The awful incident in Cavan

[hollyisalovelyname]

My thoughts are with the relatives and friends of those who died.
Just awful.
May they find some consolation somewhere.

I don't understand, they are all to be buried together? What the murderer and victims together as one happy family? Am I reading this wrong?

Some of you might like to read this piece about how the mum is forgotten in it all.[ www.linneadunne.com/2016/08/31/rest-in-peace-invisible-woman/ ]

Yes all five buried together I presume their surviving families wanted that.

How would the surviving families know what they want? It is so recent and raw.

And I bet, even if her family privately thought they didn't want him anywhere near, how could they say it to his family, who have lost just as much but with the added guilt. These are likely middle age/elderly couples who have interacted for years, been at all the special occasions, maybe knew each other beyond that, maybe had respect and liking for each other. How could you put your foot down so quickly in the face of all that.

perhaps in years to come there will be regret. But it's today's decision and causing each other the least upset, keeping their dignity, and not fuelling 'Talk' will probably seem like the right thing to do

I agree 7Days I doubt any family member right now has the energy or mental function to "argue" about family burial plots. The path of least resistance is likely the easiest

The coverage of this has just been making me sick. I have only seen one small piece in the Independent by a consultant psychiatrist that in some way called it for what it is, and talked about the danger of trying to pin the blame on mental health issues. I know it's because as pp said my eyes have been opened by being on Mumsnet for so long but it is so unbearably hard to read all about him being cast as a victim somehow. I can't even put it in to words. My heart is breaking for Clodagh and her boys.

Thank you all for your kind words. It affects us all (me, my sisters - I actually have two but one was adopted before we were born) every time something like this happens. I have read the original police reports and the coroners verdicts but the hardest thing to read was my own police statement aged 6.

Sometimes I hate him (my dad), sometimes I feel pity but mostly I just wonder, as a parent, how the fuck he thought it was ok to leave two kids with no parents. Maybe this guy thought it was better for them all to die than leave the kids with no parents but I cannot in any way imagine how any parent could think like that.

I cherish my own children. I cherish my nieces and nephews and my impending great nephew (just a few weeks to go) and I am happy. But I resent the life I didn't have, the childhood without my siblings (adopted separately) and the fact that I have no answers.

My thoughts are with the extended families of all those concerned in this case. It's not something you ever truly recover from and no-one should have to bury their own child, never mind their grandchildren. It's about as heartbreaking as you can get.

Mycats

Oh MyCats ....

Mycats

You are all right about the burial, the living have to find a way to make sense and carry on living as the remaining parts of the family. Right now they must all be in shock. It just gave me a start that they would all be buried as a family but how on earth would they sort it out otherwise? Those poor families and the times they will have to live through.

I am fine, honestly. I just wanted to post from my point of view and from my experience. I don't think anyone can truly understand the impact it has on the whole family.

My parents were cremated and their ashes scattered together. They have a plaque together too. I have no idea whose decision this was. I have no idea who organised it or if my mum's family was at the funeral. I don't know where I was but I wasn't there.

I guess the families involved here are just in total shock and don't want to upset each other any more than they already are. Clodagh's family having a go at his family won't help anyone, it wasn't their fault. I suspect that this is the route of least aggression and the least harm to a family who probably already feel horrendous guilt and loss and pain.

FWIW my dad had mental health issues, PTSD and depression. Ironically both me and my youngest sister both have complex PTSD from what we've gone through and depression (surprise!!) but maybe the attitude to mental health issues have changed since then or maybe we are just stronger than he was or just better parents? I don't know. But I can't solely blame his condition for what he did. Because it was him that did it.

To me that's like victim blaming. Ultimately the fault lies with the perpetrator but my heart does go out to this man's family who must be utterly grief stricken and feel so ashamed at their son's actions.

It's just so shocking. I was on the meath cavan border on Tuesday. The place was stunned . All said how nice he was but in the same breath how wrong they were .
I wonder did she threaten to leavehim the poor woman - I think he was a calculating monster who felt more for his neighbours than he did his own family . Fgs he should not be given the same funeral as the victims ( I do understand tho their families must be in complete shock and disarray )
He was a lunatic . Those poor poor little boys .

MyCats
there are not enough words. I'm a hard-hearted bitch but your post really made me feel for you.

This all happened Sunday night/Monday morning.

How on earth can anyone know the full facts of what happened and full details of the deaths already. There is no way the coroners report will have been finalised.

I live and work in the area but don't know the family. But I hear there was MH problems in the wife's family and a number of suicides. It's also said that he also had MH issues. I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be a suicide pact.

At only 3 to 4 days in - I wouldn't be jumping in there with putting the full blaim on one person and calling "domestic violence". This is also the view of local people that did know the family too.

How on earth can anyone know the full facts of what happened and full details of the deaths already. There is no way the coroners report will have been finalised

And yet you go on to speculate about a suicide pact, when there is no suggestion whatsoever that this was the case.

One crazy person is bad enough, but you suggest there were two of them? every family has Mh problems and suicides - jeez that doesn't mean to say she'd be well up for a family annihilation.

It could be so. But vanishingly unlikely

I don't think knives & a hatchet Would be used in a suicide pact.

This is more like a punishment type frenzied attack .

Not every family has suicides 7days. What a strange thing to say. I agree that most families have MH issues of some sort.

Agree it doesn't sound like a pact. Have they absolutely ruled out an intruder?

Mycats - so sorry to hear your story. You sound lovely and incredibly brave 💐

Many families have had members commit suicide, then. Is that better.

Man butchers his family.
Society tries every other fucking explanation, bar the "What a murderous man" theory.
Fuck's sake.

I don't think it's that quicklydecides - it's that there are no surviving eye witnesses so no one knows for sure what actually happened. I also think that because the man in question was a well liked and respected member of the community the suggestion that he butchered his wife and kids in cold blood seems so abhorrent that human nature is to look for reasons/excuses. If he were a fringe of society "low life" the reaction may have been different 😔

Don't you think forensics have a good idea what happened? I'm sure they do. I'm sure there's v little doubt as to what exactly happened.

And I don't buy the the man in question was a well liked and respected member of the community the suggestion that he butchered his wife and kids in cold blood seems so abhorrent that human nature is to look for reasons/excuses That's just a 'make it ok cos he's a man excuse'. It's just a way of avoiding the reality and acceptance of violence against women. As a comparison, I don't hear much 'she is so nice, she must have been v distressed to terminate her pregnancy'.
And no, I don't agree that if he were a 'low life' the response would be different.

It's all so horrifically tragic for those families left. My thoughts are with them. And their friends/schoolmates etc.

Mycats . A hundred thoughts flew through my mind as i read your posts. Brave, resilient, regret for your changed childhood, loss of a mother etc etc. I hate the overused phrase but this time it's true: respect.

I think the eldest son's last text message shortly before he die is so sad.

Mycats X

Heard on the news today there was a second note found inside.
I wonder will details be released ?