Binge Eating Disorder Support 3

[FightingBed2014]

Welcome, this thread is for those that have disordered eating / Binge Eating Disorder (BED) and need support. We are all working towards a better relationship with food, together. Everyone is welcome to join in and share as much or as little as you like. Our focus is on learning to be happy with who we are right now and moving away from our negative self image, thoughts and eating patterns one step at a time.

Previous threads can be found here:

Thread 1 March 2014
Thread 2 October 2014

My blog following recovery from BED can be read here:Fighting BED

Many of us are following Dr Fairburn's Overcoming Binge Eating Second Edition book Here This is also used by a lot of Eating Disorder services in their treatment programmes.

Although we have no rules, we would ask that people either avoid talking about or be mindful when it is necessary that the following can be a trigger for those with an eating disorder; asking advice on how to start a new diet, talking about specific weight and clothes sizes. Please also remember that those supporting you need support too.

This thread was started by a BED sufferer and the majority of contributors are Eating disorder sufferers and not professionals. As with any online forum, it is best to supplement support on here with real life support and advice from professionals

Hello to everyone who is new, and to thread returners.

I do read the thread daily but thought it was time for me to update.

My first weigh-in happened two weeks after I started the eating plan given to me by my ED therapist. Everything had been going well. I didn't feel deprived, I didn't feel too hungry. I had more energy and my mood seemed better. Anyway, the scales showed weight loss. Quite a lot of weight loss. Of course, I knew that most of it would have been "water weight" but seeing a loss after only seeing gains for the last two or three years was amazing. And then that afternoon, 'beguiled' by the weight loss, I decided to tweak my eating plan and do it a bit stricter.
So you can all guess where that went....

I've struggled to get back on plan again. I'm just getting back on track. I think.

In addition, I've had my work hours cut quite considerably, and I'm not able to continue with the counsellor due to finances.
The frustrating thing here, again, is the lack of help from the NHS in my area. I had a regular health check done by the GP a few weeks ago. I'm already on meds for high BP, and my blood test showed that my cholesterol level has increased rapidly since my last health check 2 years ago. The GP can give me meds for that, but still can't offer me help with BED because my BMI is still not 40. It's 39 now, I wonder if I should eat my way up to 40 to get some help!!

One thing that I am doing well is completing my food monitoring sheets. I mentioned in a prior post that I really struggle with them. Well now I've seen the benefit of doing them and they really are valuable.
So now I'm working Fairburn as a self-help book instead of having therapist support with it. I'm back to Step 2, this week has been ok so far.

Sorry my update is not a very positive one!

Finally found some time....Skoda you mentioned having health concerns. What we all have to remember is this is a long term journey, quite simply without it we will only get worse. Diets will leave us worse off and our confidence will only drop more. It's a good one to think to yourself if the topic or suggestion if diets come up. You are taking steps to a settled and calmer you for life, not until a false promise.

Margo, Are you feeling any less tangled up in your work load? I can understand the feeling if not doing enough, I'm not sure we could ever achieve the level we set ourselves. You could make a list before you sleep of all you have achieved each day, congratulate yourself, fake this bit till you make it. Thank you for the link.

Lou, I am really proud of you for keeping going, pushing to change how things are for you. It's a tough journey but a worthwhile one. Remember, you are not a freak! Having disorder eating does not define who you are as a person, you're capable of so much. Everyone had flaws, everyone! Being happy is the only thing that will make life improve for us, weight loss would only shift our difficulties elsewhere. sleep's suggestions of journalling is a great one especially as it seems the family energy is for your sister and you are trying to cope alone. You need to have an outlet too. How you feel is just as valid.

Daj How is the sleep going? Deprivation can really knock any sense if sanity out of you. Fingers crossed the long sleep is an end coming.

Down welcome. I was one of the people who found injury really knocked me. I found I could run and it became my escape. I damaged my feet and had to stop, I cried over that. It gave me time to assess more why I have BED. I haven't gone back to it because I was doing it to be accepted by others more than wanting to go me. I am happy walking with music and can instantly feel better. I hope you find the change in activity a help. Its great that you no longer feel alone, just having company in your thoughts must be such a relief.

sleep thanks again for all your invaluable help. You give us so much to work with and a new way to think.

I have had my next meeting with ED Service's. This was to monitor my progress as still haven't started treatment. Next week I meet the team and will likely begin a few weeks after.

The run up to the meeting was nerve racking. Whilst I know they aren't scary, thinking of talking openly with strangers in RL is a little out of my comfort zone. As before there was nothing to worry about, lots of support and genuine understanding.

We have put together a care plan for me to use before treatment starts. This involves continuing my blogging, being here and working on getting myself to eat breakfast. I can't seem to get out of hardly eating in the day and they freely at night, even with Fairburn. To stop freaking myself out with rules, each day I will ask myself if I want it. Scientifically I know my body can't function properly if I don't eat right, so that is my drive. When that is done then I will do Lunch and so on.

The other area highlighted was my inability to see what I'm doing well. There has been significant backslide here after confronting DM. I feel constant guilt and like a burden on others. When I say it out loud I'm achieving lits given how unwell I am (anxiety / depression) but no matter what I do, It not enough in my head because I should be doing more. Margois this how you feel? EDS are pleased with my progress but I struggle to feel comfortable agreeing. So I will be trying the fake it till I make it suggested to Margo and try to loosen my grip on standards that are harmful to myself rather than driving forces.

Its so lovely to see everyone getting together here and working with each other, its very inspiring.x

Dusky, I think that is a positive update. (Although I'm sorry to hear that things are tougher with finances) In the past would you have been more likely to throw it in and binge / give up? You haven't done that and have found new ways to continue the journey. That is a big change in thought process and one you can be proud of, Well done. Keep going and who knows how much more you will find.

Blech. It's silly o'clock and I'm still awake even though I don't want to be. Have binged for 4 days in a row now I think. I'd like to get back to keeping food and mood logs, but can't. I need to have blood tests and I haven't been able to organise myself to call and make an appointment because work has been so full on. And I've stupidly signed up (and paid) to attend an event this weekend that I'm dreading - feel like I have nothing to look forward to right now. Will try for a more positive update tomorrow...

Oh maggie - do you have to go to the event? Sometimes you need to let something go, maybe this occasion it is the money you spent. It isn't Workfest is it? I am going!

I am going to try to write stuff down today too. My eating has been rubbish too. Are you still using the app?

Re the blood test. Have you written the number down ready to call? I know that, I find that helpful - so I am ready to do x when I have a moment. Not that you want to spend money, but I have occasionally paid for a private blood test so that I could do it at a more convenient and scheduled time.

I came on to post this link I saw on Beat's FB feed:

NHS England has announced a new Mental Health Taskforce which will develop a five year national strategy for mental health, covering all ages. The strategy will be published in the summer, and will be aligned with NHS England's Five Year Forward View for the whole NHS. It is crucial that the strategy is informed by a wide range of lived experience and professional expertise, and we'd like your help. Rethink Mental Illness and Mind are members of the Taskforce, and we want to ensure we contribute what is important to you. Any answers you give will be shared anonymously with the Mental Health Taskforce.The survey will take approximately 20 minutes to complete but your answers will be saved so you can come back to it at any time. You can write as little or as much as you would like in response to this survey.

www.surveymonkey.com/s/mh2020

It closes tonight (Fri) at 12am. Obviously it is a wider survey than "just" ED but I know so many people on here have virtually no support/or a long waiting list locally, it would be good to raise the profile of ED.

Hello Elfin

It sounds like you know a lot about what works/doesn't - which is good.

I am not cured but I would say:

1. It isn't about food, it is about feelings.

2. You need to try to accept your self and improve your relationship with yr body image.

3. Doing 3 meals & 2 snacks brings a helpful routinue - planning ahead is good too.

4. Trying to be kind to yourself is important and generally an on-going process.

5. There are distraction and self-soothing techiques which are designed to help us not to reach for the food.

6. Talking & writing about yr feelings helps.

Re anti-ds they are useful but only a Dr can tell. Have you been?

Not sure if that is any help...but my thoughts.

Not being alone - ie this thread is amazing too.

What is happening in yr life now which is 'causing' the disorderd eating?

ELfin - it can be a total headwreck! This is how it is for you at the mo. Are all 4children stepkids? So they are only there for weekend or certain period of time? I am not for restricting, but I would put "their" stuff away, pack it so that it is difficult to reach (in the attic.-;) and forget about this until they come and eat the rubbish thmeselves. If kids are not yours, teying to explain cereals, buns etc are bad breakfast choice may not be the best idea, so I would leave them to it but make sure breakfast is nutritious for yourself - omelette, ham, fried tomatoes, mushrooms, avocado and salmon salad with quinoa - these are my favourite breakfasts and I think it may help to concentrate on feeding yourself some food. All you describe in your post is not food. Its calories, not food. Maybe you omitted the meat, chicken, salads etc and you do eat them. too, but I got the impression you exist on empty carbs. Start putting foodstuff in, and forget what you are doing about empty carbs for the moment. It might be easier to eat a good omelette and salad for breakfast than trying to avoid eatong this third or fourth boal of sugary cereals. I have found making sure real food, veg, fruit, meat, fish - gets eaten works better than making sure rubbish is not eaten. Positive attention on nutirtious stuff against restrictive approach about rubbish....

I can not help on anti-ds, I once was prescribed prozac for food anxiety by my gp but it changed nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Hope you can sort yourself out a bit soon!

Hi elfin

I can help you somewhat re antidepressants. I take sertraline at the moment as a precautionary measure to avoid getting post natal depression after dd. I had it horrendous after ds 3 years ago. I really rate them as I've been on a few and they've got me out of a really dark place but efficacy can really differ from person to person. From my observations of people on MN and in RL it's that it very much depends on your starting point. Say, for me, they help me function and lead a pretty normal life free from extremely unhealthy behaviour and suicidal thoughts but I find they don't do much for the binge eating because that isn't one of my worst/most severe symptoms of depression. if this is how I naturally felt and was my natural starting point then they might have had a fighting chance at tackling my eating disorders throughout my life. They may really help you. And are probably worth a shot. I am bias though because they are a life saver for me and I have never felt shame in needing them to help me live a normal life.

I had a good run for about 5 years of healthy eating habits. Not that I ate particularly healthily but my attitude towards food was not one that tormented me constantly like it does at the moment. I feel pretty optimistic about beating it though and like mrsmargo has stated it's probably not about the fact you have tempting food available to you it's that you haven't found a way to help you manage the emotions that lead you to binge. But you will! Would you be open to trying antidepressant and/or talking therapy?

Hi everyone.

Another binge last night

I've had 3 fairly good sleeps in a row now. Really getting to grips with getting dd to sleep for long stretches.

The improved sleep is really helping.

BUT my stress levels are through the roof at the moment. Lots of 'up in the air' life/work/family decisions.

Last night I just felt so 'done in' after an exhausting week I just went for it with chocolate and crisps. To be honest though it wasn't as bad as it felt at the time. I've eaten way more on a binge before (and even recently) to the point of physical discomfort. Whereas last night at some point I thought "I could eat more but I'm going to stop now" which is the bit I'm trying to focus on. whilst trying to get dd back to sleep just now I filled in a cravings diary in hindsight and the pattern of behaviour is getting so obvious/consistent I'm hoping that will give me some hope at tackling it again.

to anyone else who feels they are struggling at the moment.

I still haven't put my running shoes on. I might get someone to come with me to hold my hand give me a kick up the arse the first time I go. It's getting ridiculous now . I've never struggled so badly to just get out the front door

Dajmi, good for beating the binge by allowing yourself to eat and then just deciding to stop!
Why such a rush to get running? Can tou just take long, brisk walks with the pram instead? taking time out when you are busy w. small child, work etc might be difficult, but being out with your child might be a nice experince, not an obligation.

I am just so, so depressed. I woke up this morning after going to bed at 9:30pm last night and just looked at this fat, puffy, larva-like face in the mirror and I hate myself. I really cannot work out what to do. Since last Sunday I have not binged. I have been eating healthy foods, including proteins and good fats (cashew nuts, greek yogurt), 3 meals a day, generally not snacks as no time/not hungry. And I have gained weight. Again. And it's not just a number on the scales as my clothes feel tighter. This gain just feels inexorable. I am trying to stop the mindset that says "whatever you eat you just gain weight so it doesn't matter what you do, stop trying to eat healthy and just pig out". This is very, very tempting but I am trying not to listen as I know ultimately I will feel worse.
But why am I still gaining?! Maybe my sense of portion size is utterly messed up? I don't have anyone to compare with other than DH (average weight) and I do eat less than him. Last night I had 2 helpings of dessert but it was fruit salad FFS!!!! I made a big fruit salad at lunchtime as I always feel cheated if there's no pudding on Saturdays so I wanted there to be something. DH ate chocolate biscuits surreptitiously by the kitchen counter as he knows they are a trigger for me.
I feel like if I am eating healthily, I should surely be seeing some kind of pay-off in terms of weight loss/stabilisation? What the hell am I doing wrong?? I am so, so ready to start juicing tomorrow, as I know it will make the numbers on the scale go down. But then, I know it will also trigger a binge at the end of the week when I can't take it any more, so I won't do it.
But I need to have some kind of reinforcement that I am doing the right thing. At the moment my weight is not changing and I feel if anything even lower than before. I think this way of eating evens out the highs and lows of restricting and bingeing - both of which have their highs. And I miss that.
I am exhausted, snappy, irritable, feel unproductive. I have been back to the gym this week - easing into it after op. But I went twice in the week and also went for a run. And that had no impact either.
I want to call in sick for work tomorrow and curl up and die.

OK, lets get it into perspective, Lou. First, it is only you who sees yourself like that, I am sure DH and other ppl surrounding you do not think it is so bad.
Second, you have been ill, I understand. Three sessions of exercise in a week after previously being off sick would be a bit strenuous. Chose walking over everything, it is the best recovery and weight control exercise. Walk wherever you can. Be outside in the fresh air as much as you can. It helps being away from food, it helps to fight going under with depressive thoughts.

Third, dress as good as you can! Wear your best stuff or get yourself some really good, fitting clothes. I find my mood lifts automatically if i put a dress on isntead of trousers, since I have huuugggge upper leg and all teousers stretch around me really uncomfortably. Just being out of these kind of reminders that you are bigger than you like might help.

Fourth, the damn husbands can eat more than us and stay slim. It is a fact of life, they are biggerand they metabolise better, also do not go through hormone changes monthly as we do.

Fifth, are you sure you do not have underlying issues which can affect weight - thyroid, pcos etc? If you have you probably can not diet yourself slim, these illnesses make one to be on alarge side.

And last, when you have done all the above, eat three healthy meals a day and sod the scale. you may try to check that every meal has a veg component, incl. breakfast, but other than that - you need these three meals a day.
try not to eat pre-prepared meals if you do, cause it is amazying how little food - related pleasure they give, and they are never healthily prepared, because the manufacturers do not care! Even if labelled healthy, they are not. I once looked at the weight watchers ready meal inm y local supermarket and even if it was labelled tantalizingly 300kcal per portion, the portion would not have fed a baby,it was TINY.

If you are doing all the above already and it is not starting to feel better soon, you need maybe to tell your gp. It may be depression? Have you talked to DH about it all? Maybe he could help to have some perspective in the situation, make you a bit calmer about the whole thing?

Thank you for replying jass - it means a lot. Just to clarify, I have not been off sick from work, I have just had 5 weeks enforced rest after knee op. However, I walk everywhere (don't drive) and have done since 3 days post-op. I cycle to work every day also. I find walking and cycling do not keep my weight down at all as I do them every day and have done for many years so they are just my baseline. Only proper exercise like running/spinning classes can help shift the pounds.
I have previously, and as recently as January this year, dieted myself slim, so much as I would like to believe I have an underlying hormone/other issue to blame this on, I know that this is not the case.
I am really trying to eat 3 healthy meals a day. I always have fruit included in breakfast, but often have a green juice as well to include veg (spinach, celery, cucumber etc). I never eat pre-prepared food or ready meals. Nearly everything is home-made other than oatcakes/nakd bars and things like that. I have never bought diet-branded ready meals.

DH is suffering with anxiety and depression also.

With the clothes issue, I totally agree with you. However I have a wardrobe full of clothes I love, bought in the last 2-3 years, that I can no longer fit into, and I am strapped for cash as since September my new job is much lower paid than the one I worked in previously. I have been using any extra to pay for physio on my knee (none provided by NHS after op), so not much left to buy new, larger clothes!!

Ok, I see. I am like that too - eating healthy, lots of sports, but BED. Some of my wardrobe is also too good to be ignored, but does not fit! So I get it. But trouble is, we can not keep going like that forever - I can not run as long as I used to anymore, just because I fear I have exhausted my body by intense trainings for 20 years. It just does not want to run these marathons anymore, not even half ones for that matter. I now bike instead or run only 30-40 mins. It does not work as weight loss tool, no. I just have to accept it that there will be no weight loss. I went clothes shopping friday and was trying on some really nice dress with a jacket and suddenly a short and overweight lady emerged from neighbourong cabin and said "you look so good in this". it was in France, where people talk to other people quite freely in the shops, no one in my native country would say so, so I was quite astonished. Also, you must emerge to see the mirror, mirrors are not in cabins in that shop. Which I walways feel very self-concious to do. But I realised suddenly that on average, for a 45er, am not too bad. Even if I am size 14. Looking through her eyes, I must have been downright gorgeous. i just do not see it, I see myself as pretty fat usually as well.

But -I tell this cause I did not want to ask before, I di dnot remember whether you really had a weight issue or just BED issue,mbut since you say you were slim in jAnuary, what is your BMI now? because, you know, you started off saying you hate the fat you in the mirror. And I am convinced with all that sport you really are not fat, maybe bigger than you are used to and bigger than you like to be. But not fat? if you saw a person who is exactly like you, but not you, would you think they are fat? I have a friend who has somehow always weighed about the same as I, even gained over years as I, and is my height. Differenece is only that She is big in bosom and me in thighs and bum, so we look quite different. But each thinks the other is nowwhere fat but herself is! Even if we know it is mental trick, as we know we are same weight and heght!

Lou, I found your thread from last year, and I read it and somehow it struck me that this what this BED is - a life long thing. It never goes away. There are times we control it better and times when we control it worse. But how to get to the point it does not need to be controlled, but we would remain normal weight? Sleep, any ideas?

Struggling today, because for few days I did not feel like raring very much and underare, I underate becuase did not feel like eating mote. And still, today When i feel like eating more, i feel guilty and when feeling guilty I am seriously overeating. Weird. I felt it coming, and made a really good pumpkin soup to be aboe to stuff myself and not go overboard with excess acalories, but now I can not make myself to eat this soup, instead am going through a ton of cheese and fruit. And some ryebread.OK, rye is no wheat, but it still has some gluten which I am supposed to not eat! It never really goes away, can only be temporarily kept at bay...

Hi Lou - sorry you're feeling this way, I know it can be frustrating to not see instant results if you've been eating well for the past few days. And if you've dieted successfully recently, you no doubt have an expectation of seeing a lower number every time you step on the scales?

I had a similar experience where I'd managed an entire 5 days without bingeing (a personal best - go me!), but when I weighed myself I'd actually put on half a pound! Well of course the disappointment set off an almighty binge spiral. Because if stopping bingeing wasn't going to make me lose weight, then why bother, right!?

Looking back rationally I can see that 5 days is a really short space of time - and as jass says, there could have been a myriad of factors affecting my weight before or after, my metabolism was almost certainly screwy from the constant binge / restrict cycle etc etc.

In order to avoid getting caught up in that whole wave of unhelpful thinking, I've simply stopped weighing myself. I know there's a school of thought that says you should weigh in regularly and simply treat the number as a data point, but I haven't been able to do that. My weigh-in still has a huge impact on how I feel for the rest of the day / week. Would you feel more stable if you didn't rely on the scales to let you know how you were going? Would using how you feel be an equally good measure? Eating good food regularly must feel better than bingeing on sugary stuff, right?

Although it might not feel like it, it sounds like you're doing a great job - you're eating healthily and regularly (and you know that a juice diet isn't the answer!). Easier to say than do, but could you continue on this path and have weight loss be a secondary concern in the short term?

And I'm not sure if this is recommended (Sleep?) but I was wondering if it's worth working in a small amount of food that isn't "perfectly healthy", to ease any frustration around feeling deprived? I know that I'm in dangerous territory if I go out to eat and order a salad rather than what I really want - I invariably end up making up for it later.

Sorry I don't have the answers, but please keep at it, and keep posting - hopefully it helps to see that we're all going through it together...

daj Its great to hear the sleeping is heading in the right direction. Hopefully that continues. It will take your body quite some time to recover from it, so don't be dismayed that you are still struggling to make it out. I think it was Margo who suggested just walking, that sounds much easier and is still getting what your body needs.

We all struggle to shake off the demons from using exercise purely for weight loss but we can slowly change how we think about it. jassS made some great points below about how we change as we get older, how much we can do changes. Working with what we have now is so important in many ways, rather chasing how we looked years ago. Having DC is a huge change for our bodies, so maybe you could look at all you do now as recouping? Walk a different route, nose at peoples gardens and look for new parks or retreats.

Hello Elfin - it sounds like you've had lots of good advice. The thing I'm working on is trying to only stock food in the house that I'd be happy eating myself, AND feel safe that it wouldn't trigger a binge. I know that's hard to do though with lots of other people's preferences to contend with - DP is trying to help, but has a serious cereal / chocolate addiction, which makes things quite fraught.

Daj - I can't remember if you said, but do you actually enjoy running? Is the reason why you haven't done it that it feels like a punishment? Is there something else you'd prefer doing - yoga, or swimming etc? If you can find something that you love doing and can genuinely look forward to, it may make it less of an effort.

sorry for lots of posts, using phone.

Welcome elfinprincess glad you found us. To answer your questions from my perspective...

1.regards the SDC, I can understand that your and DH are tired. If they don't normally stay this long then it can tire you out. If they were there permenantly rules and routines would have been established but an extended stay is harder to get out of the excitement phase for them. You both absolutely need time away from the house alone, even if you get a couple of hours in a coffee shop! Looking at the food, it's a tough one. I know I'd find it hard to resist, I am stuck on what to say that may help. jassS suggestion seems OK but I know I'd still eat it. We have a cake in at the moment and I have to tell myself I can have as much as I want, so no rush for it now its not the last cake I will ever have. Been OK so far but I know I may be in a different place to others.

1. I am all for what ever therapy works for an individual, be it something alone or a combinations. Speaking to your GP would help you to find out if it is depression or something else affecting you. I personally take medication for that and anxiety, without it I do not function well at all. It gives me enough stability to do the rest myself.

1. What has helped me is opening up and dealing with emotional baggage. Sharing on the blog means I can say what I need to with freedom. This thread has been invaluable, different perspectives suggestions, having a sense of support and belonging have kept me going. The other would be the Fairburn book, it has slowly replaced my binge structure with a more positive approach. I think we all need something to put in place when we remove the binge coping mechanisms, there are other books so many options available. There is no end date to my recovery so the pressure isn't there. Giving up the diets, accepting I won't lose weight (but will have a healthier mind from getting better) and learning how my body really loses and gains rather than my warped habits was a huge help for me. HTH

Lou, I'm sorry you're struggling so much, it must be very difficult for you. You have already had some great support from the other ladies. The only thing I could think of was the Mind service, have you ever been referred to them? It may be worth asking about at GP, as they offer free CBT. It may not be practical for the ED but it would be a help for general emotional difficulties. Does that sound like something you could try?