Why is not having the vaccine selfish

[chorizoTapas]

If not getting the vaccine only means you're putting yourself at risk why is it considered selfish and why are some people choosing to not be around their own family members who are unvaccinated? As most people have now had the vaccine hopefully the hospitals won't become overwhelmed... even with the few people that won't have the jab.

I am double jabbed but my brother is refusing to have his. Is he selfish? And if so why?

If you look at it on a larger scale, then we've only been able to control the pandemic the way we have here in the UK because so many people have been vaccinated. Not taking the vaccine is benefiting from something without contributing to it, and that's ultimately selfish.

And, obviously that's all been possible because the vaccine reduces transmission. The unvaccinated are the weak link in that chain as they are much more likely to catch and spread the virus.

Yes it’s very selfish, can you imagine the state the country would be in if everyone had refused it?! It reduces the risk of transmission and helps protect those who can’t be vaccinated.

Vaccines, whilst not 100% effective, help reduce infection rates.

Areas of high infection rates put vulnerable at risk (some might be less strongly protected by vaccines than non vulnerable).

In America, hospitals are filling up with the unvaccinated. Meaning less capacity and staff to provide non Covid care, i.e. cancer.

Areas of high infection are increased risk of the development of a more dangerous strain. Possibly more lethal to more and/or younger people and/or vaccine resistant.

When it comes to medical decisions, there is no such thing as being selfish.

So what if it's selfish? If you're a selfish person you're not going to care of people think you're selfish are you

@Tatum1234

Yes it’s very selfish, can you imagine the state the country would be in if everyone had refused it?! It reduces the risk of transmission and helps protect those who can’t be vaccinated.

Its not refusing its, declining. Which ever one has the right to do.

Did I want the vaccine ? No I bloody didnt but I work with vulnerable people who have not decided not to have it - yet, so for them Ive had it.

But its getting ridiculous now. People need to mind their own bloody business.

everyone **

Decided not to have it - yet**

Because the vaccinated have only 1 in 3 chance of contacting covid in the first place and therefore being infectious. This reduces spread.

The vaccinated are 90% less likely to require hospital treatment so putting less of a strain on services.

The people choosing not to have the vaccine are putting others at a risk as they are more likely to contract covid and have a 1;3 chance of being asymptomatic and still infectious. They are also giving rise the the possibility of the virus mutating into a more deadly form as this possibly occurs with each new infection.

The AZ vaccine is the same technology as our current flu vaccine and the measles mumps and rubella that are routinely given to babies. I can understand the concern with the newer type of RNA vaccines but id still have them.

@nordica

If you look at it on a larger scale, then we've only been able to control the pandemic the way we have here in the UK because so many people have been vaccinated. Not taking the vaccine is benefiting from something without contributing to it, and that's ultimately selfish.

And, obviously that's all been possible because the vaccine reduces transmission. The unvaccinated are the weak link in that chain as they are much more likely to catch and spread the virus.

yet still the biggest death toll are from older people who have been doubly vaccinated.

An 80 year old man who has been doubly vaccinated still has more chance of dying than a 30 year old unvaccinated person.

I believe that if the last 18 months have taught us anything it is that our actions effect others. We are a society not just a collection of individuals. If people thought more about protecting others and working at a cohesive group we would have had far fewer people die.

If someone goes to hospital and is on a ventilator where does that money come from? Where does the bed and doctors time come from? Who is not getting treated because you are?

If you need to claim benefits because long covid means you can’t work where does that come from? Who mends they roads and takes your rubbish away?
If the anti vaccine brigade refused treatment or societies money/help because ‘they have faith in their own immune system’ and are ‘free thinkers’ then at least they wouldn’t be hypocrites. But they don’t they are the first to complain if society them poorly despite not giving a shit about the rest of us.

@Moonface123

No it is definitely not selfish. Some people actually trust and have faith in their own immune system. The vulnerable obviously need it. There are two factors at work here, the fearful and the fearless, and in my opinion the fearful team are by far the worst for trying to shame people who don't think the same as them.

Why do you trust your immune system against Covid but not against Measles or Polio?

Because, unless you are prepared to live under strict lockdown for years, you are relying on others to do what you are refusing to.

Transmission wise, the group of people that I know that all had a positive test result all had received 2 injections and seemed to pass it on to each other with no issues.
Therefore I’m not sure I have much faith in the reports that it reduces transmission if you’ve received the injections anymore then in people who haven’t.

The fact that public health England reports show that more people who have had injections, especially both, have died with COVID then those who have had no injections does concern me a lot.

I don't think it's fair to call others selfish, particularly when delta transmission is still high amongst those who are vaccinated. I say this as someone who is double vaxxed. For those who are on the fence (for whatever reason) about getting vaccinated, name calling and belittling are not going to change their minds. I do feel that people should be encouraged to get it (to reduce the burden in hospitals), nevertheless it's a very personal decision and autonomy should be respected.

@Sugarandtime

Transmission wise, the group of people that I know that all had a positive test result all had received 2 injections and seemed to pass it on to each other with no issues. Therefore I’m not sure I have much faith in the reports that it reduces transmission if you’ve received the injections anymore then in people who haven’t.

The fact that public health England reports show that more people who have had injections, especially both, have died with COVID then those who have had no injections does concern me a lot.

Can you link to that?

@Jaxhog

Not having the vaccine is not selfish in the slightest. It's a personal, medical decision.

I refuse to tell anyone if I have or haven't had it.

This is actually worse. You are not giving someone the information they need to decide on their own risk. It's rather like refusing to tell a lover whether you have AIDS or not. You've assessed your risk, other people have the right to do the same.

They aren't owed the information. As selfish as you think that is. There is no obligation to disclose this type of information. This may well just confirm your point of view (fair enough) but it's worth pointing out that it's not an automatic right to know someone else's medical business.

Some people actually trust and have faith in their own immune system.

What, against a new virus that is likely a human modified (potential bioweapon research) leak from a lab - the Wuhan Institute of Virology?

As SARS-Cov-2 is new and potentially not a natural disease, we cannot at this still early stage fully understand possible long term effects. We do know that it can cause heart, lung, brain, kidney, and liver damage, trigger diabetes, and lead to erectile dysfunction. What we don't yet know is how many people have been and will be affected. The damage including clots aren't always showing up in conventional scans.

He has a vastly increased chance of catching it and being relatively ill, requiring nhs resources and missing work, and in turn transmitting it even to those vaccinated or who cannot be.

@Sugarandtime

Transmission wise, the group of people that I know that all had a positive test result all had received 2 injections and seemed to pass it on to each other with no issues. Therefore I’m not sure I have much faith in the reports that it reduces transmission if you’ve received the injections anymore then in people who haven’t.

The fact that public health England reports show that more people who have had injections, especially both, have died with COVID then those who have had no injections does concern me a lot.

Sugar 're your last sentence. It's not the volume that have died it's the proportion. The vaccinated population is huge so even a small.% of a huge number can be quite high?

It also reflects the fact that the vaccinated are on average more vulnerable
Vaccines are good but not a magic wand

@WeRTheOnesWeHaveBeenWaitingFor

I believe that if the last 18 months have taught us anything it is that our actions effect others. We are a society not just a collection of individuals. If people thought more about protecting others and working at a cohesive group we would have had far fewer people die. If someone goes to hospital and is on a ventilator where does that money come from? Where does the bed and doctors time come from? Who is not getting treated because you are? If you need to claim benefits because long covid means you can’t work where does that come from? Who mends they roads and takes your rubbish away? If the anti vaccine brigade refused treatment or societies money/help because ‘they have faith in their own immune system’ and are ‘free thinkers’ then at least they wouldn’t be hypocrites. But they don’t they are the first to complain if society them poorly despite not giving a shit about the rest of us.

Or we could say 'we are a society with individual thought not hive mentality.'

If some one goes in to hospital and needs a bed the money comes from the taxes that I pay - same with all the other examples I gave. Ive had BOTH vaccines but I do not begrudge anyone that hasn't had the vaccine because one day there may be a time in the future when I DONT want to take a vaccine and I should be confident in my choice of free will. And yes "free will' is a bloody great thing!

Just like all the smokers who have lung cancer treatment or alcoholics who need a liver transplant - I don't begrudge them using the NHS which my taxes pay for.

If you've had both vaccines why do you care if some one hasn't?

Because, unless you are prepared to live under strict lockdown for years, you are relying on others to do what you are refusing to

This

In addition to others points if you get covid you stand a higher chance of being very ill thereby blocking hospital beds . Unless, of course you choose to die at home ...

I've had the vaccine and this is my opinion too.

@QueenofKattegat

It isn't selfish in the slightest. Selfish is the most overused word of this entire pandemic. The amount of coercion and manipulation is disgusting.

I'm double vaccinated but agree totally with this comment.

@Bjarnum

In addition to others points if you get covid you stand a higher chance of being very ill thereby blocking hospital beds . Unless, of course you choose to die at home ...

If someone is ill, regardless of how/why, they are not blocking a hospital bed. Bed blocking is something entirely different.