The Cockroach Cafe Mark 3

[MereDintofPandiculation]

Morning all! regulars or newbies, coping with your oldies is a frustrating, exhausting and difficult business however much we love them. The Cockroach Cafe is open to all, a place to vent, rant, ask questions, get advice, and hopefully laugh too.

If your question is big, it's best to start a new thread, and get all the advice together in one place. But for everything else, the cafe is the right place.

For newbies: why cockroach? Yolo's DM attended a 'small animal event' in a nursing home, and was presented with a "small animal with a hard back" the name of which species she couldn't remember. Her ever helpful DB suggested cockroach, and it has become a toast on here. So cockroach mes amis/amies, and may you all live to fight another day.

'I realise there's a built up loneliness but getting turbo witter on every visit and then on the phone on the days I don't visit..argh.' Yes Acorn it's so offputting, I hide in bed in the mornings sometimes because I can't face it.
My current standard replies are 'Can you hold that thought while I finish what I'm doing' or 'I need to focus on this now.' I think sometimes she barges in talking because she's afraid she'll forget what she wants to say, which I can understand because when she interrupts me I'm instantly unable to follow my own train of thought.
(((Hugs))) to you Minty I get it!

minty I hope you don't mind me saying...in the nicest possible way, do you think more therapy is a good plan? I know you like writing and I'm a big believer in having engaging activity going on.

Actually I totally agree with you. I can't see what's on offer from the services mentioned being any more use than having a glass of wine and a rant to a friend.

I am still trying to write, but increasingly my days off are being eroded and stuff that needs doing at my house is building up because I'm never there for more than a few hours at a time or I'm so emotionally and physically drained I just can't face it when I am.

Knot I suspect there is some cognitive decline compounded by mental health issues, she's certainly losing her ability to work with technology which has previously been pretty good. She doesn't seem to want to do anything for herself at all...she just calls on me for everything.

Increasingly agencies are diverting to dealing with me because she's so difficult. The best/most regular of the daily carers asked for a temporary move to other clients as dealing with us/mum is apparently impacting his mental health .

She's currently locking horns with the council about a housing development going on behind their house. They've just moved all the plant and workmen's cabins, portaloos etc directly behind their garden which is a monumental pain in the arse, and there are other places it could go tbf. So she's been hounding the planning guy at the council. I've also spoken to him and emailed him some pics, so now he's asked to call me this morning to discuss it and I've been having messages from mum in the small hours instructing me as to to what she wants addressed despite me telling her she needs to get her priorities straight.

I'm supposed to be meeting a friend for a walk this morning but I've got that call, waiting to hear back about respite and the house looks like it's been burgled because I didn't get to do my chores yesterday (tbh I do a quick blitz once or twice a week and it goes to hell in a handcraft the rest of the time).

I self-harmed yesterday (only in a very small way) 😞 and was basically sobbing into my pillow until 3am. Very nearly contacted SHOUT text service but read through the last convo I had with them and eventually fell asleep.

Feeling like my life is over again and if I can't actually finish it, which I won't because of DD I need to find a way to accept that all I can do is exist for the foreseeable future without getting upset about it. I just need to switch my brain off and turn myself into a robot with no expectations for myself or the future, as its the only way I can cope.

minty go for that walk. Please.

unless we can't manage his pain at home and there's a long way to go on that front if mum just does what she's supposed to! But your mum is demonstrating her inability to do that. If it weren't for her failure to manage pain relief, you wouldn't be bothering your GP about it. So I think you should be taking the line that you can't manage his pain yourselves - you can't be there to do it, and your mother has shown herself incapable.

crisping My dad does the barking out orders thing. I usually say "please would be nice". He has said "but I'm family" with the implication that family don't need the formalities that protect communication with people you don't know. I think he may be finding it difficult enough to get all his words in order without having to add on a "please". I was seeing him (pre-Covid) only about 6 hours a week, so much easier to brush things off.

@thesandwich

minty go for that walk. Please.

Yes, this.

Your priorities need to be

1. your health (you're no use to anyone otherwise)
2. your house (because that is impacting on your health)
3. your daughter, who is not yet and adult and needs her mum
4. your father, who needs someone and isn't in a state to sort himself out
5. your mother, who needs someone, but who could sort out herself the help she needs.

There may be other things between 3 and 4, and between 4 and 5.

Very well put dint
Please listen minty

Well I went for my walk, having managed the washing up beforehand and dropped a few parcels off en route.

Lovely friend is 67 and has been through it with elderly in laws who reached 98 and 104 respectively , so she certainly 'gets it'.

Had a moan and a cry and gradually the conversation turned to happier topics and I came back feeling 100x better. DD has just told me she thinks I'm bi-polar!

I've just made myself a lovely toastie (n'duja pesto, proscuitto, cheddar and tomato) and a proper coffee. Going to do laundry and a turbo tidy before heading round to the Olds, and sort out my meds organiser. I doubled up on my AD this morning as was suggested a while back...I think I have to bite the bullet and see if it helps. It's still a relatively small dose in the grand scheme of things and one I've taken before over long periods so really nothing to worry about. Also going to check out the online meditation classes with the local Buddhist centre.

Feel shattered now, but much more positive.

Thanks for your support all, really don't know what I'd do without having this safe place to vent .

Well done minty and the world didn't stop did it?
Have you tried calm or headspace app?

Hi sandwich

Yes I have Calm and a TV in my room with lots of goodies saved on YT.

I think it's really been a case of crash and burn over the last few weeks and I am very bad at prioritising myself and my health/wellbeing when I am under severe stress.

DD is back at school next week so that will hopefully give a bit more structure to the coming weeks which will help me get some of my coping techniques back in place.

We're going to get through this Minty, one day at a time.

I'm having to constantly check which version of reality mum is in, part of me thinks that if she already believes I'm the carer and that she's living in a home then actually she might as well be. I wanted to get hearing aids and glasses sorted out before pushing for respite but I've been derailed with the glasses as she needs a referral for a two minute procedure. I couldn't work out from the optician's eye roll just how much of a delay "things are taking a bit longer at the moment" really means but I suspect that I shouldn't be holding my breath.

At the moment she doesn't like how she's living (of course it would be better if I lived next door) but she won't accept anything changing. I imagine that it is going to take some sort of a crisis for anything to change and I would rather have put things in place without that but I can't do it if she refuses every thing I suggest. I am now at the stage of telling her flat out that it's her choice to live alone with no help and that if she doesn't like it she should do something about it. (That went down really well because apparantly now it's my role in life to do everything for her) The only options she can see involve me and I understand that I am the safe choice, a known thing but I've been holding up this house of cards for a good 18 months now and I've had enough.

Sorry I have name changed but was here a couple of pages back. All the advice and support here us amazing , minty I am glad you are having a better day .

Feeling mad today, despite being sectioned, FIL has refused to allow any information re medical position to be shared with either MIL or Dh , this is an age old tactic he then tells the medical staff a pack of lies , they think he’s the best thing since sliced bread etc etc .

There was a meeting yesterday about his situation and future care , he refused to allow any family to be involved and I said to dh ‘tomorrow the feedback will be that he’s much improved and they are looking at discharging him’ Sure enough MIL calls today and says that they are really pleased with his progress etc etc . As soon as he tests negative he should be fine to come home . He is so plausible , he’s restrung the ward guitar and is entertaining everyone with CDs from his collection.

Meanwhile he has demanded his mobile phone back which the ward think will be fine, it’s full of all sorts of porn and god knows what but apparently that’s not illegal so they can’t stop him having access, and I expect he will charm the nurses and then start calling random people in his contacts again. He has spent all their money , we have had to pay their rent this month again . It feels never ending .

Loving the turbo-wittering thing.
I'm a civil servant - a remarkably bloody uncivil one at times, even - and I rearranged my work pattern at the beginning of Lockdown #1 so I could go and work in mum's flat for an hour or so every day to do her bits and pieces, putting bins out etc.
When her cleaner comes round ("but she doesn't really do anything, I don't know why I have her") I'm only "messing about on the computer, pretending to work".

There are times when I suspect age is a very thin disguise for sheer malevolence.

My dear godmother contacted me on Monday to ask if she could call me on WhatsApp, and we've arranged a time today ( big time difference so arrangements are necessary).

DSis and I found out that mum has had the heat at about 13 degrees most of the winter - she's been lying about it and wasn't found out thanks to the lockdown and travel restrictions in Ireland until her freezer went on the blink and a neighbour went in to help her reset the temp.

At the moment she doesn't like how she's living (of course it would be better if I lived next door) but she won't accept anything changing. I imagine that it is going to take some sort of a crisis for anything to change and I would rather have put things in place without that but I can't do it if she refuses every thing I suggest. I am now at the stage of telling her flat out that it's her choice to live alone with no help and that if she doesn't like it she should do something about it. (That went down really well because apparantly now it's my role in life to do everything for her) The only options she can see involve me and I understand that I am the safe choice, a known thing but I've been holding up this house of cards for a good 18 months now and I've had enough.

That sounds so familiar…Dad is actually problematic about 5-10% of the time, the rest of the issues are with mum and the fact that she ‘can’t cope’ and wants everything done for, but at the same time wants to be completely in control of absolutely everything.
Oh dear God @MrsTabithaTwitchett that must be a whole other level of mind-blowing. How does your MIL feel about him going home?
It’s not on anything like the same level but I have discovered over the last year but the obsession with ‘patient’s voice’/rights is so all encompassing it works to the detriment of the families and caregivers involved. The professionals are so busy ticking boxes about patient input that they forget the impact these choices and events have on those that are trying to hold the whole shit show together.
@Cattermole There are times when I suspect age is a very thin disguise for sheer malevolence.

I think an awful lot of elderly people know damn well they can use their age/mental conditions/less than perfect functioning to get their own way and have no compunction about doing. It’s like dealing with toddlers, except in many cases they have capacity and money so you can try and wrangle them as much as you like but it basically amounts to a complete waste of time.
I also wonder about the teenager’s analogy – that they are pains in the arse so you don’t miss them too much when they leave home. Perhaps it’s the same with elderly people…they are designed to be increasingly difficult so when they finally pop their clogs the sadness is tinged with relief.

@mathanxiety your poor mum…has she mentioned being bothered by it? My parents house is at a constant 24/25 degrees

I've just got up and already DM (86) has phoned and texted - fortunately I switch my phone off at night, I know people on this board will sympathize when I say that I feel hounded.

On Wednesday night my DH found me unconscious on the kitchen floor. I have a recurring infection from an operation I had 18 months ago which causes fever, sickness etc and on occasion has caused me to pass out.. Dr has prescribed meds and told me I should be resting. I am meant to be shielding.

My mother has one of two reactions to that - either she cries or poo-poos it. When she cries its not because she feels sad for me - she uses expressions like "It's all my fault", "I feel so guilty", "What am I going to do?" I use up lots of energy reassuring her that it's not her fault.

She is living with my sister & her family after the death of our step-father in June. She is surrounded by people who wait on her like footmen wait on The Queen. All she wants to do is go out shopping. I take her to the supermarket twice a week. She also likes to go for a ride around in the car so we do that too. I take her for her medical appointments, of which there seem to be many. On Wednesday I listened with astonishment as she told the Dr. when she lived with SF she was going out for 5 mile walks but now can't go out to get exercise. In her head, perhaps, because the only distance she walked for the last 20 years was once a week from the front door to the car then around the supermarket.

I feel like a selfish shrew but she has controlled my life with her crying and temper tantrums since I was a child. She has set ideas about the person that I ought to be and if I deviate from that I've received the crying, the "I can't sleep at night worrying about......" or her bad temper (she is very short tempered and for some reason I'm still scared of it).

Thank you for listening.

leatmarmite I feel your pain with the phone. I had a late start this morning, I turned the alarm off and went back to sleep. I came downstairs at nine to eight messages on the answering machine, starting at 8.06. I called mum back and she was quite grumpy because I'd woken her up from a nap but had no recollection of calling me.

You are entitled to your own life, if you've been told to shield then that's what you should be doing right now. It's not your job to manage her emotions (I find dealing with mum's anxiety draining, especially as she doesn't consider she has a problem. If I'm five minutes late I am automatically dead in a ditch)

...she has controlled my life with her crying and temper tantrums since I was a child. She has set ideas about the person that I ought to be and if I deviate from that I've received the crying, the "I can't sleep at night worrying about......" or her bad temper (she is very short tempered and for some reason I'm still scared of it)

Same...it's not easy to condition yourself out of it, is it?

If I'm five minutes late I am automatically dead in a ditch)

Oh yes...I get that too. I said at 1.30 yesterday I'd be round in about an hour. At 2.34 the phone was ringing .

That said I don't think I have it anywhere near as bad on the phone calls front as most posters on here. We go through phases but it's mostly ok. I call to say goodnight between 8.45 - 10pm every evening and I don't generally hear any more unless there's an emergency.

I'll call in the morning if I'm not going round, and mum will usually call me a couple of times during the day on those occasions.

The most trying thing is that she insists on ringing the house phone so if I'm upstairs I don't get to it on time, which she knows damn well but stubbornly refuses to call my mobile.

Carers are here at the moment.

They commented on how much calmer and more organised it is when I'm here...

Same...it's not easy to condition yourself out of it, is it?

It needs professional help, I think. I am under the care of a psychiatrist who puts my mental health problems down to problems with self-esteem and I think that the root of that lies with my mother. I hate saying that - it's an old cliche that the root of psychological problems lie with mothers, but maybe cliches become cliches because there's some truth in there.

If I'm five minutes late I am automatically dead in a ditch)

Ha, ha, ha. My mother's thing is that I've been arrested by the police for breaking lock down. Strangely, the thought of being arrested never occurs to her when we are off to the supermarket or riding round the countryside.

I hope you don't mind me asking but do you feel angry & sad that you were in effect robbed of being your own person? I'm not sure if the anger is at myself for letting it happen or with DM (despite loving her very much) for being so controlling that I was never allowed to become myself.

.....think an awful lot of elderly people know damn well they can use their age/mental conditions/less than perfect functioning to get their own way and have no compunction about doing. It’s like dealing with toddlers, except in many cases they have capacity and money so you can try and wrangle them as much as you like but it basically amounts to a complete waste of time

Absolutely true. Having read the whole thread how I can relate to you all. In my case the FOG of many, many years had me kowtowing to my highly manipulative mother and equally manipulative father. He flatly refused to pay for carers because ‘The money’s for me when I need a nursing home’. He played the three siblings off against each other for years.

Mum bounced in and out of hospital/rehab bed/care packages for 15 years because every bloody time he would cancel the carers, refuse the physio for her and be all sweetness and light when the GP was around. In the mean time mum had UTI after UTI, fall after fall and horrific verbal abuse from my father. When he was caught screaming at her by a carer, the care agency pulled out and he told everyone he’d stopped them because they were useless, yet days before he’d been lauding their praises.
Eventually I threatened Safeguarding; yet again he sweet talked the professionals around...😡😡

Then he was found to have metatastic cancer, and there was no option other than the two of them to go into residential care. Interestingly enough, my mum wanted very little to do with him once they’d been placed (same care home)
He died four months ago, mum a couple of weeks ago, both well into their 90’s.

I do know just how it feels to get nothing right, be a verbal punchbag and to dread the phone ringing. I lived a 38 mile round trip away, and have quite severe heart problems myself. It’s nearly killed me.
Neither wanted to be alive, dad’s been saying for 25 years he wanted to die; he was perfectly able until the last four months but possibly the most miserable man I have ever known. I do have siblings who are NC with each other, live closer but only expected to do the nicer bits of care - I got all the sh1t literally because ‘You were a nurse and you’re used to it!’

And I honestly feel quite relieved that my life is at last my own, at the ripe old age of 67!

Oh @leatmarmite I feel for you. I think that's the hardest part isn't it - you can choose your friends, but you can't choose your family, and not only do we put up with behaviour from our relations that people would be shouting "LTB!" if it was our partners, but we feel a sort of pressure to do so :-(

There is only one you, and you are also worth care. Please remember that.

I am very bad at prioritising myself and my health/wellbeing when I am under severe stress. I think I know what you mean. You can be very conscious you need time for yourself, but there are so many things pressing on you ... and you think, well, as soon as I get just these things sorted out, I'll have a break. And then something else arrives.

I did it for about five years once, while my body threw all sorts of things at my - migraines, IBS, then - which completely stopped me in my tracks - eczema on hands and soles of feet which stopped me walking or holding a pencil or using a keyboard. Then someone got me to the GP, who immediately signed me off work and i didn't go back for 18 months.

Knot Our nursing home is very good about sorting out anything medical including glasses. (We're not doing anything about hearing aids - he's absolutely refused to have his hearing tested and I've never managed to get it sorted and we all think he's no longer mentally capable of coping with hearing aids.) So maybe don't hold up care home because of this if everything else says it's a good time.

Oh yes...I get that too. I said at 1.30 yesterday I'd be round in about an hour. At 2.34 the phone was ringing Haven't you started automatically adding at least 3hrs to your estimated arrival time? . We've been doing that routinely to both sets of parents for the last 30 years.

I can't change the past, I do wish I'd realised sooner that I didn't have to arrange my life to suit mum but I didn't and those days are gone. It wasn't until my husband died and I had to make my own choices that I realised that I didn't know what my own choices were. Once I'd got past that and thought about how much of my life I'd spent deferring to everyone else's preferences there was no going back.

Today I have got mum's agreement to having a cleaner. If I had bunting I'd be putting it out.

Dint The challenge is at the moment that I don't know what she thinks about anything because it changes so often. One day we can have a rational discussion about how her memory will continue to get worse and how a week respite would be a good idea so she can see what the options are and she's all for it then an hour later we've not had that discussion and when we go round again she's never leaving her home until they carry her out in a box. What are her wishes? Let me just check which way the wind is blowing.