Vaccines to be compulsory for front line medical staff

[bumbleymummy]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-59215282

The covid vaccine, but not the flu vaccine. Although, I suppose the door has been opened for that one now too. They’re being given until spring. I wonder if there will be a massive walk out before winter. If you thought you were going to lose your job come spring, why would you work your ass off all winter? This could majorly backfire.

@Medstudent12

I’m a doctor. Happy to have my jab. I think it’s sensible. I know very very very few people at work not jabbed.

I don’t know a single doctor who has turned it down. I have spoken to a few healthcare assistants who were wary at the start.

So why make it mandatory then? If so few haven't had it, what impact will those few make?

Sorry, why is everyone so up in arms and determined that people should be forced to have it?
I've actually had mine, but I wouldn't judge anyone who didn't want it. I know 2 NHS staff who haven't had it yet.

@Mrbob Because there’s a difference in mandating a vaccine that you have to have once/twice in your entire medical career and that actually prevents you from contracting the virus and having to have vaccine boosters every 6-12 months. Particularly when the vaccine doesn’t necessarily prevent you from contracting/transmitting the virus and is more about reducing your own individual risk of serious illness/death. The annual flu vaccine is not mandatory. Flu vaccine uptake in hcps has ranged from 63 -75% in recent years:

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/894751/Seasonal_influenza_vaccine_uptake_in_healthcare_workers__HCWs__in_Englan....pdf

There was a thread last week by a woman who worked for the NHS who didn't want the jag, or to be forced to have it. She wasn't even in a patient facing role. O think she was maybe office staff but I can't remember. People were being horrible to her.

@notthemessiah. Totally. I've now had 3 vaccines and while I don't particularly unders HCPs who haven't had it I can see the bigger picture.

These people are prepared to have twice weekly LFTs which has surely got to help. If the govt follow thru and people leave then patients will die due to staffing.

People have already left care work due to this. Our village care home is closing due to lack of staff. It's a real crisis.

@Topseyt

What happened to the clapping?

The clapping was silly and embarrassing. As many health care workers themselves said. Decent pay rises would have been more appropriate.

Oh I agree. It was all posturing - look how much we appreciate the NHS 👏👏👏 (but we’re not prepared to pay them properly, provide suitable ppe and safe working environments and now we’re going to fire them if they don’t do what we say)

I'm just wondering how many will actually give up their job than have the vaccine?
I know a lot of people say they will quit but when it comes down to finding another job or being on universal credit I think a lot will back down and just have the vaccine.

These people are prepared to have twice weekly LFTs which has surely got to help.

If we’re trying to protect patients, this would make more sense anyway seeing as a vaccinated person may still be infected.

@NetflixCompleted

I'm just wondering how many will actually give up their job than have the vaccine? I know a lot of people say they will quit but when it comes down to finding another job or being on universal credit I think a lot will back down and just have the vaccine.

I don't. Especially office staff. The pay is shit - lots will start looking and realise that working elsewhere is better financially and jump ship. Don't blame them.

Will the private sector insist on it too I wonder?

It's a pandemic. We don't want it to continue. To reduce the effectiveness of the virus and to stop mutations, the vaccination is what we have right now. Those in key caring roles should take the vaccine, I agree it is sensible. They have a choice.....leave and do something else if you refuse.

Yes, we have other diseases such as flu' but currently flu' is not pandemic proportions. Hospitals do get overwhelmed in the winter but nevertheless, we don't have a flu' pandemic at the moment.

I honestly can't understand why anyone working in a caring/NHS profession wouldn't want to be vaccinated anyway, unless they have specific medical reasons which prevent this. I do not want to be cared for by someone who refuses the vaccination, it's irresponsible and they shouldn't be in charge of my care...

So how will they sack you if people refuse?

Is it legal?

Disgusting decision. I’ve had my jabs but I strongly believe nobody should be forced to have this (or face losing their job)
We have precious little NHS workers as it is because the pay is so shit and hours so long. Every single qualified nurse and doctor is like gold dust. We can afford any to be leaving.
There are literally empty gp’s surgeries in my area. Sitting empty in new housing developments because there are no staff to work there.
This vaccine isn’t like the others. It’s new. It’s been mass rolled out in a very short space of time. It needs boosters to keep it effective. It doesn’t stop the spread or stop you getting covid effectively.
Horrible what this world is coming to, and this is the thin end of a terrifying wedge.

I don't have a problem with vaccines but the endless boosters would piss me off as there is now talk of a 4th

Good.

@MeanderingGently

It's a pandemic. We don't want it to continue. To reduce the effectiveness of the virus and to stop mutations, the vaccination is what we have right now. Those in key caring roles should take the vaccine, I agree it is sensible. They have a choice.....leave and do something else if you refuse.

Yes, we have other diseases such as flu' but currently flu' is not pandemic proportions. Hospitals do get overwhelmed in the winter but nevertheless, we don't have a flu' pandemic at the moment.

I honestly can't understand why anyone working in a caring/NHS profession wouldn't want to be vaccinated anyway, unless they have specific medical reasons which prevent this. I do not want to be cared for by someone who refuses the vaccination, it's irresponsible and they shouldn't be in charge of my care...

You present far more harm to them than they do to you. Get a grip.

I do not want to be cared for by someone who refuses the vaccination,

Would you rather have an unvaccinated person or no person? Personally, I wouldn’t care if someone had the vaccine or not as long as there is someone available to look after me/my family. It doesn’t impact their ability to do their job. (Or none of them would have been able to work at all for 2020)

@NetflixCompleted

I'm just wondering how many will actually give up their job than have the vaccine? I know a lot of people say they will quit but when it comes down to finding another job or being on universal credit I think a lot will back down and just have the vaccine.

More than you’d think. The pay is shocking. The way we’re treated is shocking. People will see the light.

I’m a nurse, I’ve been preparing myself for this since the mandate for carers being vaccinated come in. There is no doubt in my mind that I will quit and likely soon, I’m not working Christmas and missing out on my family to be sacked in spring! Not a chance. At least 8 of my nursing colleagues have started training in other areas such as aesthetics and are looking at different career paths. I’d rather be on universal credit than forced to have a vaccine.

@Cookerhood

All front line staff have to have hepatitis B vaccination & that doesn't seem to cause a fuss.

Yes. Exactly this. I really don't get why having the Covid jab is an issue. (Nor did we give a moments thought to what is in any vaccination. That's the scientists job)

Not surprising alongside the usual yearly vaccinations they get.
I assume front line medical staff believe in Covid19.

OP there seems a lack of logic in your post.
You laud the NHS staff for putting themselves at risk during the pandemic before vaccines were available, but now want to refuse those same vaccines that would protect their lives and those of their patients!
As you work in healthcare, why are you anti vaccination? Do you not understand the science?
I’m a retired doctor, who was hospitalised with Covid pre- vaccine rollout. My immunity was very short lived - less than 6 months - and there is plenty of evidence of unvaccinated patients suffering repeat Covid infection. You cannot rely on natural immunity, you need vaccines and booster shots.
I would have to query the sanity of any hcp who wanted to work unprotected in a high risk environment.

Any NHS hand-wringers saying "i'll leave then!" is just posturing, when faced with universal credit or minimum wage, zero benefits work, they will be vaccinated.

@MrsPelligrinoPetrichor

Will the private sector insist on it too I wonder?

Its already insisted upon in private sector, even agency staff have to show their vaccine passports on arrival.

I've had my vaccines and booster. Having my flu jab today. I have said that unless they make boosters mandatory, I wont be having anymore. I got more side effects each vaccine I had, my booster gave me a 2 day migraine and as a lone parent made it so hard to care for my 3 young children. I'm not doing it again unless absolutely necessary.

I do t think people will actually l
Resign from a good career over it. When it comes to the crunch.

Obviously if people would rather give up their jobs or get redeployed to non-patient contact roles than get vaccinated then that won't help staffing shortages.

But equally there are currently short-term staffing shortages that cannot be planned for due to unvaccinated staff still having to do 10 day isolations if they are a close contact, even if they don't test positive, whereas vaccinated staff don't have to isolate.

Also triple vaccinated staff are 95% protected against even testing positive, so logically unvaccinated staff are many times more likely to test positive have to self-isolate for 10 days with Covid.

So there are significant staffing shortages (that cause short term disruption because they can't be planned for, unlike a vacancy) caused by staff not being vaccinated against Covid.

The staff shortages are not just going to be caused by staff having to leave/be redeployed to back office. They also exist inherently in having unvaccinated staff on the rota/payroll.