Binge Eating Disorder Support 3

[FightingBed2014]

Welcome, this thread is for those that have disordered eating / Binge Eating Disorder (BED) and need support. We are all working towards a better relationship with food, together. Everyone is welcome to join in and share as much or as little as you like. Our focus is on learning to be happy with who we are right now and moving away from our negative self image, thoughts and eating patterns one step at a time.

Previous threads can be found here:

Thread 1 March 2014
Thread 2 October 2014

My blog following recovery from BED can be read here:Fighting BED

Many of us are following Dr Fairburn's Overcoming Binge Eating Second Edition book Here This is also used by a lot of Eating Disorder services in their treatment programmes.

Although we have no rules, we would ask that people either avoid talking about or be mindful when it is necessary that the following can be a trigger for those with an eating disorder; asking advice on how to start a new diet, talking about specific weight and clothes sizes. Please also remember that those supporting you need support too.

This thread was started by a BED sufferer and the majority of contributors are Eating disorder sufferers and not professionals. As with any online forum, it is best to supplement support on here with real life support and advice from professionals

Looks like another nice day across the country. Hope you all have a good day.x

Good on continent too. yesterday was not great,but only because the day before I had clearly undereaten. I have learned a trick to understand when it is compensation and when it is seriously overeating - if I feel better after having eaten and good next morning, it was just compensation for undereating the previous day/during the day. if I feel bad afterwards and next morning it was food abuse. You see, I can not understand properly if I have had my three meals whether that was enough for a day or too little. i refuse to calori count and just eat what I think is reasonable amount. sometimes it may be too little.....

Hi Jass. Like you I'm into keeping fit, and something I think I too easily forget when I'm beating myself up about my binges is that exercise - running especially - does require "fuel in the tank", and if you don't give your body the fuel it needs beforehand it will at some point make you make up for it afterwards! I don't count calories either (nor do I weigh myself - haven't for about 5 years) but like you I can't help wondering sometimes if I've just got into a cycle of under-eating then over-eating because I don't actually know what "normal" eating is in practice...

Welcome runner & cant. Glad you are finding comfort in sharing on here.

Interesting to see the talk of loneliness up thread. I wonder if there is an element of 'us' holding back/not giving ourselves that makes us feel disconnected and therefore lonely. I know I do that, even with DH.

Also the issue of tireness. I rarely get enough sleep.

Not a great food day which is a shame after a couple of binge-free weeks.

I just find Fridays so difficult & today was first Fri since my ED group ended. I have to adjust to not working/being with DC. There is usually work still hanging about and I put pressure on myself about being an amazing mum for the 3 days I am with them.

Need to think about next Fri so I don't repeat today.

Have a good weekend. Anything nice planned?

Welcome to everyone new, this is a lovely supportive board full of wise, honest advice! DH has taken DC to a dads-only playgroup so I am home alone, which I love (rare these days) and just back from parkrun another couple of seconds off last week's time - yay! Way below where I was a couple of years ago at my fastest but as I was also much, much lighter back then I reckon my leg muscles are probably stronger now!!
I agree about fuel in the tank for exercise but am also wary of eating back exercise calories as I know I over-estimate them. For example, my Garmin tells me I just burnt about 350 cals running - I don't really count calories in food after MFP nearly sent me mental but I know if I ate a banana and a couple of oatcakes that would over-compensate for the run!
I do love the sense of achievement though. Despite dodgy pelvic floor (mentioned in earlier posts). I know running is bad for it but I won't give up. In my CBT they were talking about the best distractions from binges being activities which involved all the senses (other than taste), which I thought was interesting, as I think running in the open air, listening to music, really does that. I know it heightens my senses as if some guy in last week's unwashed kit passes me it's like a physical assault on my nose!!
I am struggling with a couple of issues at the moment that I would love some help with ... One is how/whether to be reconciled to a new body shape. I am finding it well nigh impossible to give up wanting to change my shape/lose weight. I know that part of the reason is that I still have all the clothes I previously fitted into, and sometimes when I'm having a positive day I will try them on - and surprise surprise, the jeans barely get past my knees. I'm asking myself if I should just eBay them all? But then I know I would feel a sense of defeat ... don't know what to do about it. It is not helpful at the moment though when every time I open my wardrobe I am confronted with loads of stuff I can't get near any more.
The other thing I am struggling with is friends, or lack of. We moved house last summer and I have not really made any new friends. I have also deliberately allowed myself to drift out of touch with old ones that I would previously have kept in touch with. Just a reaction to feeling low, I think. I think Margo was talking about loneliness/holding back, and I really relate to that. I am a very introverted, secretive person (I know there is a connection between enjoying binges and secrecy) who is borderline anti-social. I find it very hard to make friends now, and have held on to some from school/uni, but now as I said I have not heard from them in ages. The only one who is really still in touch I feel very ambivalent about as she is obsessed with weight/body shape and talks about it a lot. She has recently lost a huge amount of weight also. I am guilty of comparing myself with her and when I went on my most extreme diet it was emulating her way of eating. I know she will want to meet up in the summer and I am seriously thinking of trying to find an excuse not to do this. But is this immature? Also, stupid question, but how do you make new friends in your mid-30s???? As I said I am a natural introvert and like my alone-time, and literally don't really know how to connect with new people. Or even meet them? I caught myself considering joining slimming world or similar just to meet people, but the irony of trying to find friends who are all unhappy with their weight did strike me a bit!!
But, I think it would be healthy to have some friends to be able to chat to and get another perspective on life - things are not great between DH and I at the moment and I think one reason is that I don't have anyone else to sound off to about it. Also I totally, completely get what fighting was saying about needing a domain of life which is just for me, and which doesn't involve being a wife/mum primarily. Struggling to think what that would be though. In the past I have found very destructive, unhealthy ways of cutting myself off from DH/DC in order to get that space, but I know there must be better options ...
Sorry for the long post. I hope you are all having a lovely start to the weekend.

Hey Lou, I am still feeling so impressed at your progress . So many great insights you are experiencing! I think it shows just how much dieting/restricting impedes our rational thought processes, would you agree?

On the body image stuff - I would try not to think of it as 'defeat' or 'reconciling yourself' but more as acceptance and an open mind - everything in life fluctuates in our lives, including our weight. In your case, from what I think I remember about your weight I'm guessing you are probably close to your personal 'healthy' weight although it is more than your perceived ideal, so even when you truly find balance with food you may not lose weight as some people do. So practise focusing on the good things, strong muscles, clear skin, shiny hair, and also the amazing things you can do with it, like your running. It's also a good idea to change your media diet as much as you can - avoid the kind of magazines that analyse celeb bodies, regularly check out body positive instagrammers/bloggers, not necessary to idealise their body shapes more than others but to widen your perception of what is attractive. We get far too much identikit beauty in our faces every day, it's inevitable that it sinks into our psyche!

I would throw away the clothes, or at the very least store a few favourite things out of sight and chuck the rest. You may fit into them one day, you may not, but seeing them all the time is having a negative impact on what you are aiming for .

With making friends, could you join a running club near you? Otherwise I find young DC's the best way to get to know new people, chat at school gates, go for coffee, do a bit of PTA stuff, get to know parents during playdates...?

Your friend you describe sounds slightly toxic tbh and you may be right in avoiding her for at least a while longer, you are doing so well, if you know she might trigger a backslide then stay away.

Hi running (bit confusing for everyone having a runner and a running on the same thread but hopefully even though I'm a newbie people will soon be able to recognise who's who!) I can empathise with much of what you say: firstly, body shape... I too agonise sometimes over my changed shape - I stare at my naked self in the mirror and analyse and criticise, comparing myself now with how I used to be. But a few months ago, when I was feeling relatively good about myself (due to a few weeks of better eating), I went through my wardrobe and chucked out 3 pairs of jeans that I couldn't get into anymore but which, like you, I'd been holding onto because I was hoping one day to be able to wear them again. For me, it came as a relief to be rid of them TBH. I understand how you might perceive it to be a failure, cos that's what our EBD mindset does to us, but rather then have them torturing you every time you see them, you could give them away to charity, ebay them or whatever, and just tell yourself that if you do get back to that size again then you'll just buy new things instead. I really doubt you'll miss them when they're gone...

As for friends, I can really relate to that too: I have always been very shy, introverted and secretive and although over the years I've developed an ability to put on a more open, extrovert front with people, it doesn't come easily and I tend to hang back in social situations, and as a result I don't have a very big network of friends. I do, however, have a couple of wonderful "old" friends from uni days who I still am very close to: they know me better and more about me than anyone else - including in some ways DH! We live miles away from each other but keep in regular contact, and I can't imagine being without them... So I'd advise you to think about getting back in touch with one or two of those friends you've drifted away from - think about who you miss most and who you think will best help fill the gap you're feeling at the moment. I don't think you're being immature re the friend who's lost all the weight; friendships change and evolve over time, and whilst she might have felt like a kindred spirit to begin with, that friendship is now working against you. Friends are meant to help us feel better about ourselves, not worse, so have a think about the value you put on that relationship and if you think it's worth confiding in her about how you feel, whether she's likely to be sympathetic. If you don't think that will work, maybe it is time to gently break away and move on... Finding new, local friends can be more tricky, I know, and it can feel like hard work, but I've found that sometimes you just have to push yourself forward a bit, even when it feels uncomfortable, and get out there and do stuff. Do you chat to people on your parkruns, for instance?

Lou and Runner, I will not confuse you two, I hope!
I think clothes too small need to go. It is a must. And the only thing which makes you used to your new, liberated body is watching it. It is called mirrir work in overcomig overeating. Since you two are I guess more or less heatlhy BMI and running fit, that means you both actually have to look quite nice if you can start looking at yourself properly. Honestly, it gets better when practicing! I know I like my body now more than about 7-8 years ago, even if I am also much heavier and obviously I fall into this delightful age group when most of your looks say goodbye to you in the current decade!
I also have 4 kids and parted abdominal muscles, they just never recovered from my last successful pregnancy 6 years ago!

But looking at myself, noting that I still have a waist/hip ratio more or less the same as before, just everyhting measures in 10cm larger. But, what is 10cm? Ridiculously nothing if you think about it. Running has tuned the lower body, despite having always had really strong and lumpy thighs. Etc. Watch touself and finf things tou would say to tour best friend, if you had to. or what would you think if you saw a woman of your build on the beach. Then when actually on the beach find these women who look as you do and see whether you think they are fat or not. I bet you do not think they really are. Try a few flattering selfies, etc. It may sound ridiculous in the beginning, as all tou would notice initially are "issues", but if you persevere it does change over time. This is something which for me has totally changed - I can look at myself a morning after binge and see, I am still OK! Still the same not-too-bad body! I have found bad body thoughts much more beatable than binges.

Also, you need to learn different dressing style. What fits size 8-10 does not fit 12-16s, even if physically it does! Jeans so not do it for me anymore, sharp black pants do. Trouser suits were best before, now dress and a jacket look much better. I still have jeans and trouser suits, of course, but just see that dofferent dressing style now makes me look much better.You have to get into the shops and start experimenting with what would look nice on you. After 20 years of power suits with narrow pants and jeans for free time it took time to find out what suits the new me. Arriving at the point when I recognised dresses are better for me now took more than a year - I still looked for this perfect trouser suit, but there isn't really any. Then I tried and saw that a rather straight or a-cut dress is totally gorgeous on me! The ones with no waist still are not for me etc....

And, no frills of course or these skirts which look like balloons or a stack of hay! geometric patterns are really good, if they are clever and more vertical than horizontal..... Sure you know it all, but maybe have forgotten to put into practice!

My BMI is currently around 24 - I have put on about 4lbs since reinstating regular eating about 6 weeks ago. I am almost at the top of the healthy weight for my height. Yes there is muscle there due to running/cycling/gym but there are also lots of wobbly bits and cellulite.
As I am in danger of tipping into the overweight category if I put on any more, I would be happier to be honest with a BMI of 21-22. This represents just over a stone in loss however and I am very, very wary of trying to lose any at the moment when my healthier eating pattern is only just taking root. I am not allowing myself to feel too hungry at the moment as I know this is a binge trigger, but to be honest I am scared of cutting down on portion sizes in order to lose as I fear that I would feel deprived/hungry and this would lead back to bingeing ...
I am trying to let go of the need to lose, but it is always, always there in the back of my mind every time I get dressed/catch sight of my reflection.

Lou, I really would urge you to ditch the scales and monitoring of your BMI etc. I gave up on all that a few years ago and although my BED persists I have found that removing the added anxiety that went alongside being aware of my "stats" on a day-to-day basis helped a lot in clearing a whole load of unhelpful, negative thoughts. OK so I'm not happy either with how I look in the mirror (see yesterday's post), but one thing I am absolutely sure of is that if I went back to weighing and measuring again that would send me into a highly destructive downward spiral... You exercise regularly, you're physically fit, and you're working on normalising your eating - in other words you are working really hard! The numbers you're striving to achieve are just that - numbers; they don't mean a damn to anyone else but you. I'd say just keep up the good work you're already doing and go by how you feel inside, how your clothes feel on you; those are better indicators of how things are.

I agree with Runner. Something sleep wrote a while really resonated with me "The scales rarely (if ever) deliver the 'right' number". Weight gain is difficult, staying the same is difficult and even a loss sends me into thinking about shape/weight/loss/gain and that is then difficult.

I think too much focus on the number of the scales encourage us to judge ourselves by that number. And does it really mean we are different from yesterday when we didn't know as we didn't weigh, or we were a little less/more....?

We are so, so, so much more than a number on a scale, and too much attention gives 'it' to much importance and prominence in our lives...

All of which is very easy to type and much harder to do.

It is good to hear jass and runners progress (thanks for sharing ) and ability to accept their bodies more than they did. It gives us all hope.

I packed my scale away only now, I should have done it much earlier. But since I spend my summer hols in different country and obvs. Do not carry scales with me, I have always gone all aummers not weighing. And be happy about it. So now I try tol ive without weighing.
I am pretty sure my BMI is 24 too. But this is still OK, 25 would also still be OK and some say the healthiest ppl actually are those who have it around 26. 22 seems lowish for me now. I spent today at poolside with my kids. I decided that since I check bodies out anyway then try to analyse how they seem to me. And round, but fit actually is quite appealing. Even if somewhat overweight, but fit - can look really good, with rounded backsides etc. Of course if dark-skinned it helps, as pale ppl show cellulite better. But cellulite is part of being a woman. It is as weird to wish it away as wishing away your breasts or nose. Yes, there are ppl who have stick legs even when rounded on the upper body, but it does not matter - it is genetic. My granddaughter has cellulite - little lady is 2 months old:-))) We call it dimples on her. Guess why it morphs into cellulite on myself and my daughter. i refuse to take it!

I had an interesting 'body realisation' moment yesterday watching Glastonbury, The Family Stone...there were loads of people on stage but one was in stockings, bra and pants. Very lean and muscular and I sort of had to look to check whether it was actually a man or woman (didn't get a proper look at face and I'm still not sure!) there were no curves and yet he/ she was dressed so provocatively - it just hit home how kind of unfeminised the 'perfect body' has almost become - she (he?) wasn't bikini model type (had she had plastic boobs she would have been) but she was certainly closer to that than to the average woman. I'm not opining on what is most attractive but it was a weird thing to do that double take.

Whilst I totally get what you're saying bout weighing and evaluating body stats, I think at the moment even if I didn't weigh (and I am only doing so weekly in line with Fairburn guidelines, which is a massive change for me as I used to weigh several times a day, often after each meal/binge/exercise session) I would still be very aware of not being happy with my shape due to how my clothes fit or just catching a glance of my reflection. Yesterday it was really warm here so I got out one of my strappy summer tops from last year and put it on somehow forgetting the weight gain in the interim. It fitted fine on top (my top size has not really changed I have always been practically flat-chested with all weight on hips and thighs, very bottom-heavy and unbalanced) but clung over my hips in a way I was really conscious of. I managed to wear it through the afternoon then put it in the charity shop pile. Even without weighing myself that was a stark reminder and made me feel a bit insecure. Didn't feel tempted to binge though... Searched for new jobs online instead. Anyone ANY ideas of a part-time low-stress job you can do with a literature PhD haha?!?!

No Lou, no idea whether these jobs exist!

I think you need to go and get yourself the clothes that fit. really fit you and now. never mind that you have to buy a size or two up. You can still be good-looking with this weight, but you can not be good-looking in the clothes which are too snug or just nor meant for the new bosy you have now. I know it is very very hard to do and I still keep a couple of beautiful costums from my last big weight loss (of course I then rewarded myself w. Nice stuff). It is about 5 years old I guess, but since my style is classic it would still look good. But I know and accept they will never again fit me (if one day they did, it would be good, meanwhile I have written off that hope - I am financial manager, so writing things off timely and accurately is my job!). Most of my too small stuff my daughter has taken over and she just raided what I have in search of clothes whoch would be a bit looser than her own because she has just had a baby. It also put it again in perspective - my "slim me" clothes fit her "bigger me". She is 20 years younger, thats it why. Plus she has no BED. I do not envy her anymore, I have accepted I am now different and all my fussing will not put me back again into the lowest decile of women's weight st my height! But even a BMI of 24 means you fall into the lower thied of the women at 35 plus, and not beating BED means soon even this would be out of reach! It is a sad state of play, but it is true!

Everything you say, Lou (is it ok to call you that rather than running?) confirms the negative impact those scales have on you. You are using them to punish yourself with, it's as if you want them to confirm your worst fears about yourself so that you can continue to beat yourself up. It's great that you've managed to cut down to weighing just once a week, but I bet that as "weigh day" approaches you get anxious and preoccupied with thoughts about what the numbers are going to be this time, and think over everything you've eaten, how much exercise, etc. (I speak from personal experience!) In other words you are investing a huge amount emotionally in these weigh-ins, and it's working against you. Why not try putting the scales away just for a few weeks and see how you go? You may find, as I did, a big sense of relief; for me the scales had become a ball and chain which I'm so glad to be free of now. You deserve a break...

That's fine to call me Lou, runner! Now you are scale-free how do you deal with negative feelings associated with how clothes fit or your reflection in a mirror? I have gained to the extent that my face shape has changed as well as my body. Sometimes I feel like I don't recognise myself! I feel far worse about the fit of my clothes though, as that is a daily reminder even when I can't see my reflection. Maybe jas is right and I just need to buy myself a new, bigger, wardrobe ... Aaargh I am really finding this hard! I don't think I can face that right now, it will have to go in my mentally 'pending' file!!

What I'm working on at the moment is getting a broader perspective on how I view myself - both literally, as in looking in the mirror, and on the inside (ie in my head). Firstly, I know there are aspects of my appearance that are none too bad, and I try to focus on those. I take comfort and reassurance from knowing I am physically active and fitter than the average woman. Also, I have realised that the body shape I aspire to belongs to a much younger version of myself that in many ways just isn't me anymore; just as I've changed emotionally and on the inside over the years, what with life experience of career, then marriage, then having children, then coping with ageing parents, etc., so have I changed on the outside too. I'm getting older in other words! When I look in the mirror I see a few lines, grey hairs...and I'm not saying I like that, but I accept it as an inevitable part of the ageing process. So I'm asking myself, If you can accept that you're bound to change physically as time goes on in those sorts of ways, and be reconciled to it, why not look at your body shape in the same kind of way and be more forgiving about it?

Does any of that make sense?

Spot on, runner! getting older means shape change, and I am sure my body is doing everything to try and seem younger, unfortunately including the additional kilos. I look younger than extremely skinny women my age. I know, other ppl have told me so.

new beautiful clothes hope enormously. I try to buy a bit more upmarket too, nothing too horribly exensive, but lets say Christine&Laure istead of Zara or sth....

ladies, please go and check out the thread about pale skin! it is just so hilarious that society (and women themselves) put so much pressure on women to look comme il faut. You must not be too big, nor too slim, you must not be white, you must not wear too much (too little) make up...... isn't it familiar to all of us, all this obsessing about how we look? i guess it is very different for those who have health problems from too much weight or actually feel uncomfortable, for them we must invent or discover something which helps to lose without obsessing, and I guess a right I-do-not give a damn artitude is the best hope there as well. But many of us here are OK, yet we complain. We must put an end to that!

Hi all

How are your weekends going?

The summer isn't helping with my body image, but as the thread jass mentions, this thread and the group I was part of reminds me that sadly I am not the only one that doesn't see the sun/hot weather and think "Yes, I can wear my strappy dress and feel fabulous". I managed a dress with 'ice skater' skin coloured tights on Thursday which felt as revealing as I could go for a work day. However, they didn't prevent chaffing (tthink garlic crush with skin being squeezed through ) should have put my comfort shorts underneath - how summery - tights & cycling shorts!!

My eating drifted to eating what I want when I want it. I don't intend to restrict & restrain what I eat but I know I cannot just eat all day. I having a renewed effort to stick to 3 meals & 3 snacks.

Interesting to see the friends discussion up thread. I have the opposite issue in that I have invested way too much in developing and keeping friendships. I am sure it linked to wanting to prove how likeable/worthy I am.

A previous counsellor was a bit when I talked about the pressure I put on myself to 'rotate' seeing my friends. Am sure my friends would love to know I see them as an obligation!!

However, a lot of these of are only 'alive' due to my organisation ie I always initiate contact to organise a meet up. In fact when I was on mat leave with DD I didn't feel very social due to PND & being tired etc so didn't really see many people outside of close or local 'mummy friends' and it was notable how few people got in touch to organise something....

I have cleared out a few since. It is difficult as I do equate having lots of friends = being a 'success', but what is the point if it is all very one sided? And I don't think it does my esteem good to have to chase people etc.

Anyway we are hosting a neighbours bbq today, so need to get cleaning & organising.

Hope you are all ok.

No one doing bbqs here, it is around plus 40 today! yesterday spent day at poolside and ate nothing, but tried to feel no guilt about going hungy, it was just too hot:-) Had nice restaurant meal and even ate dessert, becuase my main course was only a huge salad. It felt good to do what just felt desirable in the moment, even if in principle I am still not eating sugar or gluten. Once in a while cannot be too bad, I hope. It felt great to feel normal, somehow, around food.

Continuing on the "friends" theme, Margo I know exactly what you mean when you say you've realised many of your friendships have been driven by you: I've had the exact same experience. Towards the end of last year I got really fed up and demoralised at always being the one to get in touch and organise meet-ups, to the extent that I made a conscious decision to effectively take a year out. I've taken a back seat for the past six months, the consequence of which has been that, whilst my social life has definitely suffered, I am appreciating more those few people who really value me and seek out my company. Feelings of loneliness are an issue (see previous posts), but right now this is the preferable route for me to take...

i am also the one who does the running for friends. but since it has been like that for last 11 years I have lived abroad and only I know I am at homeland I have started to view this as OK. But all what you say makesme wonder.....