A new thread for those struggling with separation

[harlemriver]

I wanted to start a new thread for those of us who are struggling to come to terms with separation/divorce, and to separate this from my personal thread (which was getting a bit outing)

maybe we can share stories and struggles here - paging @pinkrabbits39 @helpots @camedowntothewire @cakeoverexercise @couldihavethatinenglishplease @implodedlife

Morning all, I've had a rough few days. Told the DC this weekend, which was heartbreaking, and felt very final. I kept hoping H would come to his senses and we could stop all this nonsense and go back to normal (even though I'm pretty sure that's not what I want either). Then 2 days ago I took off my wedding rings. There's still an indent on my finger after so many years of never taking them off, and that feels like such a small, but powerful and painful reminder of what's happening. What's everyone else doing about wedding rings? Have I taken them off too soon? At the moment, I'm wearing them on my other hand, as I can't quite bear to take them off completely. But thank you for the pep talk @Itisallgoingtobeok - it's what I need this morning! Hope everyone's ok. X

@cakeoverexercise - it sounds like you are having a very hard time. Telling your DC must have been very difficult. As for wedding rings, I'm still wearing mine. I don't know why. I wonder if the indent will ever disappear? Hugs to all.

Hello All. Sorry to hear that so many of you are having a tougher time. I am too.

@cakeoverexercise how are your children doing with the news?

@CouldIHaveThatInEnglishPlease I'm in the trying to make it work phase too, but I feel really desolate about it this morning. I tried to do something last night that H has said he really wants but he found a way for it to be not good enough. I have had this overwhelming feeling this morning that he'll never acknowledge or accept the things I'm doing to make things better from my side, and will always say it's not enough.
I am on the verge of doing as you are, and putting a mental time limit on it, perhaps by the end of the year.

@cakeoverexercise I'm so sorry, we have not yet told the kids and I am very worried about how that is going to go. How are they all doing? I don't tend to wear my rings a lot (I got out of the habit a few years ago during COVID) so that part is not a huge transition for me, but I think it is really hard. A few ladies I know have switched their rings to the other hand. For my part, I am trying to hang in there, my H is still super depressed, still hasn't made good on any of his "threats" of leaving, but I did ask him to wait until I start to see a therapist. I have my first appointment tomorrow and I am actually very excited to start with her and try and get my life together.

@NewPhase23 and @ShylaA040404 Thanks, the DC are doing ok, considering. 16 year old just looks very sad and wants to spend a lot of time with me, while 19 year old is just escaping into online games (not ideal). I think it will only fully hit home when our living circumstances change. At the moment, not much is different as H is still living here some of the time, and working away most of the time, as he always did. @ShylaA040404 I think you'll find your counselling sessions invaluable. My therapist has been an absolute lifeline for me. It's just a space to vent, cry, plan, whatever you need to do, I wish you the best of luck with it. X

Oh @cakeoverexercise that must have been so hard telling the dc. How did they take it? I think that’s the hardest part so well done x
Definitely set a time limit @NewPhase23, I think that helps having a mental deadline because otherwise - when do you make the decision? One more day, one more week? One more month or year?
yesterday I wrote down all the things I will not miss if we split and it really made me wonder why I am trying to hard to fix things because I really don’t feel he is putting in even half of the effort I am, so I’m taking a step back this week to see if he pulls himself up. I don’t want to be with someone who won’t fight for us

Hello all, I’ve dipped in and out of this thread for a while now and always keep an eye on people’s posts. I’ve had a very unexpected regression back into depression again about my separation.

I’ve been on a relatively even keel for a couple of weeks or so, after all the ups and downs since the decision was made in March. We’re still living together until I move into a flat I’ve purchased, which definitely doesn’t help. This real low dip came after a discovery I made about the ‘someone else’. He had denied completely that there was anyone else, then that turned into it was someone he saw for one date on a casual basis, and then a week ago I found evidence of a necklace he had bought. When I googled the necklace, I saw that the packaging was pretty sentimental - the words soulmate, love & forever were included. To me that is NOT something you buy someone you’re seeing casually.

I feel like I’ve plunged back 3 months, I’m crying non stop, I have this heavy knot in my stomach, my heart physically hurts, I feel panicked that I’m being propelled into a life I haven’t chosen. I came downstairs at 1am last night and was sobbing so hard I was almost hyperventilating - I haven’t done that for many weeks. Even the thought of my new flat, which has been keeping me going, felt hollow and empty last night.

I feel shocked & surprised at my emotions turning backwards again. I’m someone who doesn’t mind living alone and I’m pretty good in my own company, but I’ve become worried about no longer feeling that way and actually finding myself feeling lonely. We were together for 18 years & married for 12, so I’ve got used to that dual living, having a life partner, being a team.

Anyone else finding they are suddenly going backwards with their emotions? 😔

Hi @AloneAgain2023 , sorry to hear that you're finding things tougher again. I am the last person to give advice about this sort of thing as I find emotions really difficult to navigate, but it struck me that you are worrying about things that haven't happened, it's the prospect of them potentially happening that is causing you upset.

You're not feeling lonely right now, and you're good in your own company, so you don't need to fear that. You're OK with it and your rational mind is telling you that you're OK with it. You're understandably scared that it might not go the way you expect, but there's nothing in what you've said about yourself that suggests that will be the case. You're going to be great, and fill this new phase of your life with all the things you want.

@NewPhase23 Thank you for your reply. You’re right of course, I suspect that once I get out of here and don’t have to watch stbxh living his separate life, it’ll be easier. The to & fro ing of feelings about him is exhausting as so many others say - sad, rejected, angry, frustrated, and back to sad again, over and over!

I do think the rejection is one of the hardest emotions to deal with. Even when accepting that separating & divorce is the right thing to do, I still feel rejected by him. He chose not to move forward with me, but to look at other options. It’s a really basic, human emotion I suppose - rejection & abandonment can affect most of us no matter what age we are.

I hope that you can find some peace or resolve eventually - in some ways that can be an even harder part, trying to mend or change things because one or both is unhappy, you can feel very much in limbo / push & pull. If I reflect on my marriage, the recent years have been not that great, and I felt sad & lonely for far longer than I wanted to admit.

Hi all, I've been following the thread but not posting for a while as have been really just trying to figure out my own feelings. I'm dropping back in to comment as I really identify with your situation at the moment @AloneAgain2023 We have similar timelines in our length of relationship and separation, and in this belated discovery that someone else is involved. I spent three months coming to terms with a separation that I thought I had instigated. During that time I was confused about a lot of things but I believed 100% that my husband would never cheat or think about pursuing someone else. I also thought that he still loved me and wanted to stay married to me, and that it was me who was ending our marriage and could no longer live with the compromises our relationship involved (his workaholism and a sexless marriage). It has turned out that there was someone else involved after all, and though the relationship hadn't progressed very far his feelings for this other person have been at the heart of our split. And I had no idea. Now that this has come out into the open, he has also finally had to admit that he doesn't want to stay married to me. So he had in fact been driving me to enact and take responsibility for a split that he wanted.

In the past couple of weeks I've been going through exactly what you are describing, the extreme emotional and physical reactions, a sense of panic and huge devastating loss. It's been really hard to process, as it's deeply physical/emotional - rationally not that much has changed but my response to it has been profoundly different. My counsellor said that it is because some of my deeply-led core beliefs have been shattered - my sense of who my husband is, what our relationship was, what our separation is. And that is in combination with the intense feeling of rejection, of not being enough, of being less than someone else. It's very hard.

My situation is easier than yours as I was already planning to take a few weeks away and that has coincided with this discovery. I don't have to be around my husband at all during this time and can move out into a rental without ever having to live with him again. That is certainly helping - I would find it incredibly difficult to be living in the same house as you are. But just to say, yes, I totally fully understand the difficult feelings of rejection and pain and hurt in these circumstances.

@harlemriver Thank you so much for replying to my post and I’m so sorry you’re going through that too, it’s horrendous isn’t it. One step forward and then two back, simply because these arsehole men are able to skip from one woman to the next with barely a glance backwards, and certainly without much conscience.

And the ease with which they lie is quite breathtaking! That, and the calculated behaviour, which as you’ve discovered from your own situation, they appear to have no problem doing. My husband tends to spout the same reasons & issues whenever we discuss (row!) about why things went wrong, seemingly forgetting or ignoring that in the main it takes two to wreck a marriage. I’ve always held my hand up to what I did wrong over the years and I’ll have to live with that. But I didn’t lie, deceive, cheat and have one foot out the door! He seems to have wrapped up his version of events very neatly with a bow, and that’s that. Not much accountability.

But nevertheless, as we’re both finding, the pain, sadness and anger is still very real and zooms around in one direction and then another. I envy anyone who can simply feel anger, decide their husband is a complete t….r, and then move on!!

Your councellors words sound spot on. I should look into therapy because unfortunately I don’t know anyone in RL who’s going through / just gone through all this. This forum has been a godsend!

Lots of best wishes for the next few hours & days. I hope we can both find some calm and resolve soon 🤞💐

In case it helps, a couple of the things that my counsellor has suggested that I have found helpful are (1) shift the focus from them to us. Focus on what you want and not what they've done / why / whether they will regret it etc (a spiral that I frequently fall into). A concrete question that she suggested that I have found helpful is to ask: do I want to go back into this marriage, knowing what it is like? Not some idealised future version that is different, but the marriage that it has been in reality. My answer here is a clear no, and in that case none of the other stuff is relevant (why he did it, whether he will regret it etc) because the simple truth is that I don't want to be in this relationship anyway.

(2) to get beyond the shock that we are currently in (the collapsing core beliefs) we need to realign our beliefs with reality. This means not creating new stories about the relationship and why it is ending etc but simply listing their behaviour objectively. Focus on concrete facts here, not the interpretation (i.e. 'he said X but did Y', not 'he is a lying cheating scumbag'). Part of the problem in my case and maybe in yours is that I have been listening to what my husband has said and have also been projecting what I think or believe to be true (he is a good and kind man who loves me and wants what is best for me). But if I look objectively at his behaviour over our marriage, it shows a long-standing pattern of selfish behaviour and very little consideration for me at all. And the information that I have discovered in the last couple of weeks has been a shock and a betrayal but it's actually consistent with that selfishness - not the aberration that I have received it as.

Those are some of the insights that have helped me, not sure if they will apply for you but maybe there's something useful. It's certainly a rollercoaster of emotions, I've never experienced something so disorientating as these past weeks and months. I have a whole new level of respect and understanding for everyone who has gone through divorce!

(also, another reason that I stopped posting was that my husband read my other thread on MN and I assume he knows this username. I stopped posting as it felt too exposed. But f* it, I don't have anything to hide. If he doesn't like it, he doesn't have to read it.)

@harlemriver That’s interesting reading what your counsellor said.

On the first point, I was able to say right from the start that if he had said one day ‘I’ve changed my mind, let’s stay together’, my answer would have been ‘no’. I had realised, as nightmarish as the situation felt / feels, that it is the RIGHT thing to do to separate & divorce. But even knowing & feeling that, I still struggled with the concept of him not wanting me, no longer loving me or finding me attractive, and preferring to go in search of other options, despite all our history together. In short, the rejection.

Also, thanks to reading endless threads on Mumsnet of the same or similar scenarios, I came to see that what we miss can be an ideal version of what we hoped our marriage was or what it was in the first few years, rather than what it had become. And that was quite a lightbulb moment - in fact I took a screenshot of that phrasing and regularly look at it, because it captures the essence and it’s very true. In my mind my husband was the person I met and got together with, whereas the reality was that he had changed and had many flaws.

On the second point, sadly I had been seeing that pattern you mentioned, of self centred behaviour and not always being emotionally there for me, over several years now. He has a coldness at times that I never got used to, even after all the years we were together. He’s very Jekyll & Hyde.

Selfishness is a word that comes up time and time again in reference to men / husbands. There had been an incident many years ago, where I came across very explicit text messages to someone on his phone. He swears to this day that they were only ‘sexting’, as if that makes it okay! He’s also adamant he doesn’t consider it cheating! I’ve told him that very few wives or girlfriends would agree with him!! So that sense of entitlement seems to be pretty strong in so many men.

Thanks so much for those insights, I’ll re-read them a few times because they completely resonate with me. And disorientating is a perfect descriptive word for our current emotions.

And finally, regarding your husband reading your thread, did it not make him realise how his behaviour was poor? Or was he just adamant that none of it was true or fair? As you say, you have nothing to hide. One thing I’ve never felt a need to do is lie, enhance, or exaggerate when telling people my story. So if my husband read all this, I wouldn’t feel remotely apologetic! So there! 😆

@AloneAgain2023 I actually posted about his reaction after he'd read my thread on here - it wasn't this one, but a personal one I started a couple of months ago. It definitely gave him more insight into how he had hurt / abandoned me over the course of our marriage and he apologised quite sincerely for that which was validating at some level, I guess. And it has also let him to start counselling to address his issues. But he's not doing it for me/us, which almost makes it worse, i.e. he wouldn't do anything to change while we were married but he is doing it now that we are separating, and presumably with the 'someone else' in mind. He keeps using weirdly passive language when he talks about our relationship, with phrasing like 'I can't say that I want us to stay together' and 'I wish I could fight for us but I can't' and other variations on 'I don't want to be in this marriage but I refuse to take responsibility for the decision to end it'. I'm finding that really difficult but it is also reinforcing the points I mentioned above - while I have been thinking about him and centring his thoughts and feelings, he is really not thinking about me at all. And that's what I am trying to hang on to while I get through this. It's not been the marriage that I thought it was, and he's not been the person that I thought he was. So it should be easy to walk away. Right?!

@harlemriver Those last words of your post are the thing aren’t they? We can clearly, rationally and logically see that our husbands are no longer what we thought they were, our marriages have not been what we thought they were, they’ve caused us great pain and anger and sadness, and in theory all that should = move forward without looking back. But the reality isn’t that easy.

I often think to myself, I can see and feel that he hasn’t behaved well towards me over the years, so why don’t I feel ONLY anger? That should be the only emotion I have, considering everything. But unfortunately the sadness, tears and pain are in the mix too.

And you’re right about them not appearing to be considering us in their new & separate lives.

When you look at how often this happens, throughout history, it’s a wonder anyone ever gets married at all!!

Hi all. I’ve been flitting in and out as well. But just thought I’d pop on and update that my husband doesn’t want to trial the separation - he just wants to separate. I know I instigated the telling him I was unhappy and wanted to work on things but I feel the finality in this and it’s thrown me for a loop. We get on civilly day to day but if we try and talk about it- he just blames me and says I brought this on us.
I feel sad because we do get on and I worry I’ve thrown away an okay relationship but like you say when you look at the patterns (refusal to empathise, black and white thinking, lack of sex, stubbornness and lack of general affection) I think would that ever really change or would I just learn to put up for financial security and DD. I don’t know, In a lot of ways it was fine and I worry it’s all spiralled. I’m just writing here with no real point but I certainly feel lost without really any idea of what I want or why right now. It all feels messy. I send love to everyone who is really having a hard time right now!

Sorry to hear that you're struggling @camedowntothewire I think messy and conflicting feelings are just part of this process and will take time to settle and find clarity. But don't let his version of events become your truth. You say that he has decided to separate now. That's not your decision, that's his decision. A bit like my husband, he may not want to take responsibility for the decision but that doesn't change the underlying reality. I also think it's hard to fully understand at this stage exactly what we are leaving and how bad our relationships have become. I keep trying to tell myself (and everyone else) that my marriage wasn't all bad, but it was missing huge elements (intimacy, attention, true support when I needed it, joy and fun). I don't want to project into your experience but your description sounds quite similar and if those crucial elements are missing, is it really a fine/ok/good enough relationship?

My boyfriend left me in January for another girl I have been absolutely devastated. I have just found out the girl he left me for is due a baby in September.
I found out on Facebook he didn't even have the decency to say.
Clearly the dates have crossed over he was still with me most of January
I just don't think I can take anymore I am broken

@harlemriver @AloneAgain2023 What you said in your posts feels very familiar to me too. I too tend to want to hang on to an idealized version of my marriage. When I analyze it, and think about the past year, I realize I am not getting anything from my H now or in the past year. In the spring when I had a death in my family, I barely got any emotional support from him. I realize he was/is struggling with his own depression but the fact that he couldn't come out of it to provide me with really too much of any emotional support speaks volumes, doesn't it? I also am very unhappy because the past year my husband has been starting his own business and though we briefly discussed his issues in the middle of 2022, he didn't bring it up again and I threw myself into supporting him. One of the things that makes me SO angry is that he was willing to be in a relationship with me, have me go to important dinners with him, spend hours every week helping him and only when things were more settled did he tell me he was "done" with our relationship. It is just so selfish. And, whats more is I, like you all, am in the mindset where I would have and probably still would do anything for him. @harlemriver the advice from your counsellor is so right on. It is so difficult for me to try and adjust my mindset but I am working very hard on it. I think this is the only way forward for me. All that to say, you all are in good company with me, unfortunately. I just hope for all of us one day that this anger, sadness and betrayal lessens with time.

On another note, I just saw a counsellor yesterday for the first time, and she too suggested that my husband potentially is cheating on me. And though I have no "evidence" of this, I am not naive enough to think it can't be true - I do think it likely is probably the case to some degree. I have brought up to him that people say that to me, and he certainly has not refuted it. But, it is like you said @harlemriver I would feel better if he could stop pretending our marriage was always doomed and just accept responsibility for his actions. But she also encouraged me to focus on what I want and gave me some good ideas to help myself so I already have another appointment next week and I am very glad for it.

Hope everyone else is hanging in there as best they can.

@camedowntothewire I totally am with you on this. It is so hard to hear them just let go even if you were the one who started the conversation. I tell myself that I, like you, might have held on for financial security and for our three kids, but why? It helps me to sit down and think what I am getting from my husband right now. And, the answer is nothing (other than some financial security). I am getting no love, care or even basic respect. I was telling my counsellor yesterday that I find it so hard to live with someone who acts as if they hate me. I don't know if that is your exact situation, my H and I actually in general get along well and have had no other major marital issues apart from this whole he needs sex with other people to cure his depression. So I find myself thinking the same thing sometimes, like, why am I giving up this family when things are okay? But, I do think you have a point to go back and think, were things really okay? I feel the same messiness too. I have even started writing out my thoughts and asking myself, what am I getting out of this marriage right now? When I look at it on paper, the reality (not what I think it could be), it helps me a lot. Sorry for the stream of consciousness response but we really are all going through such similar feelings and it helps to feel not so alone.

Hi all, bobbing in again. Too many posts that resonate with me to comment on but definitely understand about how we’d have stayed for the sake of the family and the children and security.

also resonates re. No longer recognising your husband - were they always this nasty and they hid it well? And if that’s the case, then were our entire marriages a sham?

I’m still in a very dark place, had suicidal thoughts again yesterday but got my MH team around me.

the one thing I am struggling with is acceptance - does everyone else struggle with this? If I could accept it (and God knows my H has made it clear it’s over) then that’d be half the battle. I’m told it takes a while, is that correct? We’re 4 months now, I know it’s over but can’t accept it - does that sound familiar?

@PotsnPan I really feel for you, and I can understand the darkness that can descend. I can relate to your thoughts about were they always this way, and if they were then the marriage has been at least in part, a lie.

I have to really make an effort to not go down this road. It’s so easy to think ‘who is this person who is capable of being so cold, detached, utterly self absorbed, Jekyll & Hyde’. Was he always like that and by the time the mask slipped we were married for a few years?

For me personally I have needed to remind myself through making notes, of not only the bad things (which help to clarify that it’s RIGHT to separate), but also the good things from earlier, better times. I know some people might not want to remind themselves of good times, but I think it’s important to do that to prove to yourself that it hasn’t all been a lie, a sham, a waste of years. For me, the idea that 18 years have been wasted with the wrong person, is too much to bear. So as angry, sad, and hurt as I am, I’ve tried to remember the first few years when things were good and he really wanted to be with me.

Regarding acceptance, my own point of view is do NOT beat yourself up about not being able to accept things. I’m also 4 months down the line, and my feelings and thoughts fluctuate regularly. It truly is normal to go round and round with your emotions and reach that panicky feeling of ‘this cannot be happening’. And yes, it is ABSOLUTELY correct that it takes a while, I think ‘a while’ is probably an understatement. I’ve done endless reading online, and so often it talks about getting over a divorce being a long winded process which can stretch into a year or more. BUT it won’t all be utterly black, it will go along on a curve which may sometimes dip downwards. But ultimately it will slowly improve, the black will turn to grey, and the grey will eventually fade.

I hope all that doesn’t sound too preachy! These are just things which help me rationalise things, some days they work and some days they don’t!

💐

@wantittoneober I wanted to acknowledge your message, I’m so desperately sorry you are having a turbulent time. That all sounds so painful for you.

Infidelity at any age, whether you’re married or not, is devastating. Unfortunately I’ve been cheated on several times over the years, boyfriends when I was a bit younger, and husband now. And it’s always nearly impossible to bear.

What you need to try and remember if possible, is that his behaviour is on him, it is not a reflection of anything you’ve done wrong. It’s an automatic reaction to take on board that we must be not good enough, not pretty enough, not good company enough etc etc, but eventually you will come to see that his cheating makes him not much of a loss.

It always helps, I think, to read about other people’s similar experiences and Mumsnet is a great place to do that. You can pick up some views and opinions that will make you see that you’re definitely NOT alone in going through something so painful. So read a few threads & posts and join in if you would like to - you’ll often get some great, kind replies and advice.

It’s been a godsend for me lately!

💐 for you