Just had very upsetting phone call from my mother, 92

[LindorDoubleChoc]

😥

She's been in hospital recently (I went to visit when she was in) but now back in her care home. Her mobility is getting worse to the point where she now needs help to get to the toilet, which I understand is the final indignity.

But she just rang me (I'm at work) to tell me that she hates everything and she wishes she wasn't here any more. What am I supposed to do with that? I got upset and a bit angry and said "how do you think that makes me feel Mum? please don't say things like that to me!" then we both cried.

Of course I feel awful now. I know that ageing is a brutal process, I have witnessed it first hand and been as supportive as I know how to be. But it's so stressful and depressing to hear a loved one talking like this. She feels (and always has) able to tell me this sort of stuff and I've been hearing it for years. Just when she needs comfort the most I've been horrible!

I feel SO DOWN but also terribly guilty now. And I've got a busy afternoon of work ahead and I'm crying like a loon. I'll have to ring her back, what can I say?

And they might be allowed to say they've had enough, but it's very unhelpful to phone someone at work to tell them that.

Yes quite. After my dad had been ill for five years off and on with heart failure he finally needed round the clock care in a care home for what turned out to be less than two weeks of his life as a hospice was not available and hospital could not provide that kind of care, and we certainly couldn't do that at home.

It involved decisions such as when to administer very strong morphine and so on and I just wasn't prepared to do that or be accused of getting it wrong and killing him or something later.

Oh DFO. I would never, EVER, put this on my children. Old age and the accompanying loss of capability changes a lot. Whatever your intentions now, you have no idea how you will act when you feel alone and helpless.

My mother went into hospital in her late 80's, none of us realised beforehand that she had cancer, and she asked for DNR to be put on her notes as soon as she arrived.

She also said to me that she'd had a very happy life and didn't mind if she died that night, we didn't take that as a reflection of how she felt about us but as a normal acceptance of death as she got older. She'd seen too many friends linger on and didn't want to outlive her comfortable years.
I can't imagine feeling like that now, though I'm in my 70's, but I guess I will.

Hi OP, I don't know if you are still reading these replies. I just wanted to offer some support. I was in almost the same position as you're in. It is very hard.
I had been pretty much estranged from my mum for decades because of her treatment of me as a child. Nothing dramatic just neglect and an almost total lack of interest in me.
She was very hard to deal with when she became older. It was very upsetting at times. I live hours from where she did and travelling to see her was exhausting.
Some people understand your position and some don't. You can only do what you can and give what you can.
I hope you can be good to yourself, I'm glad your husband is available and gets it. Make sure you have a rest . I found that nothing I did or gave made any impact at all on my mother, her mental health was untouched by how often I visited.

I am still reading, thanks for your post @Notgoodatpoetrybutgreatatlit. And everyone else.

To a pp who said "why did you put her in a care home" I wish you'd at least read my posts on the thread. There aren't that many of them. My Mum CHOSE to live in this care home. She expressed a wish to go this particular place (if it came to it) several years ago. The alternative would have been a live-in carer in her tiny house. She does have a diagnosis of "some mixed dementia" since June, as it happens - although it's very early days and you wouldn't notice it.

But anyway, we've had two good phone conversations since the "I want to die" one and are friends again now.

One other thing - we aren't close and never really have been. I won't go into the reasons for it but we were a stately homes family. I do love her (probably more so now than ever) and I know I might miss her at times when she's gone, but the "you'll wish you could see her and hear her voice one more time" comments are probably quite wide of the mark.

@LindorDoubleChoc I appreciate your position.
Before my DM went into hospital for her final illness she had made it clear to us that if she was unable to live alone at home she wanted to go into a care home, and had even chosen where she wanted to go.
I can't understand why some posters are unable to understand that not all older people want to live with their families, however well they get on and however much they love each other. They want to live in a care home.

It isn't just that they don't want to impose on their families, it is that they want to maintain their dignity, amongst other things, and have more control over their lives.
I can appreciate that some people do not feel like this, but it is wrong for them to criticise other families who do.

She didn’t “put her in a home”. The mum freely chose to go into what sounds an excellent home. She can’t walk, and the OPs home is not at all suitable in any case.

You are human. She is human. You posted on here saying you felt upset and guilty. You get a lot of not very supportive or helpful comments from a load of who knows who off the internet. Focus on the nice comments Lindordoublechoc and don't feel you have to get drawn into more and more justifications. Your situation sounds very sad and difficult. It is for you, it is for her. The irony of so many of the replies on here is they say you should be looking for support elsewhere, not expecting her to be able to alleviate your feelings or sadness, yet when you come elsewhere to a forum where people should be able to offer that support, you get a lot of replies that would magnify the feelings of guilt and sadness you are already feeling.

My take on this is that the guilt and sadness in this sort of situation is going to be inevitable. You feel guilty that ultimately you can't take this all away from her, it is what it is. You feel sad because she is very old and feeling down and putting that on you because she doesn't have anyone else to offload on. It is rubbish being offloaded on and can leave you with terrible feelings of stress. That your mother is sad, doesn't mean you need to take on all that burden too. To be most helpful to your mother you perhaps need to put a slight gap between her feelings and yours. Her feelings are her feelings and you can hear them without feeling that you have to try and immediately solve them. Some things aren't easy to solve. She may not let you try to anyway.

Most important is to be a bit forgiving of yourself. You got upset. You said something to her when she was being depressed at you when you were at work and it really was a hard time for you to receive that. Is it the end of the world you were a bit upset? It is a sign you care for her. Be nice to yourself. It's not an easy situation. You're human, you can only do your best. Ignore the perfect in all circumstances crowd and remember showing you're human is not a bad thing sometimes.

Oh dear OP that sounds horrendous, and you've also got some really horrible comments on here! Just remember your time and energy will differ to others - not everyone has the time or energy to do a multiple hour journey several times a week! You MUST prioritise your own health and keeping a roof over your head as you're working (some of the respondents on here can't possibly still be working full time).

Ignore the people suggesting you take her home with you. A dangerous and impractical suggestion.

I'd suggest putting in place some boundaries:

I don't take calls from my DM during working hours. My phone is set so they don't get through. I don't need the hassle and upset.

Limit visits. She has friends nearby and your brother, who sounds like he has more spare time than you. This could go on for years, you don't want to burn out. Maybe settle at visiting once a month as it's such a long journey.

Encourage her to talk to others so it's not all on you. Too often daughters are expected to take all this stuff onboard! She could talk to your brother, her friends, is there a local befriending service or church or something at the home? Does the home know what she's saying and can they suggest any activities to give her a sense of purpose?

My mum repeatedly said she want to end it all after my dad died. It was only the dog keeping her going. Well thanks for that mum.

@LindorDoubleChoc you have my sympathy. I don’t know what to suggest just wanted to let you know that it’s ok for you to now want to hear shit like that x

Have you ever cared for someone who is frail and incontinent? Who needs someone to do everything for them 24/7?

That's the reality.

What is wrong with you ?
a) why do you think being in a home is bad for the woman's MH ? Most nursing homes are not like prison camps and have loads of activities etc going on, they are safe, fed, cared for and have lots of company from their peers. For many frail, elderly people a nursing home is just what they need particularly if they have been struggling with declining health while living alone and trying to maintain a property. My Dad would much prefer to be in a residential home if he were on his own as he enjoys company and would be very lonely on his own. He would then be looked after, fed and not have to worry about something happening to him while he was by himself and nobody knowing.
b) if you don't know that people go into nursing homes for a myriad of reasons other than alzheimers I'm not really sure what to say to that
c) it's all very well refusing to go into a home. Where/who do you propose might end up doing 24/7 care for your mother if she is paralysed/has Parkinson's disease/motor neurone disease. What if her home is not suitable for her care needs ? My mother needs full time care all the time. Are you going to give up your life/family to facilitate that ?

unfortunately lots of people think like you u til mum or dad has a medical need that shows it to be completely unrealistic.

Amen! People have no idea how draining it is to be changing pads, washing bedding because the pads leak, washing sofa covers because the pads leak, telling your parent 25 times a day that they do live here, it's their home, reminding them who YOU are because they've forgotten, worrying they'll let themselves out of the house and die in a hedge somewhere after they've wandered off, fed them because they have no appetite any more, reminding them to drink because the incessant urine infections are getting harder to treat, dealing with cellulitis in legs because the circulation is failing etc etc etc. it's relentless! A care home has 24/7 attention on tap and some people need that.

No, it’s not right, @Doteycat , but it frequently happens with elderly people. My Dad (85) was being awful yesterday, but he’s better today. He doesn’t think of my feelings at all, he’s lonely since my SM died and has health problems. So I let it wash over me.

Many, many people experience this with elderly parents. 🤷

It's not uncommon for very old people to feel like they are done.
You won't have her much longer op. Be there for her as much as you can.

My Grandma is the same. She’s 103 and has just had enough. She hates being in the nursing home, but unfortunately there really is no alternative.

@Tessabelle74 makes my 84 year oldFIL seem very fit- he walks a couple of miles a day, eats very well and makes reasonable dinners himself , likes a drink most evenings and is off to Sweden with us for new year.

He's a bit prone to repeating himself and his hearing aid whistles occasionally , but that's it really

Luckily this is a lady I care for, not a relative but it's a good example of how things can be in older age. People think it's just a case of granny sitting on the corner knitting, they don't really think about if granny is actually poorly

I see you @LindorDoubleChoc

I hear you and I see you.

When my mum lived with my Nan who had Alzheimer’s, there were times when my mum snapped after being asked the same question for the umpteenth time, ALL DAY.
Or because my Nan had been asked not to do something and of course would forget and continue to do said thing (hazardous things). And the guilt still hasn’t left my mum and my Nan passed away in 2007.

You’re a human being.
If anyone says they’d never do that, they’re lying!! They clearly haven’t been privvy to that kind of situation and therefore should keep their comments to themselves.

Your feelings and emotions are valid, just as your mums are. I’m more than happy for you to message me if you ever want a chat with someone who isn’t going to slam you for feeling as you do x

Then she's very selfish.
At this stage, I'm afraid OP's mental health in the prime of her life takes priority over someones at the end of theirs.

I wonder if you will feel the same when you are at the end of yours?

How did you work that out? 🤔
I mean, says who?

You can’t put someone in a home if they have capacity to make the decision and don’t agree.

I don’t agree with this idea that a younger person’s needs automatically trump an older person … very dangerous slippery slope there. But no-one adult has the right to demand their needs are met at the expense of another

The mother isn’t necessarily selfish. “Don’t put me in a home” is not the same as “give up your job, your life and your health and look after me yourself”.

The mother isn’t necessarily selfish. “Don’t put me in a home” is not the same as “give up your job, your life and your health and look after me yourself”.

Yes. So if an elderly relative is desperate to avoid residential care, and is making family members swear not to place them in a home (even though no one can be placed there against their will if they have capacity), then those family members have to then ask the relative how they wish to be cared for if/when they are no longer able to manage themselves. Because as we see so often, there is a disconnect between the assumptions of the elderly relative of what is involved and the reality of the family members trying to juggle so many commitments.