Massive family fallouts over covid

[mywombisfittoburst]

My DM and step father went a bit crazy over Covid last year. Very very OTT, very judgey about anyone "breaking the rules" and both live in fear of catching it, seemingly convinced that if they do they will die.

DS is 14 and doesn't want to be vaccinated. I respect his decision. My DM is going crackers about it. Calling me up, ranting at me that I need to change his mind, trying to emotionally blackmail him - eg "what if he gives to me or DGP and one of us dies" "doesn't he care" "he won't be able to come for Xmas" and so on.

We're basically being made to feel like shit about this and I don't know how to deal with it

I would respect my 14yo's decision not to get the jab if that's what he chose, but I'd be pretty disappointed in him. Just like I'm disappointed in my adult friends who won't get it.

@GummyBearWhere

Maybe he needs to learn that him getting vaccinated will protect OTHERS and he should stop being selfish and think only of himself. So what if he thinks he’ll be fine if he gets covid, good for him. But passing covid on to someone immune compromised, or elderly double vaccinated could kill them, but sure tell him as long as he’s happy doing whatever he wants it doesn’t matter that he could have stopped someone else getting sick or dying, that’s all fine.

He’s selfish, the vaccine is not just about me me me me me and what I want, it’s to protect everyone.

He doesn’t owe you, or any one else on this planet his body. HTH.

@GummyBearWhere

Maybe he needs to learn that him getting vaccinated will protect OTHERS and he should stop being selfish and think only of himself. So what if he thinks he’ll be fine if he gets covid, good for him. But passing covid on to someone immune compromised, or elderly double vaccinated could kill them, but sure tell him as long as he’s happy doing whatever he wants it doesn’t matter that he could have stopped someone else getting sick or dying, that’s all fine.

He’s selfish, the vaccine is not just about me me me me me and what I want, it’s to protect everyone.

Forcing children to have a procedure that has no long term safety data and has a remote possiblilty to kill or maim them just to make you feel safer is the ulimate selfish viewpoint.

Remember the first use on a human of these new vaccines was 15 months ago. There is no long term safety data at all and there is no full license to use it on humans, just an emergency exemption.

You should be utterly ashamed.

@TheNoonBell agree. It’s astonishing the number of people calling others selfish, whilst expressing the most supremely selfish and entitled viewpoints.

Some kids do get COVID badly though and end up in hospital. As a mother, I'd be pretty devastated if my kid ended up seriously ill or with long covid because I didn't encourage them to get vaccinated.

They are saying that the unvaccinated will most likely catch COVID every 16 months because natural immunity doesn't last that long.

I think people are underestimating how dangerous this illness is and how severe the long-term effects can be even on healthy young people.

Also, it's very likely that a lot of people will die this winter when the NHS becomes overwhelmed with the selfish idiots who didn't get vaccinated and end up sick in hospital. So, yes, it does make me really angry. It's your choice but it does affect everyone.

[quote Bizawit]@TheNoonBell agree. It’s astonishing the number of people calling others selfish, whilst expressing the most supremely selfish and entitled viewpoints.[/quote]
I only started using the same emotional ploy recently as it is always thrown around by the Covidians who tend to ignore data driven arguments and focus solely on their own feelings.

My favourite is still those who say you can't question the science. It's as if they have never heard of the Scientific Method which amuses me greatly.

@Werehamster

Some kids do get COVID badly though and end up in hospital. As a mother, I'd be pretty devastated if my kid ended up seriously ill or with long covid because I didn't encourage them to get vaccinated.

They are saying that the unvaccinated will most likely catch COVID every 16 months because natural immunity doesn't last that long.

I think people are underestimating how dangerous this illness is and how severe the long-term effects can be even on healthy young people.

Vanishingly few kids. See pic

@XenoBitch

Has your DS been seeing your DM anyway? If so, then how is he suddenly a danger for not being vaccinated? And if she has had bother jabs (and even booster), does she not trust them to work?

This.

Maybe he needs to learn that him getting vaccinated will protect OTHERS and he should stop being selfish and think only of himself. So what if he thinks he’ll be fine if he gets covid, good for him. But passing covid on to someone immune compromised, or elderly double vaccinated could kill them, but sure tell him as long as he’s happy doing whatever he wants it doesn’t matter that he could have stopped someone else getting sick or dying, that’s all fine

Oh bog off with the virtue signalling. I got vaccinated to protect me. As did you. Lets stop all the "I got vaccinated for the good of society" nonsense. You did not.

I can see both sides here.. your DM is overreacting but I also think your son sounds poorly informed.. at 14 he is still a minor.. I don’t remember anyone asking my personal consent to have the BCG jab at school. The science is quite clear on the vaccine and it sounds like he is not really giving much heed to it. You can’t force him so I don’t know what the answer is there but I’d he had to have another jab at school say, what would happen then?? Would he refuse? If he hasn’t had the jab I think he can’t see her if she is concerned about it. We aren’t in the UK and have vaccine passports where we are so your son would be excluded from a lot of social activities; I think your mother will have to accept they won’t see each other until he’s vaccinated.. difficult but that would be the reality where we live xo

@Derbee

I’d be more concerned about having an ignorant child if I were you

Really 🙄

Just to say aswell that where we are if you are over 12 and not vaccinated you are not permitted at school premises.. It’s a different reality we are living but I am a bit shocked he is dead set against it at such potential (yes unprobable) but such potential costs to himself and also those around. If vaccine passports were in play there would he have it? Lots of people here kicked up a fuss and refused it and then as soon as vaccine passports came in they v quickly changed their minds.. this suggests strongly that they don’t really believe it will cause serious long term issues as if you really thought that you’d refuse at all costs of freedom. I wonder what he would do then Xo

I wouldn't encourage your DS not to be vaccinated. But its up to your parents in law what they do. So prepare for them going no contact.

This has happened in my family.

My DC have wanted it as they are fed up with disruptions and we feel as covid always seem to be high levels here there was beneft to them.

DN doesn't want it and my DMum - her DGM- has resorted to emotional blackmail - going on about the 14 year old with rare heart condition who died with covid constantly implying that could be them I knw as they keep telling me quite proudly that's what they are doing- and placing restrictions on see DN then getting upset they're not seeing them.

When DPs were close contact they were incredible difficult around testing other famaily had to do postal orders and sit on them to do the tests.

We've all had flu vaccinations this year and have all had covid jabs - bar one still waiting but keen to go ahead - but yes we talk to the teenagers and explain what the issues are why we think it's in their interests for all vaccinations and would respect any no.

I've certaintly felt many older family members haven't really been thinking about what's best for our children in all this - more what they want or is best for them. I do tend to buffer anyway so kids aren't bothered by it - but has left me feeling a bit peeved.

@Werehamster They are saying that the unvaccinated will most likely catch COVID every 16 months because natural immunity doesn't last that long.

But protection from Covid jabs wanes, too. The government won’t keep providing funding for the entire population to get Covid jabs. And Covid jabs are not a one-shot solution. I’ve had both jabs but, as it stands, due to my age I won’t be eligible for a booster and evidence shows that vaccines wane at about 6 months. What’s the point of a teenager getting a jab now when 6 months down the road they’ll be back to the starting position? Particularly in the case of someone like my DS who was asymptomatic.

I’m puzzled by parents with children who’ve literally just recovered from Covid who are counting the days until they can have a vaccine. Not comparing Covid to the flu, but do we recover from the flu and within a month pester our doctor for a flu jab?? At that point, the variant of the flu we’ve just recovered from is still the variant that’s likely to be in circulation.

@sjxoxo Lots of people here kicked up a fuss and refused it and then as soon as vaccine passports came in they v quickly changed their minds.. this suggests strongly that they don’t really believe it will cause serious long term issues as if you really thought that you’d refuse at all costs of freedom. I wonder what he would do then Xo

Blackmail… Does that mean those people were willingly jabbed?? Do you agree with the coercion? Very few of us have the inner strength of Mandela.

I am horrified by the prospect of vaccine passports here - not a world I want to live in.

Even if it is a very small percentage of kids that get very sick. Let's say 0.5%, then it's still a significant number given the extremely high number of cases.

We are planning on going abroad next year to visit family, so that is a big factor in us getting vaccinated. I think increasingly those who are unvaccinated will find themselves disadvantaged in more ways beyond just catching COVID.

@berlinbabylon

Maybe he needs to learn that him getting vaccinated will protect OTHERS and he should stop being selfish and think only of himself. So what if he thinks he’ll be fine if he gets covid, good for him. But passing covid on to someone immune compromised, or elderly double vaccinated could kill them, but sure tell him as long as he’s happy doing whatever he wants it doesn’t matter that he could have stopped someone else getting sick or dying, that’s all fine

Oh bog off with the virtue signalling. I got vaccinated to protect me. As did you. Lets stop all the "I got vaccinated for the good of society" nonsense. You did not.

Couldn't have said it better! Agree!

I got vaccinated for my benefit. The added bonus is that it hopefully means it's less likely that I can pass it on.

But ultimately it was for my protection. I'm vulnerable for covid so wanted to make sure I had the best protection I could have. But someone else telling me they vaccinated to protect me?? Na, sorry you didn't. You did it to protect yourself. Which is a totally acceptable reason to take the vaccine.

It's almost like we are scared to put ourselves first these days. It's ok to say you had the vaccine first and foremost to protect yourself.

@Beccatheboo I think it works well here. You are right that it’s a form of coercion but there is an acceptable alternative if you really are against having a vaccine- you need to be in possession of a negative test for any occasion you will require a vaccine passport. The term vaccine passport is actually misleading as you can have a valid passport without actually having a vaccine; through negative test results. So it’s not absolute coercion and you do still have a choice!
What I meant by my post is that if you felt the vaccine posed a very real health risk you would refuse it and either get your passport through negative testing, or simply not go to restaurants/cinema/gym etc. So teens could not be vaccinated, but would require negative tests in order to attend schools with a valid vaccine passport. I think the high uptake after the introduction of passports has been a great success here and I feel very confident out & about that almost everyone is vaccinated. Xo

Far more intelligent and experienced people then him have reviewed the evidence from epidemiological studies on a large population to decide it is worth the cost vs risk to inoculate children

Like the JCVI? Dartfordwarblerautumn

There's going to be a lot of lonely older people who've alienated younger family members over the past 18m by refusing to see them for prolonged periods or giving them second class treatment. The longer they drag it out, the more the relationship atrophies and the less likely that the young person will be inclined to rebuild a lost relationship.

I'm going to be the only person in my household not eligible for an NHS flu vaccine. Should I be shunned as a potential killer for my potential to spread an illness to more vulnerable people? At this point in time my DCs are too young for Covid vaccines so their consent is a non-issue, but on travelling 450 miles to see family for the first time in nearly 2 years, they were treated with substandard hospitality. I refused to leave them outside where they weren't welcome inside, and this was their annual holiday that cost €€€€. There will be a shift in family dynamic in the not-so-distant future, and if these relatives keep their attitude up it will significantly affect our desire to invest precious time and money to see them.
The irony is that in order to minimise the risk of disruption to our family holiday we had minimised exposure for 10 days before and the DCs were off school and therefore they were far lower risk than their first class vaccinated older cousins with more social contact.
But nobody thinks to check that.
And people with a high fear of Covid and disproportionate interest in others' medical decisions rarely consider other risks such as flu which are as significant as a health risk.

It is not selfish to make a medical decision that weighs up your own circumstances.
It is selfish to demand that others make health decisions to suit your perceived needs and apply pressure to them or treat them as second class.

There's going to be a lot of lonely older people who've alienated younger family members over the past 18m by refusing to see them for prolonged periods or giving them second class treatment. The longer they drag it out, the more the relationship atrophies and the less likely that the young person will be inclined to rebuild a lost relationship.

There are also a lot of dead older people. And grieving middle aged and younger people - though apparently not those who can't be bothered to shell out £14.99 for a private flu jab before visiting vulnerable family members.
Especially when in your view, flu is just as deadly as covid (it's not, but it still kills thousands of vulnerable and older people every year).

Anyone who works with or in the NHS can see already that staffing levels are through the floor, wait times are through the roof, and this winter is going to be horrific. Many people who would normally have made it through will not - either from covid or from the strain that it will put on everything else. Many will be old and frail, but many other will be much younger and with decades left in normal circumstances. The least people can do is feel sympathy for vulnerable relatives.

I think it’s more likely that there’s going to be a lot of middle aged and young people feeling like plonkers when they can’t go anywhere or do anything because they can’t get a vaccine passport. They’ll have to decide to stop being wankers, and get with the programme.