The unvaccinated

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I am genuinely worried about unvaccinated people.

I live in a large northern city. In my naice area 93% of people aged 12+ have have had the first dose of vaccine, 86% the second dose and 74% on boosters.

The areas where there is the least vaccine uptake in my city, is in poorer area's where 33% have the vaccine, these are areas where overall health is poor, education is poor and general outcomes are poor. Despite covid.

I don’t want to start a class war with covid, but it’s really getting hard to ignore that we need to find a way to stop conspiracy theories on Facebook and the like actually targeting people who might not be educated enough to understand what they are reading/seeing.

I say all of this and being gentle.

[quote Nothingventurednothinggained]@Tableto
This is why I specifically said against the Omicron variant. Researchers found two doses only offered between 0 and 20% protection against Omicron.[/quote]
Yes you specifically selected omicron to try and push your agenda that vaccines are pointless, wilfully leaving out that they have saved many Iives. Can't imagine why you'd do that.

Zuckerberg is a dangerous individual.

I didn’t say they were pointless altogether though, did I?
I’m fully vaccinated by the way!
The OP is worried about unvaccinated people and I don’t think she should waste her time worrying!

MarbleQueen what has that got to do with trial numbers? I can see it’s about pericarditis, which we know already is a risk? What is the big revelation?

From Dose 1 through the March 13, 2021 data cutoff date, there were a total of 38 deaths, 21 in the COMIRNATY group and 17 in the placebo group. None of the deaths were considered related to vaccination

It’s got everything to do with trial numbers. It is quite obvious that more people died in the group that took the vaccines than those who took the placebo.

@MarbleQueen there you go again, cherry picking. You said only 4% elderly were in the trial. Nowhere on that page does it say anything about demographics of participants, so it’s irrelevant to your point that I was challenging.

Secondly, you are comparing TINY numbers to each other and trying to claim causation and a significant finding. 21 to 17? Jesus!

Thirdly, it says NONE were found to be related to vaccination, in other words they cannot conclude that, even though you seem to be and yet they are the ‘experts’

Pericarditis is way more common after natural infections.

Your argument is very flawed.

I live in a shared house and it's a running joke at the moment that the two of us who are double vaxxed and boosted both currently have covid (proved by tests) and are self isolating in their rooms whilst the two who are not vacced at all have not caught it - despite living in the same house as them.

YABVVVU

MarbleQueen and they didn’t die, in perfectly normal every day numbers by the way, because they were old? And old people die quite often? 🤔 Nah it had to be the vaccine. Right

I don’t know why they died. Nobody seems to know. But I do know people with serious health issues were excluded from the trial.

You’ve probably not looked at Pfizer’s exclusion protolcol that excluded anyone who was at high risk of covid, anyone with autoimmune issues or diabetes or liver or kidney problems from the trials. You get the picture.

I think you know that it’s entirely possible that an elderly person with say kidney disease who takes various medication might react differently to the vaccine than a healthy 35 year old.

I know quite a few antivaxxers, it's their choice, we can't force people into things that aren't right for them.

I say this whilst DDs best friends dad (antivaxxer) is in ICU with Covid.
It's sad, but we all have our choices to make, but we live or die by the choices we make.

I've had Covid so my immunity is way better than yours
Considering it's been found that approximately one third of people who have had covid do not have natural immunity, I wouldn't count on it.
People relying on 'natural immunity' to protect themselves have also been found to be at least twice as likely to be reinfected.

OP, you're not wrong but people don't want to hear it. They get SO invested in the narrative they've chosen. That is evident in @MarbleQueen s insistence that she is able to read and analyse data. Anyone with a basic scientific education knows she's wrong.

Covid really is a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Whether it be ignorance or vaccine inequity. But let's not hurt anyone's feelings by actually acknowledging that 🙄

Why are the pro vax anti choice people always so deeply nasty and spiteful?

This!

Someone mentioned that in some parts of the country it is mostly younger people who are not vaccinated. That makes perfect sense to me as they are the least at risk from covid too. I'm elderly and vaccinated as the risk of covid for me is obviously much, much higher than the risk of a dodgy vaccine, but the ratio changes when it comes to healthy youngsters.

Secondly, you are comparing TINY numbers to each other and trying to claim causation and a significant finding. 21 to 17? Jesus!

No, they’re not tiny. You don’t expect to see more deaths in the vax group than in the placebo. I don’t think any sensible person would have approved that until they knew for certain why it was higher in the vax group.

Look, I don’t give a shit who has it or who does not. I can’t be arsed with it. If you want to have a vaccine that resulted in more deaths in the vaccine group than in the placebo group that’s up to you. My post was to the op, Ive explained why some people don’t want it or have waited for more data.

The data is there, and not on Facebook as the op suggests. Read it or don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m simply sick of people like the op claiming those that want to wait for more information are uneducated idiots who get their info from Facebook.

I agree with you OP, and in some countries work has been done targeting those who, for one reason or another, are vaccine hesitant. And it does work.

Please ignore the unpleasant responses on this thread - the MN bitches are out in force.

People relying on 'natural immunity' to protect themselves have also been found to be at least twice as likely to be reinfected

You’d better let the government know then.

members.parliament.uk/member/134/writtenquestions?page=1#expand-1380329

Results from the SIREN study indicate that vaccination was 85% effective in healthcare workers after two doses, compared to an 84% lower risk of subsequent infection in healthcare workers with natural immunity. The COVID-19 Infection Survey concluded that although vaccines are less effective against the Delta variant compared to Alpha, vaccine-acquired protection remains at least as good as natural immunity. In both people with and without prior natural infection, vaccination provides the highest level of protection

That is evident in @MarbleQueen s insistence that she is able to read and analyse data. Anyone with a basic scientific education knows she's wrong.

I think a five year old can read the above and conclude the difference is hardly worth mentioning. If you think anything I’ve posted is wrong take it up with the appropriate authority’s. Write a letter to the government and tell them the scientists who conducted the siren study are idiots and don’t know what they’re talking about.

Post the response here please.

The data is there, and not on Facebook as the op suggests. Read it or don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m simply sick of people like the op claiming those that want to wait for more information are uneducated idiots who get their info from Facebook
But generally they are.
You've used a report
The FDA was ordered by a judge to comply with an FOI request regarding data that was used to make the decision to grant Pfizer emergency use authorisation. The report shows that within the first 90 days of the vaccine roll out there were tens of thousands of adverse reactions and over 1200 deaths
and have taken it as fact that there were 'tens of thousands of adverse reactions and over 1200 deaths'. Considering that the majority are from one country and you've failed to acknowledge that ANYONE can self report ANYTHING changes things a little, yeah?

Mr RWNJ can report a sore arm and it makes the list and you've taken that as a confirmed adverse reaction 🙄

Read the whole report next time and make sure you comprehend it before embarrassing yourself hey?

Just so you know one of the areas with the lowest vaccination rates is Kensington and Chelsea. Yes it has huge deprivation in parts but generally it is one of the most expensive areas to live in the UK with an average house price is £1.8 million.

It isn't about whether the area is 'naice'.

Should be in the covid board with all the other crap covid threads

Need a new target for all your vague discontent, free-floating anxiety and general feeling of being hard done by?
We've got the solution: The Unvaccinated!
Now you can rail against those you believe to be your inferiors without being seen as a snob or a bigot!

Most of the people I know who have chosen not to take the vaccine are middle class and/either educated to at least degree level. People exercising their Personal choice.

@FurryAntiWaxer

Facebook won't allow antivax messages and proactively delete them. Prolific posters are banned. Anti-vaxxers share information via encrypted messaging apps, not Facebook.

Not that I've noticed. There's a page local to me which began as a page highlighting local crime. Over the last year or so it's become an anti vaccination, anti mask, covid denying platform. Its author has had the account suspended I believe from what he says but Facebook don't seem inclined to ban him.

Mr RWNJ can report a sore arm and it makes the list and you've taken that as a confirmed adverse reaction 🙄

Honestly, who can be arsed. It’s the same rabid response every time anyone ever mentions any side effects, the same scripted nonsense of focusing on sore arms instead of serious events. I have never before seen people have such faith in a product that they will angrily argue with the manufacturer about their own data.

Maybe your right. Maybe those figures are people reporting ridiculous things and pretending they’re dead or severely effected when they’re not.

Maybe we need to get rid of these reporting systems then.

Most of the people I know who have chosen not to take the vaccine are middle class and/either educated to at least degree level. People exercising their Personal choice.

And might that not be because those people are the ones in your work/social circle?

Honestly, so many of you are either deliberately misunderstanding the OP's point, or you are thick!

Facebook won't allow antivax messages and proactively delete them.

Really? I've just taken a random look at the F/B page of someone I used to work with - plenty of antivax messages there.

Not being goady in any way (I am vaxxed, work for the NHS), but I know loads, and I mean loads of triple vaxxed people who are currently covid positive.
I also know a lot of unvaxxed people more than thirty - not one of them has tested positive for covid. Are they just very lucky?

I am not sure it is fear preventing people from having the vaccine. I live in an area of low vaccine uptake. Hardly anyone is wearing masks. Surely if they were genuinely fearful, they would do whatever else they can to protect themselves. I think it is more, “why should I do what you tell me?”.

Ugh. Why are the pro vax anti choice people always so deeply nasty and spiteful?

The responses from the anti vaxxers on this thread are just as bad.