Court hearing updates

[Chumpnomore]

Hi, don't want to be all doom and gloom but I know it's useful for others to have up to date information when available if going through the court process.
I had a directions hearing today. The judge personally dialled me and my solicitor and stbx/solicitor and we had a five way call.
The judge said courts were running on a skeleton staff and had no idea when anyone would be back in court.
He said we might have to have a FDR by phone.
Anyway, thought might be useful if people waiting for news. Expect delays.

[Merryterry]

hello, I’m in a similar situation of playing the waiting game and going down the honesty route but it’s not getting me anywhere quick. I was hoping one of you could offer me a bit of advice. I’m having to represent myself at my first hearing now in november due to my financial situation.
Me and ex have just 1 child who’s nearly 18, we have contributed equally to the marriage and property for over 20 years. He now it seems wants to buy me out for much less than the house is worth. I’m tempted just to get rid of him but feel I need to at least attempt to get what’s mine.

We have exchanged form E, I was completely honest however I know he wasn’t, I have answered all the questions he has raised in the questionnaire and produced answers for the statement of issues though I don’t know if that was necessary.

I was hoping someone could tell me if I have to send him and the courts the answers to the questions raised or if that’s done at the first hearing? I’m happy to send him them but as I have no information I assume he hasn’t either and so won’t be sending me his? Did you reply to the questions before the first hearing or is the point of the first hearing to organise for those to be answered?

I’m very appreciative of any advice or insights anyone can offer me, Thankyou x

[catkins22]

Don't let him buy you out at a reduced rate. What about pensions and savings etc? My ex is the same, very dishonest and managed to dig a hole for himself!

I'm also representing myself and had the first finance hearing last week. You can answer the questionnaire after the hearing and will be given a timeframe to respond. If there are any questions you think are irrelevant, you can raise it at the hearing. Be prepared that he might ask to remove some of your questions so be ready to justify why you asked the question (s).

I don't think you need to answer the statement of issues directly. Although you might want to respond briefly to the main points in a position statement, with anything else that has come up since form E exchange.

[AustinRd]

@catkins22 has explained it beautifully! You have the right to contest any questions so do so if you feel they are irrelevant. Also if he has failed to provide evidence to support his form E or fails to answer/evidence any questions a “statement of deficiencies” is a good shout. I’ve just had to do this.
I also learned that all the hearings pre final are “without prejudice” and the judge gets to see everything. If it goes to final hearing it can’t be the same judge and they don’t get to see what’s gone before.

[Merryterry]

Thankyou both for your insights! I think a position statement and a statement of deficiencies are worth having spent the time writing up before hand to deal with anything I’ve got issues with. How do I let them know that I’ve got them? Pensions and savings are pretty equal, it should have been quite straight forward but for some reason after we agreed everything he’s changed his mind and wants a lot more of the house than he’s entitled to. He’s got a mckenzie friend to be with him during the hearing, which is being done remotely. I’ll be on my own which is making me nervous. I’ve read the McKenzie friend isn’t allowed to speak, I only have my new partner who I could ask to be with me but I don’t think that’s allowed. Is there any way I can have him with me during the remote hearing? Some reason I can give that would allow him there? Did you have someone with you atall @catkins22 ? How did the remote hearing work? How long did it last?

[catkins22]

The remote hearing lasted about 90 minutes but it depends on the number of issues. It was fine, it was a video conference so felt much less formal than the court room / chambers.

They sent a link by email that day to join the hearing but it could be by phone.

You aren't allowed anyone with you unless they are your McKenzie friend or legal representatives (he had solicitor and a barrister). However, I understand Support Through Court can attend remotely if they have a volunteer available, although they can't speak either. Google them and give them a call, they are very helpful. They can't give legal advice but can give procedural advice.

Also have a read of Lucy Reed's book, The Family Court without a Lawyer.

[Chumpnomore]

@merryterry I'm sorry you are going through this too. I don't think I can offer any advice that hasn't been said by @AustinRd and @catkins22 and well done for getting all you have done, so far.
Everything is being held remotely atm which i suppose is better for all of us but of course the stress and uncertainty doesn't change, however the courts are running.
Wishing you all the best and keep us posted.

[Sodamncold]

@Chumpnomore

Hi, the fdr won't be before July 1st because we are waiting for the pension report.
However, judge said everything was delayed, obviously, so unlikely to be anything near normal until then.
Re disclosure. The bundle can be recycled, but obviously updated.
We need to provide latest p60 and payslips since then. Also, an expectation to disclose new accounts or income etc.
My grandma died since form e was exchanged. Stbx is insisting he sees a copy to see what I've been left. It's all horrible.

As unsavoury as it appears - completely his right

[Merryterry]

Thankyou for reply, sorry for all the questions, you’re being so very helpful, I’m thinking about this all the time and just can’t wait for it to be over. How did the courts check that you were on your own and didn’t have someone there for moral support? Could you see your ex husband? I would prefer just to see the judge and only hear my exes voice but not see him, he can be very controlling. I’m going to have so many piles of papers in front of me that I’ll have to locate certain things quickly. I’m not sure how his McKenzie friend will be accompanying him, wether he’ll be at the house or also remotely. It makes sence they have to be there in person to give support but because of social distancing will that be allowed? Was your exes barrister and soliciter in the room with him or also remotely?

[Merryterry]

@Chumpnomore Thankyou, for your kind words, I shall do x

[catkins22]

Good morning, the court reads out a statement at the beginning for you to confirm you are not recording and cannot be heard by anyone who is not permitted to be there.

His legal team were all in different places. I didn't see him, only his barrister who did all the talking for him. You may have to see your ex on screen as he is representing himself. But it's much easier than having to sit in a room with him. Also, it could possibly be a phone hearing.

Maybe put the papers in a folder with dividers for each document so you can locate easily if you need to and the judge will understand that you need time to find something, if they ask about it.

Try not to worry, treat it like a business meeting.

[Merryterry]

@catkins22 I was thinking I would maybe record it but that’s out of the window then if you have to swear not to. I expect I will see him then, I was hoping maybe the judge would see both of us but we would only see the judge. All the papers are in folders and labelled but there’s an absolute mountain of them, most of it is my evidence as he’s not provided everything he was supposed to. I can counter any claims he’s made with evidence so I just hope not to get flustered and to be able to find them in time. Did his barrister speak privately with your ex and you could hear them? Or did they have a way of speaking privately? His McKenzie friend is not meant to offer advice on anything legal. They’re just there for support but with social distancing they shouldn’t be in his house I don’t think, if they can’t speak privately then there’s little point in him having someone. I’m worried I’ll get flustered and not explain myself properly when something seems so simple to me to see through. Oh well what will be will be. My thought on recording it was to confer back to before the next appointment. Did you get transcripts sent to you? My memory will fail me trying to rememeber all the points back on my own if he’s upset me. Thankyou again for replying, you’re going through a horrible time also and I do appreciate your insights.

[AustinRd]

@Merryterry my biggest piece of advice is try to focus on you, your case and your needs and not on you ex. He doesn’t matter the judge does. My experience of family court judges has always been they are patient and understand the pressures so will try to give you time and help you as best they can. It’s hugely stressful and they as human beings they know that. Deep breaths, take your time, ask for it if you need it and you’ll be surprised how quickly you settle. Wishing you much luck

[goldwrapped]

Just popped in to welcome @catkins22 and @Merryterry. Well done for representing yourself! Impressive xxx
Quick update, I’ve had his responses back and it’s just more lies. I’m not sure if the battle is worth any more of my sanity. Had another 2 x £1000 solicitor bills and it’s only going to carry on if he continues to lie.
For the sake of my mental health it might be time to sell the house, pay him off and move on. It’s so bloody infuriating though, makes my blood boil after everything he has done he still rips me off! Grrrrr.
Rant over, apologies. Big hugs everyone x

[Palaver1]

Hello everyone going back for third time tired fed up
Last time one of the requests was for me to give housing needs I have a child with additional needs nonverbal etc
I have some thoughts could anyone give me suggestions please.
Want so much to get this over with.

Thank you

[Merryterry]

@goldwrapped is there any punishment for them lying? It seems to make a mockery that they can be dishonest and not have any penalty for that, have you been to court for the first appointment yet? My ex has blatantly lied on his form E and not included half of the documents he was meant to and sent incomplete statements etc, I’ve sent everything and more as I want him to see sence and come to an agreement. The whole process takes so long and consumes everything.

@Palaver1 is this your final appointment coming up? Or is there a possibility of more that 3? I had got it in my head the most appearances I would have to go through was 3.. how was the court process for you? I have my first appointment soon. Was yours a video call or a phone call? I have no information to help you sorry as I’m at a different stage. Sending you good luck with everything

[Merryterry]

@AustinRd that’s good advice Thankyou, you’re so right, he doesn’t matter and I’ll concentrate on myself and my needs for the future. Ill try to be calm before hand and stay calm throughout. It’s so hard when I know the truth and just hope I can make myself believed. I’ve got so much evidence behind me. Do you know how he would communicate with his McKenzie friend if they aren’t in the same room? Can they silence the mic to me and the judge so they can speak privately? X

[AustinRd]

@Merryterry I don’t know but in my CAO hearing I “spoke” with my barrister via WhatsApp. To be honest it was more her checking in with me as she needed to concentrate so very minimal contact in reality and that was a hearing which Cafcass also attended.
Stick to the fact, focus on the issues and evidence as they relate to your/children’s needs. You can’t know what he will do you have to react and that’s the scary out of control part that none of us like but you sound very prepared and organised so trust in yourself. Above all be kind to yourself you are amazing!

[Chumpnomore]

@goldwrapped its so frustrating when you know you have done everything by the book but the lies and deceit comes so easily to these men.
I am with you when you say , is it worth it as the mental damage is relentless. Not to mention the bills! My barrister is costing £3000..my solicitor says hes excellent. I wonder if he comes gold plated for that amount... 😉
FDR in three weeks. Two years after i started proceedings.

[Palaver1]

This will be the third time I am going through this.
Telephone barrister judge
Wanker as well.
For me wanker refuses to get legal support so information,not given his asked question he back tracks etc
The judge wants to make it fair sets out things that should be done..
Gives dates guidance and expects it to be followed.
Will speak firmly to whoever in my case wanker.
I can already see that wanker is not following deadlines but will make sure my lawyers follow everything up.
To the best ability.
It’s costing a lot don’t be scared though.
I’m so tired

[Merryterry]

@Palaver1 have all your appointments been done by telephone? It sounds so draining, no wonder you’re exhausted.

Can anyone give me an idea of how much each appointment costs? Do I have to pay when I’m the respondent in my case, does that make a difference to who has to pay or how much?

[Palaver1]

I have done all by telephone.
I can’t Romberg the break down but each time cost round about 2000 and something I’m using a barrister
Law firm is specialised due to my daughters needs.Yes it has cost me a lot if you have a partner who refuses to engage as well as point blank refuse to appoint any legal representatives you are stuffed

[Palaver1]

I’m sorry 3000 and something last bill was over 4000
Lots of items added all communication with wanker brought the cost up as he stalled refused to engage they were practically begging him
Vat added blah blah
It’s just a nightmare
As I said be brave

[Palaver1]

Chump
I applaud your resilience

[Chumpnomore]

Hi everyone, how are you all?
FDR in two weeks. STBX STILL has not supplied updated disclosure ahead of this date. So I still do not know what he earns or what he needs. I just cannot believe he is with holding this information.
I am worried the Judge will just tick him off for not complying with previous order to update disclosure and adjourn our FDR for another six months. Its exhausting. Would love to hear everyone's updates. It does help to know others are battling through this minefield too.

[Rammingspeed]

Heard on radio today that 80% of us going through family court proceedings are not happy with online hearings. Judges are unable to read body language, technology cutting off etc. A barrister made the suggestion that the divorcing couple would pay £5000 between them to have a judge for the day- food included.
Had my partial FDR early October over the phone. I know I heard the judge dismiss some irrelevant questions on the questionnaire ex wanted answers for. Received the amended questionnaire weeks down the line ( I have no lawyer) with the questions that I know heard the judge dismiss reinstated. His side have submitted my pension details but not his to the pensions experts. I’ve rung the pensions people to find out if they really have been instructed and the costs- I get fobbed off. Can ex make claims on my pension without disclosing his?