Page 6 | Man going for 50:50 custody

toobusytothink · 2021-01-02T18:15:55+00:00

Male friend of mine is going for 50:50 custody of his two sons. He is an incredible dad and genuinely wants this - it isn’t to avoid child maintenance - he genuinely believes the kids would be better off with him and he is and has always been a very hands on dad. His ex is likely to oppose it and has no idea - she thinks he will be asking for EOW and one night a week. Any tips on best way to ensure he gets this?

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 11:47

@Coseynightin

In my experience it is the resident parent that makes the issues worse by how they behave and the control they want over their children

What’s your experience then?

You are also naive to assume all abuse is easily proven and dealt with decisively by family courts. It is not.

I would also suggest that the majority of children do not want half the week at one house half the other and in most cases absolutely one or two of the parents are putting THEIR needs and wants before the children’s.

Branleuse · 04/01/2021 11:51

as long as he stays very close by, then theres no reason this couldnt work amicably.
How come theyre still living together if both working full time?
If he moves out and finds a place with a bedroom for the children and has already been doing his share of the drudgery and life admin, then theres no reason he shouldnt get 50/50, but I dont think theres any way you can or should help him with this.

SpaceOp · 04/01/2021 11:52

OP, if he really is just a friend and a colleague, I would step away. Because while he may be telling you the 100% truth, at best, that truth is HIS truth and is not necessarily the truth someone else would see. He says she screams and is abusive but in writing is all very careful - do you know this and have seen it for yourself? Ditto her anxiety and health issues. Although I can assure you, that if I was supposed to be separating from my ex and he was continuing to insist on living in the house with me, telling me what to do etc, I'm pretty sure I'd have anxiety issues too.

And while I am often on here getting annoyed when people default to assumption of men as wankers, I do think the 50/50 thing is more complicated because very few men are genuinely doing 50/50 and certainly not of the "thinking" stuff. So your friend may well think he's doing it, but as a PP mentioned, doing the cooking once or twice a week or pick up once or twice is NOT 50/50. Is he as up to speed on after school activities, homework, friendship groups? Does he organise playdates? Does he plan and prepare for birthdays including present buying, party planning etc? Does he think about gift buying for friend's birthdays? Is he aware when the children's clothes need replacing and where to go to replace them? Does he make time to do this?

tigerbear · 04/01/2021 12:03

In my experience of what @SpaceOp says, even though we’re now 60/40, I’m still the one who notices when DD has outgrown clothes, Coats, sports kit, school shoes, etc, and buys them each time (on the rare occasions he buys them, he buys second hand stuff or gets stuff out of the ‘lost property’ bin at school for PE kit). Nothing wrong with that if someone is hard up, but he’s on well over 100k.

tigerbear · 04/01/2021 12:04

He regularly dresses her in things that are are 6-7, even though she’s in 9-10 clothes.

BeyondThunderdome · 04/01/2021 12:15

@LargeProsecco

And it should also be noted that abusive men often ask for 50-50 or sole custody as a way of punishment to their ex-partner.

And it's not unheard of for abusive men to make allegations that their ex-p is "mad" or "a crap parent".

Both of these actions can be of a controlling, nasty ex-p who is abusive, using the legal system to continue their abuse.

I'd tread very carefully, OP. Many abusive men can appear "nice" but are in fact manipulating you.

We're all on our best behaviour at work & often you see the person they choose to present at work.,

And the first red flag for anyone hearing about my split with my ex, should have been the fact that x amount of time on, he was still refusing to move out of my home...

InkieNecro · 04/01/2021 12:21

50/50 is equal, it isn't fair.

ProseccoThyme · 04/01/2021 12:29

@BeyondThunderdome - same here - 15m later.

Classic abusive behaviour (especially given that he had an affair) & can't afford it, whilst he can.

Refusing to sell the house, making false allegations about me.

Nasty, controlling, manipulative behaviour

Parkperson · 04/01/2021 12:35

Some posters are not answering the OP's query but are resorting to their own highly personal anecdotes, designed to put down the poster and the issue of whether a really good father who already does 50% of childcare should have 50/50 care of his children. The starting point in law is 50/50 shared care.
Some posters hijack threads to moan about their very own individual experience which has little relevance to the original question.

Timeforredwine · 04/01/2021 12:35

He may just obtain a living with order and the other parent has access usually e/o weekend.Not many believe in the confusion of 50/50. It isnt called custody anymore. He needs to get a solicitor and then start proceedings rather than living in limbo. Act now.

Branleuse · 04/01/2021 12:40

@Parkperson

Some posters are not answering the OP's query but are resorting to their own highly personal anecdotes, designed to put down the poster and the issue of whether a really good father who already does 50% of childcare should have 50/50 care of his children. The starting point in law is 50/50 shared care. Some posters hijack threads to moan about their very own individual experience which has little relevance to the original question.

well the OPs query is not even about her, its about her male friend who she for some reason wants to get involved in their custody battles with his ex. Its pretty odd imo. Its hardly surprising that a lot of women with experience of this from the other side might have an opinion. Thats the nature of message boards

SpaceOp · 04/01/2021 12:45

@Branleuse exactly.

I have a friend, male, no children, who recently went through a divorce. He has a friend who I vaguely know but haven't seen or spoken to in 10 years. This other man was ALSO going through a divorce, but has children. Needless to say the other man had lots to say to my friend about divorce, greedy wives etc etc..... And my friend, who was splitting stuff 50/50 with his ex and had no children to consider, was lapping up this other guy's stuff. And without knowing the situation at ALL, i could HEAR the red flags just in the retelling and had to point out to my friend a few times that he should probably not get involved and should stick with his own divorce because he was only hearing one side, that sounded v biased to me.

Parkperson · 04/01/2021 12:49

In Scandinavian countries it is more common to have 50/50 arrangements. There is some research that shows whereas children do best in a nuclear family, shared care is the next best option.copilots.family/research-on-50-50-shared-parenting-agreements/?lang=en

Parkperson · 04/01/2021 12:52

I messaged MN HQ to ask if it was against MN guidelines for a poster to ask a question on behalf of someone else. It is perfectly legal according to the MN guidelines. It is irritating to see some posters trying to police the thread to ensure their opinion dominates.
I am sorry the OP was chased away by self appointed police.
Not in the spirit of MN

MNHQ

HebeMumsnet · 04/01/2021 12:56

Afternoon, everyone. Just a reminder that we don't allow trollhunting. We've no reason to disbelieve the OP here but if you do have concerns please report rather than air your thoughts on the thread. Thanks.

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 13:12

@Parkperson

I messaged MN HQ to ask if it was against MN guidelines for a poster to ask a question on behalf of someone else. It is perfectly legal according to the MN guidelines. It is irritating to see some posters trying to police the thread to ensure their opinion dominates. I am sorry the OP was chased away by self appointed police. Not in the spirit of MN

It is perfectly fine to ask questions for another person.

What has rankled with some of us is the nature of the disclosures and very one sided disparaging comments about a third party whilst maintaining not to be involved as anything other than a friend. That was unnecessary
In fact some people might say it was not in the spirit of seeking advice for someone but rather trying to incorporate some form of character assassination with that person not around to defend themselves.

Two quite separate things

Sup1979 · 04/01/2021 13:12

Troll hunting?
Disbelieve the OP?

I don’t see any of that. I see posters questioning whether this is a “friend” or a boyfriend, which surely Is allowed despite the OP perhaps not liking the question. There has to allowance for probing questions and skepticism.

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 13:15

[quote Parkperson]In Scandinavian countries it is more common to have 50/50 arrangements. There is some research that shows whereas children do best in a nuclear family, shared care is the next best option.copilots.family/research-on-50-50-shared-parenting-agreements/?lang=en[/quote]
Firstly Scandinavia is a completely different country and culture and doubtless a far less adversarial family court system if necessary to resort to one.

Secondly the notion of a nuclear family or then shared care being “best” does not take account of the countless nuances and individual factors at play in families where neither of these options might be said to be better.

Far more work should be done to truly ascertain the wishes and feelings of even young children. They are human beings in their own right and it should never just be about dark my their lives up so neither parent feels hard done by. It should always be that the outcome - whatever that is - maintains the optimum emotional and physical welfare of the children

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 13:16

*carving up their lives that should read

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 13:17

@Parkperson

I messaged MN HQ to ask if it was against MN guidelines for a poster to ask a question on behalf of someone else. It is perfectly legal according to the MN guidelines. It is irritating to see some posters trying to police the thread to ensure their opinion dominates. I am sorry the OP was chased away by self appointed police. Not in the spirit of MN

Ironically you are policing this thread far more by reporting other people

Timeforredwine · 04/01/2021 14:31

I really do not understand why bother to have forums if people cant ask questions and answer them in their own way! What on earth is wrong in this country that we police freedom of speech. It's only offensive if you are purposely insulting someone and that would be blatant so everyone could see it and ignore without responding. How is it that on mumsnet, similar to a talk show or problem page really you can only say what others want to hear and if you dont it's a problem? I know this is not the thread but genuinely it beggars belief.

Lemonpiano · 04/01/2021 14:56

Posting about your own problems is a bit different to publishing info about another person's private life without their knowledge or consent.

thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter · 04/01/2021 15:23

Why, if he's such a hands on dad is he not finding this information out for himself?

Obviously he's complained about this to you enough for you to do something about it. It makes me think he talks the talk but when it comes to walking the walk he's happy to have women do the graft for him.

Sup1979 · 04/01/2021 15:37

@thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter

Why, if he's such a hands on dad is he not finding this information out for himself?

Obviously he's complained about this to you enough for you to do something about it. It makes me think he talks the talk but when it comes to walking the walk he's happy to have women do the graft for him.

Nailed it

Cleverpolly3 · 04/01/2021 15:41

@thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter

Why, if he's such a hands on dad is he not finding this information out for himself?

Obviously he's complained about this to you enough for you to do something about it. It makes me think he talks the talk but when it comes to walking the walk he's happy to have women do the graft for him.

Men who are like this normally are happy to leave the graft to the mother. Even when they get on and are fairly hands on I suspect . And they continue to get away with it Even on this these mothers of children who are 50:50 shared care have written that they are the ones who have to remember things, that men on a 100k salary dress their daughter in clothes two dress sizes too small or let her use the school PE bin for clothes.

This sort of thing is not just extra work for the mother but also very unfair and possibly demeaning to children even if might be wrongly put down to men not having a clue. If they want 50/50 care they need to up their game and do it properly