sister who keeps her at arms length and gets to do one not-too-onerous executor duty and still be the golden one.
so many people on this board in thr same position, makes me very glad to be an only. While all the caring (a lot) falls on me at least I don't have to deal with that.

@Goinggreymammy

In my experience older people seem to like kicking decisions down the road - goodness knows why!

Because they won’t have to make the decision at all, ultimately. My Mum readily confesses it’s one of the ways she deals with ageing and the knowledge she doesn’t have long left: she can leave the fallout for other people to deal with.

I am very fortunate to have my dad who, to me, is an example. He has tidied everything up, discussed everything with his heirs well ahead of time, covered every permutation of contingencies for his and my mum’s old age - and all in good time so he now enjoys his remaining days pursuing his passions (mostly, his dgc and his intellectual interests). He’s faced mortality head on, and it’s extremely comforting for everyone affected.

Thank Goodness you heard the conversation, now you don't need to disrupt your family / schools etc.

OP I haven’t had time to read the whole thread and apologies if I’ve misunderstood . However it would be normal to have 2 executors not just one - so I would be wondering why you and your sister are not joint executors. Sorry that’s a bit off piste - but it doesn’t make sense .

Have you seen her will? Could it be she is intending to leave your Dsis more than you, because she is single?

If you move back to care for her that doesn't look good.