How to know when maintenance ends ?

[stillsane]

My son is approaching 19 soon, I'm under the belief in the UK maintenance should end when child benefit is not being claimed which is linked to whether the child is in approved education or training up to the age of 20 - not 100% sure if that's correct ?

I have a payment agreement in place with the mother outside of CMS, how can I determine when I should stop paying maintenance or in other words how can I possibly find out when child benefit is not longer being claimed or being received ? Ideally I don't want to cause ill feelings with solicitor letters.

Don't you know if your child is in full time education?

Are you planning to end payments in line with them CMS stops being paid? I think it’s aged 16, or 20 if in full time education - the august of both years I think from memory.

Or are you going to keep contributing to your son directly? Sadly he wont become free at any age! A solicitors letter seems like a huge jump.

How do you not know if your own child is in training / education / what his plans are

If your child is at university you might choose to continue supporting them past the technical cut off age?

This. It's a bit odd that you don't know what your child is doing as regards to education/training.

My DH is in a similar position to you. DSS is now 19 and has left full time non-advanced education and has a FT job, so there is no longer any obligation to pay CM to his mum. DH will continue to subsidise DSS with a reducing amount/one-offs to get him on his feet and until he’s 21 and his wage increases.

It will be up to DSS and his mum to agree what board and lodging he will pay her. We won’t need him to pay any when he’s at ours.

It would be different if he was at university.

I don’t think he doesn’t know what his son is doing, just that he doesn’t know what effect that has on eligibility for CB and CM.

Saying “does this mean you’re now not in full-time non-advanced education so I can now support you directly, not your mum” may be opening a can of worms, so he wants to understand the facts before doing so.

Can you tell us what course he is doing OP? We might be of more help if we know that

Usually when entitlement to CB ends- this can be up until young person leaves FTE/training. Hopefully you will continue to provide support though, albeit directly to your child.

Yes I know what my son is doing, I don't know if it's a 'approved' education, I'm only assuming, his college course ends this year, he's talked about going into an apprenticeship after that, I have no idea if that'll be a government recognized apprenticeship or not, I assume on the job training / junior xyz may not be an official apprenticeship ?

As mentioned I'm currently not using CMS, my payments are in line with using the child maintenance calculator.

Plans are one thing, what he ends up doing may be something totally different.

Trying to put this politely and diplomatically as possible - when large sums of money are on the line with a private / outside of CMS agreement where's the incentive to be truthful ?
Am I supposed to just keep paying with no evidence / proof of what my son is actually doing or whether it's a approved education / apprenticeship ?

Just stop paying. If your ex wife wants you to continue to pay then ask her to evidence that she is still receiving child benefit and you will reinstate the payments.

How about you speak to him🙄

@stillsane yes? You had a child, not an 18 year lease. The support you should offer your child shouldn’t just end on a random date, you’ve got them for life.

Do you genuinely think your son and ex would lie to you to get payments for longer? Surely your relationship with your son is better than that, if you’re an active part of his life wouldn’t you be able to pick up quite quickly if he is lying?

The line between approved apprenticeship / any apprenticeship surely is blurred for your child, if he’s off doing his best to learn and get a job you’d think it would be worth contributing regardless of if the course is “approved”.

This. Mothers have to support them financially until they’ve graduated and found work. Why are fathers absolved of responsibility two years early?

^^ Exactly...

Ask for proof of child benefit being paid? If his mother is still supporting him throuhgh his apprenticeship, then i do think you should too. Regardless of CB. As you would if he were living with you

Once your son is no longer in Education you should stop paying child support to the other parent.

At that point, it's up to you if you continue to support him directly but by that point, you would normally expect your grown up child to be working full time and not need financial support.

Wouldn’t it be about WHO is getting the money? DC directly or their mother. I would have thought that for any child over 18 or when they finish college that’s when they should start to get the money directly instead of it going to a parent. If the parents are still together they start to give the child their contribution direct at that age.

If his course ends this year then you pay up until September.

If he starts an apprenticeship he will be most likely on the appalling standard low pay on which case you need to ask him how much he earns and pays in board. I think it would be reasonable to carry on paying some maintenance either directly to him (to enable him to pay board) or directly to your ex.

One of mine was paid the living wage of a 21 year old as an apprenticeship at 18 so she could afford to pay board, save up and has a life.

Indeed I have no problem directly financially supporting my son but paying my ex large sums of money supporting her life style with her new fella with no clear end in sight is draining on so many levels.

I think apprenticeships are classed as work. This seems fairly clear? https://www.gov.uk/child-maintenance-service/when-child-maintenance-stops

I would suggest you make it clear that any support past Aug is to your dc only and that will depend on his needs at the time and will be on an adult hoc basis.

I believe apprenticeships are classed as work, my child benefit stopped when my daughter left school and went into one at 16. Absolutely fair enough she was earning in the region of £950 a month … at 16. She finished with a level 3 and went into FT employment on a full wage at 18. So i believe once college is finished and if enters an apprenticeship you can choose to support him directly as required rather than your ex.

How on earth any paying parent is supposed to figure all that out seems impossible, obviously I don't want to end up battling through switching payments directly to my son and the mother claiming that I've not been paying maintenance.

What I 'should do' vs 'what I legally have to do' are two different things, I'm looking first of all trying to establish what I legally have to do then taking it from there.
There should be some way of the father gaining visibility of CB, I wonder if a solicitor could do this without involving the mother ?

I was the person getting child maintenance, so can explain how we worked it - 2 children.

When my daughter left school and went to uni, her dad stopped paying me maintenance for her. He paid the amount for 1 child to me, and the difference to DD whilst in first year. He dropped the amount down from by 1/3 for the second year of uni.

DS left school and got a job when he was 17, child benefit stopped. He continued to pay the maintenance until he was 18, which he didnt need to do so I was very grateful. He was initially part time on min wage for his age £7.55 an hour. He was farming, so physical job and I was glad I didnt need to ask him for board and lodgings.

This meant that DS was able to save his money, and he has got another job that is full time and good pay for his age. He has saved £11k for a car/lessons.

Ex reminded me a few months before that maintenance would stop when DS turned 18. I am in the middle of retraining, so DS is paying board and lodgings since he hit 18 as I cant afford my outgoings without this.

DS happily agreed to board and lodgings, and when finish the training in a few months the amount will reduce.

There's a huge difference in ex and my income. I have had the responsibility for raising the children and due to challenges have had to limit hours at work etc. So I was grateful for the extra support- generally we do not get on.