Any Upper Middle Class Parents opt for State?

[Cortina]

Subtle but interesting difference perhaps? By Upper Middle Class lets say I mean obviously RP accent, I mean with a family income of 300,000 pounds upwards, typically banker/lawyer parents probably in home counties with home with some land attached worth upwards of 2 millon pounds.

Would you put your child in a state primary or seconadary if you honestly thought they'd stand out like a sore thumb compared to their peers? I don't mean in the leafy suburbs like Bucks but an area where they'd be in the distinct minority. IMO & experience the result often isn't pretty. The amount of hatred at my school to those that had more was deeply unpleasant, how we hatred the 'snobs' - it's almost like this hatred was galvanised and encouraged by those in charge somehow. I remember we put on a show about the unfortunate children from a private school who happened to share our holiday centre in Y6. How everyone laughed at our imitations of their accents and cultured ways, a tide of hatred was whipped up. Deeply unpleasant and how odd it was encouraged looking back.

These poor children had done nothing more than to differ from the norm. Drop a younger Kate Middleton into the 'Educating Essex' school for example, would this be fair?

there weren't many upper classes at the very expensive private school that my dd1 and ds1 used to go to. Plenty of people with pots of money, but only a few people I would call upper class.

and none at the private school that my other dds went to - just loads of new money. it is more upper class at the inner london state school they currently go to.

I agree, it's nothing to do with money. I suspect all of the real upper classes, send their children to school in the countryside somewhere - but of the ones I know, they would not ever contemplate state school. It wouldn't even be on their radar. Even the ones that consider themselves poor, seem to have the money to send their children to private school.

What beattiebow said!

There are v few umc types in my area- it isn't really an area where people of that ilk live.

FWIW, my pparents were the academic/bohemian mc type (father from landed family, all deceased, estates all sold)- we were all sent state (though 1 sibling won full scholarship to music school). The differences between us and our classmates was rather noticable, though I was never bullied in school. I found out later that it was purely because people were too scared of me to bully me!

Agree that class isn't defined by money. A PP a couple of posts back mentioned the upper class - which is only the aristocracy.

When does middle class become upper middle class? Whilst you could be umc and penniless widely I think you'd expect them to be wealthy (not necessarily in terms of paid employment) cultured and highly educated? When I think of umcs I think of old Etonians and similar who aren't aristocracy. The Middletons I think are umcs? Michael Middleton perhaps traditionally from a umc background. I don't think there's a solid definition for upper middle class but could be wrong.

'When I've questioned school they don't seem to understand why I hope for more than a level 4 at the end of KS2.'

Cortina, you pushy mother!

At my Primary school,
the upper class had titles and their work comprised of running the family estate
the upper middle class had London and country houses and worked for the family firm or were MPs, senior civil servants or diplomats
the middle class were those whose dads got paid salaries to pay the fees

and we thought we were normal

Very few families have an income of above £300k. To be in the top 1% a family income of £150k is required. Not sure what centile £300k would be in. Very few private school parents are in that bracket, so doubt there would be many state school parents either.

Or at least few families at dd1's independent school are very rich. There are some of course, but not most.

I think the Middletons are middle class

The middletons are most definitely not umc! And cortina, take a crumb of comfort from the fact that rhe school is going to get a very nasty shock when OFSTED come!

Yes, brother inherited land etc and can afford to go private. We can' t.

I think your class indicators are totally skewed. If you are talking about being from an educated background at a comprehensive, then how much kids stand out is down to what area you live in. Round here, most parents I know have at least four degrees between them, if not six! None are in any position to afford private education, but their academic ambitions for their kids are about as high as you can get. Little arabella's parents might have made a mint in thecity or on the football pitch but have not a book in the house. If you are asking 'will a child who has extremely rich parents stand out at state school, the answer is yes, probably, but because of their six holidays a year and massive house, and possibly their superior attitude, not because all the other kids are uninterested in education!

I think someone actually needs to define a) Middle class and b) upper middle class for the benefit of all of our discussions. It looks as though everyone has a different viewpoint.

For instance Macca and co, umc - erm not in my opinion. Rich and famous, yes.

300k plus - umc - erm not in my opinion. Rich yes, but not necessarily umc, or even mc.

millicano

at my primary school, the division was always between old and new money

those whose fathers had earned rather than inherited were always middle class

Celebrity children are upper middle class because they have never really had to work for their money

they only become upper class after at least 4 generations and preferably a title

ps
the WORST insult was to call people "nouveau" - bad jokes about shag pile carpets etc
footballers, slebs etc are most definitely nouveau and cannot ever be considered upper or even upper middle class as they were not brought up with class

Elizabeth Bennett was a gentlemans daughter even though she was poor
Mr Bingley was UMC as his father had made his money in trade
Mrs Bennett was nouveau
Darcy was upper class

little has changed

smallwhitecat
I was at school in South Ken in the early 1970's
there is nothing in this thread that will be any news to any social researcher

The Middletons work for the business they set up after quitting employment
under the standard criteria that makes them MC
their daughter was UMC - public school, did not have to get a normal job
but got darned lucky in her choice of boyfriends
if she had not picked that one, she'd have been the standard MC / UMC sloane

I'm with TalkinPeace, I'd say their definitions are pretty much spot on (also inline with Wikipedia's FWIW).

A key indicator of being UMC is attending public school. I'd say I'm comfortably middle middle class because I attended a generic private school not a Public School (as did my brother). There was one very minor aristocrat at our school (all years combined) and she stood out like a sore thumb - we didn't bully her, because she was a loveable eccentric who everyone liked.

blimey, are they !
I'd not even checked! I was purely quoting from experience and memory

the best place of all for titles, UC, UMC that I ever went was my A level retake crammer
but that gets airbrushed out of most peoples CVs funnily

So many of us are hybrids or to shamelessly steal a phrase I love from another thread muddle class.

I am from very wc background, perhaps even under class.
But thanks to tertiary education I now lead a MC life.
DC will both attend public school.

Of course the middletons are not upper middle class!

There are some old money type post people who would that neither are the Royal Family!

So, does attending a public school mean you are upper class!?

It can't do.
My Dad was a miner. We lived on a sink estate.
DC will both attend public school. That alone cannot surely change their class.

THe school you go to means nothing
its how the school is paid for that matters
see my comments about my primary school and what the dads did

seeker
about the royals - OH YES - a friend from school's granny called the Battenburgs" nouveau !!

This thread is killing my good Christmas mood.

No you wouldn't want yo send them to the local school, oh no.