Vaccines to be compulsory for front line medical staff

[bumbleymummy]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-59215282

The covid vaccine, but not the flu vaccine. Although, I suppose the door has been opened for that one now too. They’re being given until spring. I wonder if there will be a massive walk out before winter. If you thought you were going to lose your job come spring, why would you work your ass off all winter? This could majorly backfire.

Thought I was going mad for a minute there!

People are pretty confident that nurses will "cave in and get the jab" but the job is so underpaid, unappreciated and year after year they are shown that they are not valued enough. This may well be the last straw for many. I wouldnt like to predict how this goes.

Last year before any news of a vaccine nurses were told to go to work even if they didn't have PPE, part of the job, what they signed up for bla bla. This year its lose your job or do as we say.

Hopefully they leave and find a less demanding job, for the same, if not more amount of money and dont have to put up with being public property.

I mentioned this on another thread but I wonder if exemptions will ever be made for people who had significant (but not life threatening) side effects from previous doses? Will they be considered partially vaccinated by choice and just be fired/excluded alongside the anti-vaxers?

@Lostinacloud

Nope, the fact politicians, diplomats and police forces are not subject to the same vaccine mandates and vaccine passes as me undermines my confidence in the vaccine.

Actually the public tend to trust Doctors and Nurses far more than politicians. They are much more likely to look to what the Doctor or Nurse does about vaccinations. My dh has had many many patients ask him “Did you get the vaccine Doc?”

@Madwife123 that’s appalling 💐
One of the (many) reasons I left the NHS was some of its ridiculous policies. Its biggest asset is its staff but you wouldn’t know it sometimes 🤷🏼‍♀️

@EllM1979

If so many doctors, nurses and carers don't wan't it, having been on the front line, it speaks volumes about the jibby jab.

'Jibby jab'

Grow up.

@TrevorFountain

I'm so sorry about your mum, *@SleepWhenAmDead*.

I appreciate your point that the government has presided over declining and unacceptable hospital conditions, and that it is not a trustworthy government on Covid.

And I worry that we will lose NHS staff over a vaccine mandate.

But I guess I still don't understand why so many staff are not wanting to be vaccinated with any of the covid vaccines, when they have so many other vaccinations under their belts. I suppose I'm a little concerned that there's an online narrative circulating that's putting people off covid jabs specifically for troll-type purposes.

These are medically trained staff who are surely more likely to use their own experience and training to make a decision than blindly follow an online narrative?

Why would so many staff not want to be vaccinated?

@bumbleymummy I'm completely in agreement with the reply where you said that it doesn't stop the spread so having the vaccine would only protect ourselves. People are happy to vaccines that have been tried and tested for years however my thought process is could it cause fertility or even cancer in later years who knows! It was ok for us to work the whole pandemic on the front line but now we are being bullied into having a vaccine. I completely understand if it was the case of it completely stopping the spread but it doesn't. I actually have had mine but I really felt pressured into it. This is going to add to the staffing problem we already have 🥺

@containsnuts

I mentioned this on another thread but I wonder if exemptions will ever be made for people who had significant (but not life threatening) side effects from previous doses? Will they be considered partially vaccinated by choice and just be fired/excluded alongside the anti-vaxers?

I think that's medical grounds

Yes, if it's a serious reaction and a doctor agrees, but I mean the grey area situations where the side effects are technically 'mild' but maybe disruptive enough for the individual to decide not to risk further vaccines. I say this as someone still experiencing dizziness 7 months after 1st dose. It's not really a serious life threatening reaction, there's no obvious reason why it's happened, and no way to prove it's caused by the vaccine other than the timeing and temporary worsening after 2nd jab. I know there are other's like me with various ongoing issues such as tinnitus. I wonder where we'll stand in the future and whether we'll be exempt or not from mandatory vaccines. I suspect not. Hope this makes sense or maybe someone can explain it better than me

Chuckling slightly @bumbleymummy diverting from her usual tactic of downplaying effectiveness of all known vaccines for the purposes of this thread and trying to claim that there isn't a rationale for requring HCPs to be immunised against coronavirus.

The Hep B vaccine isn't actually that great, and it's still mandated.

~10% of the general population are non-responders with no detectable antibodies after a full course of immunisation. I'm one of them - perfectly good immune system but for some reason no response to it.

So from my point of view, I had to have a useless vaccine with all the risks and none of the protection. However, as a policy it makes complete sense to have this as a necessary vaccine for HCPs hence why it is a requirement for certain roles.

[quote bumbleymummy]@Mrbob Because there’s a difference in mandating a vaccine that you have to have once/twice in your entire medical career and that actually prevents you from contracting the virus and having to have vaccine boosters every 6-12 months. Particularly when the vaccine doesn’t necessarily prevent you from contracting/transmitting the virus and is more about reducing your own individual risk of serious illness/death. The annual flu vaccine is not mandatory. Flu vaccine uptake in hcps has ranged from 63 -75% in recent years:

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/894751/Seasonal_influenza_vaccine_uptake_in_healthcare_workers__HCWs__in_Englan....pdf[/quote]
In response to all of this ^^

How are they any worse than someone who has been vaccinated but may still have the virus?

Why is it necessary when it doesn’t stop you from contracting/spreading the virus?

But people can have two vaccines and still have covid too.

The point is, if someone is infected, they are just as much risk to their patient regardless of their vaccine status

Why do you continue to make these statements when dozens of posters have explained the issues with them, and why they are (at best) disengenous?

You ignore all evidence that has been provided to you that demonstrates

• vaccinated people are significantly less likely to be infected than those who are unvaccinated
• in people with a previous infection, people who are vaccinated are significantly less likely to be reinfected
• in vaccinated people with breakthrough infection, there is evidence to demonstrate they have a lower viral load and are infectious for a shorter time period

These points, which have been proven in multiple studies (all of which have been linked to you on the many many others threads you make the same claims on) form the basis as to why it would be beneficial for HCPs with direct patient contact to be vaccinated.