Caring for elderly parents? Pop in for support/advice/a bit of a rant...

[picklemepopcorn]

Pace yourself, it's a marathon not a sprint!

This is a safe place to offload- don't be embarrassed about how you feel. No judgement here...

There are lovely people here with practical experience of some of the issues which crop up who'll share their hard won knowledge!

Oh nota... but yay for littlespace dad (still sounds like a lot of stuff to me though).

Does anyone know, if someone has a post mortem is an inquest inevitable? I am not quite sure. DB has started on about should we put in a formal complaint, but I think/suppose the inquest is the starting point?

Thank you nota for all your help, so much appreciated x

No probs yolo, glad to be of help. Someone who I don't really know that well went out of her way to support my DS(17) this week, and I know how much I appreciated that helping hand.

I don’t think I’m the best person to answer that comprehensively yolo but if the PM returns a clear natural cause I suspect they will not hold inquest. If you raise concerns about the care which may have led to that however they will do so I would have thought

Yolo my understanding is that the findings of a post mortem will influence the coroner in the decision to hold an inquest or not. Do you feel there should be an inquest? I'm so sorry you're dealing with this.

paying it forwards nota x

I dont know whether there will be a clear natural cause, certainly her death was totally unexpected and hospital has said they have 'no idea' why she died. Combined with my notes, coroner's office said independent postmortem was essential and of course it is all out of our hands now. There certainly was some incredibly poor care, both in hospital and in one of the care homes. (5 months: 9 falls, 4 care homes, 5 hospital admissions).

I suspect an inquest will or should be the way forward. Given the length of time she spent in hospital it seems very unlikely that there was a reasonable cause of death, eg she didnt have cancer/kidney/lung/heart disease, as we were repeatedly assured of this. I rather suspect it is part of a combination of attitude towards old, confused people and the short staffing across the board within the NHS. Paramedics were exemplary every time; one ward and two care homes were very good; the rest - not so good.

monkey that really rang a bell with me, how, no matter how well-meaning they are, everything has knock on effects - chases for prescriptions, extra visits to supermarket, etc, etc. For every hour of being with them there seems to be at least two hours of back-up work.

Cake run I realise was typical of my cooking - apple loaf to use up glut of apples, small cup cakes to use up left-over butter cream, scones to use up some milk which had gone sour (sour milk and bicarb of soda makes incredibly light scones)

Hello everyone, hope I'm in the right thread.

Dad is 86 and has been out of hospital a week following 2 weeks in with pulmonary oedema. He's out of the woods but the weight is falling off him and he has no appetite. He can eat just feels pretty ick at anything I suggest. Should I be going for light meals or nutritionally dense or ensure or what. So far egg in a cup, a little porridge and soup is all he will eat.

thigh DM was like this. Basically, they said: anything they want to eat to get the calories in. So chuck the nutritional rules out of the window, just try and get some calories into him. With DM it was lots of little snacks, so I would scramble an egg, give her cake and coffee, encourage cheese/smoked salmon/dairy/fillet steak for protein... but it was hard and ultimatly not successful for DM.

Is your dad on anti biopics at the moment @thighofrelief? If so they could be making him feel nauseous and be giving a bitter after taste to his food. Definitely just give him whatever he fancies, don’t worry about healthy eating at the moment, go for high fat options eg full cream milk, cheese, pastry eg quiche, Cornish pasty or sweet pastries. Sometimes putting s really small amount on a plate is better as normal portions can seem impossibly large and people get into a spiral of leaving food, feeling guilty then getting stressed at the next meal at he idea of wasting it.

“Antibiotics “!

Yolo I'm sorry I can quite remember the sequence of things - your mum was originally admitted because of a fall and her shoulder injury, or was that later?

I'd possibly expect an inquest if they could argue her death began with a fall. This would make it an accidental death and go to the coroner, or certainly that was the case with my mum.

The inquest really didn't dig too much into the hospital at all, quizzed the hospital matron on their general falls protocol a bit, could they have done anything different but essentially was coroner's job just to confirm her death was the (eventual) result of the original fall.

As far as complaints, I'm not sure what the best route to take would be. In our case, while we felt the delirium was never taken seriously, we realistically don't see how it could've ended well anyway and didn't have specific issues so considered the inquest the end of the matter. It didn't seem like the best platform to raise concerns.

But the delirium issue and elderly patients not coping in hospital is a much bigger problem and even living through it I'm not sure it's solvable

yolo sorry about your mum.

bob not on antibiotics or anti biopics now. Was on a shed load in the hospital but now just his normal meds.

Was wondering about a biscuit here and there and cake. I didn't want to use up any room he had on rubbish. Funnily enough i brought him a hammy cheesy panini and cake from a cafe we used to go to before he got ill. He wolfed it but i thought I should concentrate on protein. I will just give him lots of little fancy things. He's so thin so quickly.

anti biopics love it!

thanks lello that's helpful. Yes it started with a fall when she broke her shoulder and humerus on June 7. That was deemed untreatable by surgery because of her age, so they just put a sling on it and she wasnt compliant about not using it.

thighofrelief I console myself with the thought that cakes have eggs in them. If I do a sponge cake with 4 eggs, then a quarter of it - two decent slices - has a whole egg in. Better than nothing, protein-wise. At 86 you're not going to be worried about obesity, so if sugar helps to get the food down him, does it really matter?

You're not talking about physical "room", but "room" in his appetite - eg if he eats a piece of cake, he will have no appetite for anything else. I'd have thought the contrary was true - that if you give him things that he enjoys, it will stimulate his appetite and thus give him the capacity to enjoy foods that at the moment aren't exciting him. You'll know yourself that if for some reason you're not eating, you start by being hungry then after a while you just lose the urge.

Of course I eat the treats with and as they get thinner i get fatter it's just storage for winter.

Hello, hope it’s ok to join this thread. Mil has dementia and Fil has MS. They are currently living together in assisted living accommodation but the assisted living people think it’s time for Mil to move to a care home. The problem is I think fil will be devastated. She’s his reason for being alive. And I don’t think he understands how ill she is and what kind of extra help she needs.

We’re also, quite honestly, terrified about the money side of things. Fil also has quite a slim grasp on finances and thinks he’s rich because they sold their house. But the care costs are huge and will only get higher when mil moves into full time nursing care.

I am not really asking for advice just need somewhere to vent. My partner is understandably devastated and I’ve got no one to talk to

Arse, sorry you're in such a tough spot. Is the financial aspect partly down to the state? I know the cost of care homes is terrifying.

I'm still at mum's, feel really homesick but going back to my own home tomorrow for a few nights. Mum has to be alone eventually. I keep telling myself other 80 year olds manage....

Hello all, been away for a few days and lost you!
Welcome newbies- rant away, or ask away.... lots of wisdom here.
Sorry to hear of the challenges folk are dealing with. Thigh, cakes sound very good- I am trying to fill dm with rice puddings to try and build her up.
Arse, I am so sorry. Have your parents been assessed to make sure they get attendance allowance and everything else? Assessed for continuing health care? Age uk etc can advise and help. Could they go into a home together?
Grace, your dm will cope. You need your own space.
Yolo, sorry you are having to go through all this. How is your dh? Any more news re treatment?
cockroach all.

thighofrelief I'd go for nutritionally dense personally, but you could see if the GP would prescribe some Ensures. Would he consider Horlicks or Ovaltine at night? Honey or cream in his porridge? Make sure he's on full cream milk, not skimmed. I'd have little plates of things like chocolates, sausage rolls cut in half, hard boiled egg halves sitting next to him; biscuits with nuts in them; maybe little cucumber or tomato sandwiches with the crusts off but with butter, or plain slices of tomato or cucumber for taste and moisture. Maybe orange pieces too, but sprinkle some sugar on them. Peanut butter? I had to stop buying it because my dh put pounds on just looking at the jar...

I’m a dietitian and I totally endorse what Annandale says, except maybe be careful with stuff with nuts in it because the swallow reflex gets weaker with age and thy can make people cough.

Hello, hope you don't mind me asking a question here? DM has mixed dementia and cancer, dementia has caused lots more issues than the cancer. This week she has been very ill, firstly constipation then diarrhoea coming before she realises. She's spent over a week in bed saying she's tired or in pain or she doesn't really know what's the matter with her. We've had the doctor and nurses out but they've said just to let her stay in bed if she wants and doctor treated her for constipation/diarrhoea which isn't helping really. She has carers that come in through the day but I am the main carer and I work full time in a stressful job and also have my own family. On a positive note I live fairly close to DM but think the services rely on me so things that could be put in place aren't but that could just be me thinking that as I don't really know. Is there anything else I should or could be doing? My DM has never been one for taking to bed and she seems so tired and thin. I feel so guilty having to work. Her cancer was diagnosed 3 years ago and dementia 2 years ago and we've sort of managed since then but now it feels as though it's going to be unsustainable. I'm not sure what I'm asking really sorry but I think it's the taking to bed that has me most concerned.

Apologies for lack of paragraphs and punctuation!

Doing a rapid read catch up and these words stuck out and thrilled me Thigh cakes sound very good. Where are these delicious cakes for the thighs I thought... To be fair most cake heads to my thighs without being told to

Just done my Sunday afternoon visit (daydreaming of actually walking the dog instead) and Ma was totally away with the fairies in a very nice way. It’s odd why some days are grim and others are ok

Thanks everyone for your kind words. I have just found out about continuing care from the NHS and need to get that sorted asap. I think MIL would certainly qualify and then they could go into a home together and we would (might?) still have enough money to look after FIL for the rest of his life.

Redact - I'm no expert but my MIL has dementia and there was a certain stage where she got very scared of going out. She stumbled on a kerb one day and after that, we couldn't get her to go anywhere. Looking back, I wish we had persisted because becoming more sedentary had a knock on effect elsewhere - e.g. she was less mentally stimulated, her muscles got stiffer - and I think this hastened her decline.

It sounds like you are doing an awful lot. I remember the strain when MIL was living at home, and the toll it took elsewhere on our lives. Can you look into more care - either a live in carer or a care home? They amount to about the same cost, but a live in carer won't be trained as a nurse. But if your mother wants to live at home this could be a good option. Would also provide some company and mental stimulation, which would keep her healthier for longer.

Just a bit of a rant because I feel miserable and very sorry for dh.
Dm lives with us - not a perfect situation, but better than doing a 200 mile round trip to open a jar of marmalade! She's 91 and fairly ok mentally, but has mobility issues and uses a rollator.

Last week, she fell and broke her wrist so her arm is in a splint. Whilst we were in A&E they signalled that she had a UTI, and 'because she was showing no symptoms', left it untreated. If I had been thinking straight, and it hadn't been 3:30 in the morning, I would have insisted on a course of antibiotics, because I am well aware of the effects of a UTI in the elderly. Needless to say, by Wednesday, we were infested by hornets and serpents, chimps and strange men coming out of the power sockets. A few antibiotics have cured the hallucinations, but she is needing a lot of attention as regards pills, drinks, food, etc. (We've organised a carer to bathe her in the morning, so I don't have to do any intimate stuff.)

I understand how horrid this is for her - I really do.

Dh is being absolutely brilliant, but has just turned round and said that he thinks we're wasting our lives, and it has made me really sad. I've had to miss an art course this weekend that I'd had booked since February and was really looking forward to, so I'm a bit disappointed about that too. I know I'm being horribly selfish, but dh doesn't have any real ties to her and I want him to have a happy retirement.

As I said, just a rant to get it off my chest in the ether!