Binge Eating Disorder Support 3

[FightingBed2014]

Welcome, this thread is for those that have disordered eating / Binge Eating Disorder (BED) and need support. We are all working towards a better relationship with food, together. Everyone is welcome to join in and share as much or as little as you like. Our focus is on learning to be happy with who we are right now and moving away from our negative self image, thoughts and eating patterns one step at a time.

Previous threads can be found here:

Thread 1 March 2014
Thread 2 October 2014

My blog following recovery from BED can be read here:Fighting BED

Many of us are following Dr Fairburn's Overcoming Binge Eating Second Edition book Here This is also used by a lot of Eating Disorder services in their treatment programmes.

Although we have no rules, we would ask that people either avoid talking about or be mindful when it is necessary that the following can be a trigger for those with an eating disorder; asking advice on how to start a new diet, talking about specific weight and clothes sizes. Please also remember that those supporting you need support too.

This thread was started by a BED sufferer and the majority of contributors are Eating disorder sufferers and not professionals. As with any online forum, it is best to supplement support on here with real life support and advice from professionals

Margo, what a lovely understanding response, so unlike your namesake. Hope the spa is just what you need.

Yes, am still married. No, never had counselling for it. Was of generation whose parents believed in taut socks.

But the times I have lost weight or eaten normally are when I have fallen in love or am on ADs. I am now and note if I don't take the right amount I binge eat. I find last night, having forgotten them in the morning. Carbs have a dulling effect. .

Hello modern

Could you try to access counselling? It might be good to 'get it out'? It has helped me understand myself a bit more, although sadly it didn't deliver the magical 'click and everything got better' I was hoping for.

Have you talked to anyone in RL?

Interesting to hear about the ADs. I had PND and went on them, and it dulled the desire a bit.

Spa was a bit mixed. Lots of service/facilities issues which was annoying as it wasn't cheap. Was nice to be with my friends though.

Have you read this depressing story about a horrible 'fat shamer' who is targetting women (only so far it seems) on the tube? What annoys me more than fat shaming is targetting women. It feels like misogyny to me.

How are you whiskers & bonnie?

Hope you are feeling safer Jass.

Thinking of you fighting.

Thanks for inquirying. I do feel Ok, now as the safety warnings are not filling my mailbox daily.

Foodwise, I went into Christmas mood. For me it means I cut out meatstuff and enjoy the rest of the Christmas food freely. In my country main Christams food is very much pork, smoked pork, pork with sauerkraut and german-style blutwurst. I like none of it particularily - so may as well not eatit out of habit. Still, I have to decide conciously not to eat it, otherwise just mechanically I would. So I only eat sauerkraut, but no meat with it, oven potatoes and no bacon with it, lots of citruses etc. Also, red wine but no Mulled wine - of course the mulled wine tastes worse thant just red wine, so why touch it. If I think about it in advance, before I find meself in the actual situation, I can avoid stufffing myself with the things I really do not enjoy, but might eat as "tradition". Mincepie and gingerbread are not my thing normally, why would I eat such rubbish now? So I try not to. But I love stilton!
What copiying strategies others have with the festive season?

Margy, thanks. Yes I may. But I think I will try my own CBT first. And I am starting radio therapy, which means I feel sick and indeed am sick if I eat much after it. So I might manage to break a habit over the next month. happily at thought of unexpected benefit.

Jass, I think it's eating slowly, savouring what you like, but in my case never being left alone with it, if possible. Ie for me, not a single person living by herself, I need to use the same control as I do over alcohol, where I don't drink by myself.

I offer this thought.

DH was taught about alcohol, don't drink alcohol because you are thirsty. Ie only drink for pleasure. .

Well for me, and food, I need to turn it upside down. Ie don't eat for pleasure. Sure, make it pleasurable, but don't use it as a primary or main source of pleasure. Use it for hunger and nutrition, primarily. It's the reverse of the alcohol thing.

Nb, have only just thought this out, so it may well not work. But worth a go.

Hi all, and welcome modern and whiskers. Good to have a nice active thread again. I’m back from a week in the sun for DP’s birthday, which was actually nice and relaxing. It was a treat from the PILs so a lot more luxurious than we could ever have afforded. And I managed to not do any work for most of it, so just had nice family time.

The break gave me a chance to think about a few things, about my BED and life in general. There are a few things I’d like to change, but also lots of things I should be very happy about.

Jass, you asked about body checking, a la Fairburn – that refers to frequent weighing / measuring, pinching or touching body parts, looking down at one’s stomach or thighs, assessing tightness of clothes, looking in mirrors, comparing body size and shape with others etc. He says it’s unhelpful and should be kept to a minimum.

My coping strategy at the moment is to have structured, regular meals. I’m aware that I cycle through lots of tips and tactics halfheartedly, and other than following the Fairburn programme, I’m not sure I’ve really put enough effort into my recovery. Which is strange because it’s what I want more than anything right now. So I’m going to be planning my meals for the day in advance, making sure they’re not more than 3.5ish hours apart, and that they’re large enough. I’ll see how that goes.

Whiskers I’m interested to find out how you get on with Brain over Binge versus Fairburn, they’re quite different approaches. Does one make more sense for you at the moment, or a mishmash of both perhaps…?

Hello.
I have started reading both fairburn and brain over binge and so far I can relate more to fairburn although I'm only about a third the way through each book.
Brain over binge kind of lost me when the author began talking bout the 'animal brain' wanting to binge and the human brain overriding it. It all seems a bit too simple (or perhaps I've missed the point?). I do have a lot of the book still to read though so I'm keeping an open mind.
Fairburn's book I can relate to a lot. I always thought bulimia was bingeing and then vomiting but fairburn says that fasting and exercising after binges is also 'purging'

I'm still telling myself I'm not restricting but I am because I'm still counting calories. If I didn't and truly ate all I wanted I would be eating too much. I'm not hungry, just greedy. I'm satisfied with what I'm eating and the quantities.
I'm less preoccupied with food this week though and hoping in time that this will reduce further.
I've gone from diet obsessed to 'normal' before so I'm hoping it can happen again.
I have started exercising more again. Partly because I want to be more toned and also to burn more calories.
I'm not sure if this is good or not.
I don't dislike exercise as such but I've got other things I could be doing. I love the feeling of being fit (I never exercised for fitness in my life till the start of this year) but I like to have a rest too. I can be quite obsessive about routines and once I start something I have to do it or I don't feel right.

That’s really interesting whiskers. The day I read BoB earlier this year was the start of my longest binge free stint yet (about 5 weeks). I think the animal brain argument resonated with me because I thought ‘of course it’s not clever rational me doing it, it’s my bloody animal brain, silly thing’. But unfortunately something un-clicked for me, and I haven’t been able to recapture whatever spark worked the first time. So maybe it was really just willpower, I’m not really sure.

At the moment the regular Fairburn-like meal schedule is stopping me from panicking about getting hungry, because I know there’s a meal coming soon. And actually it’s quite nice to experience genuine, normal hunger, and be conscious of what it should feel like.

I still count calories too (just mentally, not tracking on MFP anymore), it’s just a habit I’ve got into. However, I’m now doing it to make sure my meals are big enough.

Reading BoB did make me wonder for a while whether I was technically exercise bulimic, but I think not – I don’t exercise out of self-hatred, I do genuinely enjoy it and want to perform better in my sport. That’s one of the things I’m very grateful for. Life would be much much darker if I didn’t have that to look forward to…

Well, I am not too sure my sport is not the same obsessive kin dof thing as my BED.
i have managed to switch of calorie counter, on the other hand, I still weigh in most mornings. Otherwise I simply panic. As scales are mostly reassuringly stable, I have not managed to kick the habit for more than a couple of months. My scales are expensive, measure fat percentage and all, so I cannot bring myself to throw it out, hidin in basement did not really work. Silly, I know....

Hello

Jass I like your approach of planning not to eat stuff you don't what. It does sound like a pork-fest!

I think planning ahead is going to be key. Xmas can mean eating lunch at 15.00 or whenever the invite is for eg, so for me that means giving myself permission to have a snack beforehand so I am not starving.

Modern sorry to hear about the need for radio therapthy..BED ia difficult enough, health challenges must be difficult and maybe a trigger.

Re your point on pleasurable. Was interested to see 2 of my guests recently (slim & no food issues that I am aware of) eat a little of the rich pudding and then put the bowl down and return to it a while later. We were eating on our laps at this point. It would have never have occured to me to do that!!

Got to go, will be back to respond to othet points.

( light-hearted), can I recommend radio therapy? Like pregnancy it makes me constantly nauseous. Hungry but no desire to eat at all faced with food. Unless no smell and v hot.

Interesting re your guests, Margo. Nor me, either.

A silver lining modern. When does it finish?

Whiskers it sounds like you are making progress.

I think we all want recovery but BED gives us so much, it isn't easy to give it up. Also 'black and white thinking' - I need to do recovery perfectly or not at all (I am paraphrasing your thoughts here) is typical with ED. I think we need to think of terms of improvements towards recovery. It is unlikely we'll be cured overnight etc. I also think that is a bit like the media messages around dieting "I had my breaking point and then lost 10 stone in 5 months". So simple...

I think exercise delivers much more than just calorie burning, so I think it is a good thing unless you are doing it obessively. Although that could be subjective?

I went to pump again and the teacher kept going on about calories burned & "being good". It did spell out for me that there is work & time involved in having a body like the teacher has. The media might suggest we should all look like her & we cannot unless we have her genes, enjoyment of pump & time spent.

Going to a different class this week, so will see what the patter is from a different teacher.

I think fitness teachers have the advantage of doing 5-6 hours of sports daily - they get paid for it. So even if it is possible to do the same on top of job, family, I think it can not be worth it. Reading? Talking to kids? Etc... I value these more.
i heard today one fitness expert to say that he finds it sad that so many non-professionals train to run 2-3 minutes quicker their next marathon, even if there are no health benefits in running a marathon at all, let alone teying to do it quicker. He felt there are professional athlets who get a whole day to deal with getting better at sports, but the rest of should just move for fun of it - running, cycling, whatever, but never with the aim of going quikcer and quicker. i kind of get it what he said.

I kind of know what you mean jass, but even for some non-elite athletes there's enjoyment to be had in pushing yourself to be better at something you love. I'd probably fall into that category - at my age I won't ever compete in the Olympics or anything, but still enjoy training. (Although I'd never do a marathon, I'm not built for them!) I do know a couple of amateur triathletes who take it to extremes, spending a huge amount of time and money on training / equipment / travelling to competitions etc.

I don't want to jinx it but I've had a binge free week, which I'm putting down to following a pretty strict meal timetable. That's a very long stint for me, as I normally only go a couple of days or so and even that's only through restricting. I've been working out my exact meal times in the morning and following them closely, as well as following some of the principles in the Slow Down Diet book - trying to sit down for slow leisurely meals.

From what I've read, if I can keep this up for a couple of months I should be able to be more relaxed about it but for now I obviously can't rely on my own hunger cues as I always think I'm starving and Must Eat Now or I'll pass out.

Margo I don't think I've ever not cleaned my plate in the fastest time possible. Just trying to take short breaks during meals takes a real effort. One of the things I need to stop doing during family meals is finishing off what's left on the DC's plates - a hangover from childhood perhaps...

Feel I am making good progress. I am still overeating at weekends but I can now stop before it turns into a binge.
Still using mfp to calorie count and have noticed my weekend calories are reducing slightly each week.
I just have to keep reminding myself I'm not on a diet any more and I can eat what I want when I want and it seems to be working. My appetite seems to be normalising again and I can miss a meal without panicking or change what I planned to eat without worrying about calorie counts.
I weigh in on a Friday morning and my weight has stayed the same. I think the weight I am is the weight my body wants to be as I have little trouble maintaining this weight and I always end up back at this weight when I binge after a diet. It's half a stone heavier than I want to be but hey ho.
I don't feel the urge to weigh constantly so much any more either. Sometimes I used to weigh several times a day.
My goals are to not binge and to improve on my fitness levels and just be healthy.
I'm still reading brain over binge and it's very interesting and I can relate to some of it but not all. Still reading fairburn too. I can relate a lot more to fairburn.

Bad day today. Weighed and haven't gained but I did my measurements and although a couple are down half an inch a couple are up. Feel so down about it and keep thinking about dieting again but that's what has got me into this negative spiral before I don't really want to.

Whiskers sorry to hear you have had a bad day.

Do you have to weigh yourself? I know lots of ppl on here do, but I have had a few weeks of not and it has been helpful. I have beem feeling better. I did weigh myself this week and instantly noticed how much fatter I felt.

Sleep (who is an eating coach/phys) said on here once "The scales rarely deliver the right number". And she is so right! Even a loss for me can lead to BED behaviour.

I think the issue is, for us it is not just a statement of fact but a comment on lots of things : our 'goodness', our worth, our place in society etc.

You are the same person you were yesterday.

I am trying to focus on what and how I am eating.

Hope they day has improved....if not tomorrow is a new day.

Thanks margot
I had reduced my weighing to a Friday so I don't know why I weighed then measured today.
I think I'm going to have to stop weighing, my weight keeps pretty even at the weight I'm at just now anyway.
I'm torn between wanting to be lighter and having to diet to get there and I'm at a healthy weight and look fine so stop dieting and just be normal.

When I lost the weight earlier in the year I managed to gain it all back (a stone) within 11 days (11 day all inclusive holiday binge ) so I know how quickly it can go on when I throw caution to the wind. On the other hand I had been binge/starving to lose weight so maybe that's how it piled back on so quick.

I know how you feel. I think I am hoping for a loss.

This email came through from Isabel Fox Dene (think that is her name, Maggie introduced me) and I thought of this thread.

The “how” of letting go,
in my opinion,
is not so much an action one takes,
but a realization one has:

that the risk of hanging on,
the risk of clenching, tightening, and trying to control our food,
(only to inevitably end up losing that control in a pile of brownie batter later),
is more painful than the risks involved with body acceptance, legalization, compassion and allowance.

I am starting to feel anxious about a really showy place I am going to at the weekend. It feels v looks focused and full of slim ppl.

Good to hear ppl are making progress, there are less binges and they happen less often! I so no the feeling - I have not binged for a week or ten days, hence I should have lost weight. Hm. Normal people do not expect to lose weight just because they eat normally - but I find it almost impossible to accept!

mrsmargo sorry you're feeling anxious about your function. Sorry I can offer no advice.
jass- I have trouble accepting I'm not going to lose weight eating normally too. As you said, why would I?

After being in a diet for so long it feels strange not to be aiming towards something.

Sounds like you're making good progress jass

i am not making more progress than anyone else, also having less severe binges and more binge free time, but also still looking for weight loss (and I have no excuse here, I am normal, albeit higher end of normal weight). i see most of us are a bit more accepting of our BED and hence gradually moving out of it, but also coming to terms with the fact that BED is forever and also we might never achieve a "perfect" weight. I see lots of similar patterns, even if everyone is at a slightly different phase with their acceptance (I hesitate to say recovery, because I think BED is a chronic disease to control, one can never be cured totally).

A v good point Jass - have never really thought about it like that.

Not a great day here. I had a pre-arranged call with a life assurance company. I had to talk about my PND as part of my medical history.

The nurse commented on the fact I had waited 6 months before seeking treatment and said something like "It must have been difficult". At which point I started crying. I then struggled to talk, so we agreed I'd carry on the interview another time.

I just think it brought it all back. I also felt like I hadn't even dealt with being ill well enough!

I think I was also aware of telling her my weight and talking about my ED treatment. I just know 'the system' will judge me on those things.

It was horrible. Still feel churned up now.

I am off to bed as lack of sleep isn't helping
Seeing DR shortly about my thyriod.

Do not beat up yourself Margo. There are plenty of other factors in the life who can take up that job. Yours is to love yourself.

I have been thinking here that maybe I have a touch of a PND here as well. I feel less and less likely to feel joy over anything, kind of fallling into swamp feel. i lost a pregnancy in spring this year at close to 10weeks, so a real physical baby I could see on screen. I have many losses before, but all were earlier and I always rationalised that there was no baby. This time I could not and it is haunting me more and more. And due to age I think I might never get another chance, and even think I am accepting of that. Rationally at least I am. I have no idea about PND or any other depression, I have no idea how it develops and becomes severe, but I steuggle doing anything whihc is not a strict obligation - I follow my calendar and appointments, but that all. Yesterday I cancelled a business trip simply because my flight was delayed by couple of hours and I knew I would miss conneçtion, and face a rsik of stating overnight at half-way. And I just cancelled, even if eith more effort I might have made there on time. As if there was no will to fight left on me. It is very very not me.....