How to know when maintenance ends ?

[stillsane]

My son is approaching 19 soon, I'm under the belief in the UK maintenance should end when child benefit is not being claimed which is linked to whether the child is in approved education or training up to the age of 20 - not 100% sure if that's correct ?

I have a payment agreement in place with the mother outside of CMS, how can I determine when I should stop paying maintenance or in other words how can I possibly find out when child benefit is not longer being claimed or being received ? Ideally I don't want to cause ill feelings with solicitor letters.

Ultimately;
If your ex decided to downsize to a 1 bed flat at the end of August and no longer support/house your DS, would you think this was reasonable or not? If not reasonable then you should expect to keep paying something to someone.

There is a beautiful irony coming to Mumsnet, even the Dadsnet part of which isn’t dads in the main, getting women to do the work of trying to cut off finances to a woman. When she’s obviously done most of the work raising his child. <chefs kiss>

If you want to stop funding your ex’s lifestyle, tell your son to live with you full time.

I did CM through the family court, I'm the woman but when I got a job in the USA that meant I was earning 5 figures a month my son decided he wanted to finish his education in the UK. I paid my ex until my son hit 17 then I paid my son directly. What he took as room and board if anything from my ex is between them. The only stipulation was it couldn't be more than 10% of what I was giving.
At 17 my son was in full time education and was at an age where he didn't want to ask his dad for money off he went out etc. That continued until he turned 23 and left uni

I'm not in control of what my ex decides to do, also I wouldn't offer any advice, it's not my place to do so. I don't see how it's my responsibility to ensure my ex is comfortable and can afford her expenses, firstly it's non of my business, secondly it's very unlikely a downsize would even be considered, certainly not from a 4 bed to a 1 bed flat - zero chance.

CM will likely end this year, I'll arange something with my son as direct payment to his account, what he decides to do with it is his business.

Still sensible to make it clear to your ex that it will be ending so she and your DS have warning.

If he’s leaving college - whether to take up an apprenticeship or not - you can choose to continue supporting him if you like but it would be perfectly reasonable to tell your ex that you will now be paying the “child” maintenance to your son directly.

When my kids went to uni at 18/19, their dad paid the limited amount he contributed, to them directly. Perfectly normal.

But a fair bit of those expenses are to feed and house your joint child. I don't see why you see paying child maintenance as funding her lifestyle. Your son doesn't live in a tent and survive on fresh air. If you're paying over 1000 a month you'll be earning 100k plus I think. What would you consider an acceptable amount to conteibute to his upkeep (regardless of his mother's circumstances?

I think you have been given a pretty hard time by some people on here. You have paid cm as required so your ex could support your son. I would just chat with your ex and your son separately, find out what your sons future plans are You may find that your ex is expecting you to stop funding her.

If we are talking upkeep as in 50% of his food and clothing, remember the other parent should be contributing then I'd say 500 to 600 per month, meaning a total of about 1000.

3 meals a day at 5 pounds per meal, 15 per day, 450 a month, simple math, the rest for everyting else such as clothes etc.

Teens cost more than food and clothes though ....

There’s a lot of unknowns here so hard to offer advice, but I would not be paying CM anymore at all, however….

Mum needs to communicate what she expects from DC. Does he need to give her money toward his food/accomodation or is she willing to support him with that whilst he completes his apprenticeship? Maybe she agrees to that, but you then cover his other bills?

As the paying parent, I would be helping my DC financially through the apprenticeship if I was able, but again, however…..

He must have some form of contract? Or who is providing this course? You can look up what it entails yourself if there’s no documentation to view.

Is the apprenticeship full or part time? If part time, they need to get a part time job too. I would look to top up what he needs after that.

You need to look at his necessary expenses (phone/car/clothes/food etc) and offer to help cover some/all of that depending on what he needs so he can remain on the course, but not so he ends up not valuing the support or just expects it with no gratitude.

If mum wants starts demanding from DC what you’re no longer paying, can DC come and live with you?

DC is an adult now, so it’s down to you/his mum how you each support him completing this apprenticeship, but you shouldn’t be paying his mum directly anymore to do that. DC needs to start learning about income/expenditure and how to manage that himself.

What on earth are you talking about?

For high earners the CMS calculator can result in very high amounts of ££££.

For a PP income tax still has to be paid on the full gross wage. This has a very significant impact on the PP's net wage after paying CS.

For the RP the payment is tax-free.

It is absolutely realistic that a high earning PP pays enough CS to cover the child's entire monthly costs.

As an aside, there was a post recently about how much is a fair amount to charge in rent and board to an adult child. The OP on this particular thread suggested £500 and was flamed for "making a profit from their child" since actual costs tend to be nowhere near this amount. You can't make it up 🙄

As an aside, there was a post recently about how much is a fair amount to charge in rent and board to an adult child. The OP on this particular thread suggested £500 and was flamed for "making a profit from their child" since actual costs tend to be nowhere near this amount. You can't make it up

My DC cost me more when they were children than they do now they are young adults though. They pay rent/board to me which covers them living here and having meals. I also buy toiletries as part of the grocery shop. But they now buy their own clothes, pay their own phone bills, pay for cinema and leisure themselves. Bus fares and so on.

You don’t need a solicitor letter, you just need to say that you’ll stop paying at 19 unless she’s still getting child benefit- please show you if she is

You just need to ask for eveidence, if she won’t give it, stop paying and then she’ll go via the child maintenance service and they’ll use child benefit to decide. That’s the way to find out it’s a lot cheaper than a lawyer.

How about the other stuff? The cost of providing a home, travel, going out with friends, cinema, college supplies, field trips, phone contract, gym membership/sports clubs, etc? It sound like you pretty much pay what CMS say but you feel that's unfair. Do you have your ds to stay at all?

I think the maximum is about £1200 no matter how high the salary is. For someone earning 6 figures that’s not much to provide for a child who’s not with you much at all and needs to be housed, fed, clothed and taken care of night and day as well as all the sports and social lives and trips that teens like (or 2k a month nursery fees).
it also does go down slightly for those earning higher rate tax band (from 12% of salary to 9% over the higher tax bit).

Why would you use a solicitor when you can just use CMS?

So so much more. It's almost like OP has never had to think about that...

The question I was asked was what's my idea of a fair amount, the budget I detailed was around £1,000 per month for food leaving approx £500 per month for other stuff, 50% contribution from each parent. No DC requires new shoes, clothes, coats every week. Phone contracts are IMO a needless expense, you can buy a phone and SIM for loads less. I keep having to say I'm not responsible for my ex's housing situation, you think I should be paying to house my ex as well ?

Of course if we were a family unit then it would be way easier but bear in mind we're running two house holds on one salary and some benefits, to pretend this has no effect and budgeting isn't required then you're not living in the real world.
When I was growing up having a parent stuffing bank accounts with 100's of £ was unheard of, seems these days you must provide everything and anything, the concept of 'sorry can't afford that' causes some sort of social shock.

You kind of do have to house your ex as well.... or at least contribute. Seen as your son couldn't live on his own as a child. Now he could live on his own he is likely to need much more than 1k a month. Again, does your son stay with you at all? Why don't you offer that as an alternative and then pay for everything?

How is your relationship with Ex- wife? I ask because you seem to want to do right by your son, and so rather than ask internet (and get a lot of abuse 🤯), speak to her if you can.

Explain that now your son is >18yrs and in paid traineeship/ apprenticeship that you are looking to see how best to support. It would make sense that you pay him money direct, he can then pay digs/board as required to his mum(or not and use the money to move out and rent on his own). I would suggest to give ample notice to keep relationship good.

He stops on occasion, not regular, totally disagree with having to house my ex, we are divorced, assets were split. Whether there's a child or not she would still have to have a house and pay all the bills.
We're talking hypothetical scenarios, currently he's completing his college course and I'm still paying CM. Sure if he wants to live away from home he'll need bucket loads of cash, I don't believe that'll be what's happening but who knows, that's the future which isn't written yet.

There's no issue contacting the ex, we're on good terms, she already knows CM stops when CB stops, what I don't know is when CB actually stops which is dependant on what my son decides to do and me seemilingly having to do some detective work. What I don't want is my son shoved somewhere that he doesn't want because there's money / life style linked to it.
I've many months before any of this will be an issue, like more than 6 months, hopefully we can reach some amicable solution.